People refusing the vaccine why do defensive?

[fertilitybs]

I know a few people refusing the vaccine.

Whenever it comes up in conversation they her VERY argumentative, even though I haven't started any arguments and am actually quite respectful of peoples choice to not take it.

My question is, why are those not taking the vaccine getting so weird about it? If you're going to decide not to take it you should own your decisions.

Also people not taking it appear very entitled - want their cake and eat it. Still want to go nightclubs but still don't want the vaccine.

Can't have it both ways, you're also not being forced. I have no idea why people not taking the vaccine think this?

Anyway just a rant based on a recent disagreement with a family member.

Feel free to share your experience with me!

if you're so bored by the thread why are you still commenting?

And if you really want answers to your question, read the other threads. You just want to argue. You’re clearly the bored one. 🤪

[quote Postdatedpandemic]@TheFoundations have you had any vaccines since you were 18?[/quote]
Personally yes whooping cough flu jab swine flu and covid jab the only one I reacted to was the covid jab the others barely touched me

Because they know they're letting a lot of people be "guinea pigs" to keep them safe. They know if everyone was like them and refused the vaccine, we'd be in a pretty sorry state! Because they know they are being selfish and cowardly, they just won't admit it.

How many adults have had to consent to having a vaccine?

Well, every pregnant woman, for starters. Offered the jab for whooping cough, though that isn't possible to get on its own, so you also get Diphtheria and tetanus, whether it's time for your booster or not. Also flu.

What's with all the quizzing about different vaccines? It's all very strange.

The past year or so has really shown how some people are absolutely desperate to control what others can and can't do. Quite terrifying really.

Pollypocket89

No one has yet answered about those who can't for medical reasons? Are they to be shunned as well?

That's the most pertinent question
I have asked it on a different threat but got no answers, sadly...
What are the provisions for those over 18 who can't have the vaccine???
In UK I mean

@Stroopwaffle5000

Because they know they're letting a lot of people be "guinea pigs" to keep them safe. They know if everyone was like them and refused the vaccine, we'd be in a pretty sorry state! Because they know they are being selfish and cowardly, they just won't admit it.

You have very little idea of what's actually going on in the heads of people who refuse the vaccine.

Unless they all told you this?

@Stroopwaffle5000

Because they know they're letting a lot of people be "guinea pigs" to keep them safe. They know if everyone was like them and refused the vaccine, we'd be in a pretty sorry state! Because they know they are being selfish and cowardly, they just won't admit it.

This is an awful thing to say and really does highlight the terrible attitude towards people who are unvaccinated

@Theunamedcat well done, whooping cough is an unusual one to require as an adult.
One of my DC got whooping cough, despite being jabbed and has sustained permanent damage from it. Goodness knows how bad it would have been without the jab.

Jabs give you about a quarter of the illness, so yep I was not surprised when I had a reaction to the covid jab.

The past year or so has really shown how some people are absolutely desperate to control what others can and can't do. Quite terrifying really.

Couldn't agree more. It's really brought it home to me just how easily we could become a society with similarities to, say, 1970s East Germany. So chilling.

@Postdatedpandemic None since i became an adult (i dont think) but i had all my childhood ones as did my two children so im definitely not anti vaxx just anti THIS vaxx because i dont trust it. I had the contrceptive injection im my bottom every few weeks for years too until just recently so i have no fear of needles. I cant really explain the way i feel about this vaccine but my gut feeling is that i shouldnt take it so im not going to. Of course im putting myself first, why wouldnt i, im not responsible for anyone elses decisions.

[quote fertilitybs]@xXOXOx they are approved for usage - they are not under trials[/quote]
This is incorrect... they are still undergoing trials, they have been approved on an emergency basis.

@Postdatedpandemic

I think one of the issues is that most adults have never had to consent to a vaccine for themselves before.

Eh?

No one has been abroad? Typhoid, hepatitis, etc

Even if not abroad no adult has needed a tetanus shot before?

@whatkatydid2013

People are likely defensive a lot of the time because it’s uncomfortable having others challenge your choices and we all like to believe we have made the right choice. I personally think most people who haven’t had the vaccine don’t make much sense when they explain why. Take the whole “we don’t know possible long term effects of the vaccine as it’s still in trials”. This is an entirely fair comment except that covid as a disease hasn’t existed that much longer than the vaccines have so we’ve also got rather limited information about the long term side effects of contracting it. On that basis the logical thing would seem to be to look at the risks we do know about and if they are less from the vaccine than the disease surely you then get the vaccine. Majority consensus from the scientific community thus far is the vaccine poses less risk even for fit young adults. I tend to therefore assume that if people don’t want the vaccine it’s because of some underlying risk factor they fear might mean they are more prone to issues with the vaccine than average or it’s because they feel like actively taking a smaller risk is worse than waiting and seeing if they ever actually catch covid even if statistically it may well be probable it isn’t. Of course there are some people who are just into conspiracy theories that are totally crazy and some of them likely have mental health issues but that’s not most people who are not getting vaccinated. I’m so tired of reading how selfish and horrible and stupid people are if they opt not to get vaccinated. It’s not that black and white by any stretch of the imagination and being awful to/about people has never been a strategy to help change their minds. We are busy setting up a scenario where we could end up with so many more people being resistant to having standard childhood vaccines for their kids due to the very negative associations with these tactics of strong arming people. It seems so very shortsighted.

Just to respond to one part of your post....You are correct, I don't know the long term effects of the virus or the vaccine. However - if I have the vaccine, the chances of me having had the vaccine are 100% (i.e. I will have chosen to have it). If I don't, what are the chances of me catching covid? Now I don't know the answer to that - but I do know it's less than 100%. As such, I'd summise that my risk is lower not having the vaccine than by having it. Although that argument is partly cancelled by the fantastic work of very skilled scientists who are working to ensure the vaccine is safe and has no long term effects (note I say working on - not completed) There's obviously much more too it that this and what I find frustrating is the lack of impartial data available for me to make and informed decision.

@whatkatydid2013

People are likely defensive a lot of the time because it’s uncomfortable having others challenge your choices and we all like to believe we have made the right choice. I personally think most people who haven’t had the vaccine don’t make much sense when they explain why. Take the whole “we don’t know possible long term effects of the vaccine as it’s still in trials”. This is an entirely fair comment except that covid as a disease hasn’t existed that much longer than the vaccines have so we’ve also got rather limited information about the long term side effects of contracting it. On that basis the logical thing would seem to be to look at the risks we do know about and if they are less from the vaccine than the disease surely you then get the vaccine. Majority consensus from the scientific community thus far is the vaccine poses less risk even for fit young adults. I tend to therefore assume that if people don’t want the vaccine it’s because of some underlying risk factor they fear might mean they are more prone to issues with the vaccine than average or it’s because they feel like actively taking a smaller risk is worse than waiting and seeing if they ever actually catch covid even if statistically it may well be probable it isn’t. Of course there are some people who are just into conspiracy theories that are totally crazy and some of them likely have mental health issues but that’s not most people who are not getting vaccinated. I’m so tired of reading how selfish and horrible and stupid people are if they opt not to get vaccinated. It’s not that black and white by any stretch of the imagination and being awful to/about people has never been a strategy to help change their minds. We are busy setting up a scenario where we could end up with so many more people being resistant to having standard childhood vaccines for their kids due to the very negative associations with these tactics of strong arming people. It seems so very shortsighted.

Just to respond to one part of your post....You are correct, I don't know the long term effects of the virus or the vaccine. However - if I have the vaccine, the chances of me having had the vaccine are 100% (i.e. I will have chosen to have it). If I don't, what are the chances of me catching covid? Now I don't know the answer to that - but I do know it's less than 100%. As such, I'd summise that my risk is lower not having the vaccine than by having it. Although that argument is partly cancelled by the fantastic work of very skilled scientists who are working to ensure the vaccine is safe and has no long term effects (note I say working on - not completed) There's obviously much more too it that this and what I find frustrating is the lack of impartial data available for me to make and informed decision.

what I find frustrating is the lack of impartial data available for me to make and informed decision

I wonder what percentage of people have actually looked for impartial data.

Nobody has to go to a nightclub. The owners can set their own rules as it’s their own property. No jeans, no unjabbed. If you feel so strongly about not having the vaccine then surely you won’t mind missing out?

Of course the unjabbed could cause the virus to mutate and will expect the full use of the NHS if they get sick. That’s a problem when The NHS could quickly get overwhelmed.

@fertilitybs

I believe there should be consequences to your choices - just like some countries have always not admitted people for not taking certain vaccinations for example. It's nothing new

"I believe there should be consequences to your choices"

So would you deny A&E services to anyone who injured themselves whilst drunk? Or a smoker suffering from lung cancer or someone who has health problems from being seriously overweight.

How much you choose to drink or eat or whether you smoke is a choice.

Hmm haven't read the thread but OP makes it clear why people get defensive around them!!

@TheFoundations

what I find frustrating is the lack of impartial data available for me to make and informed decision

I wonder what percentage of people have actually looked for impartial data.

Very few if the people I have spoken to are a representative sample.

@BigGaz is this the most fun you and your wife can have at 1am on a Saturday night? making a mumsnet account and repeatedly copy and pasting things onto a forum?