Is anyone NOT getting the vaccine?

[JC2021]

Anyone on here choosing not to receive the covid-19 vaccine?

I am undecided, but resistant.

My reasons; you can still become infected and spread the virus. How sick you might become would depend on your immunity, your age/health.

So, in my mind the only good the vaccine 'may' do (no guarantees) is prevent you getting very ill. Although, even this is still not guaranteed.

So the vaccine may reduce the change of you becoming really ill.

Fully vaccinated people can still spread the virus unknowingly to others, the same as unvaccinated.

Views?

[quote IHTC]@foxandbee agree that most people are having the vaccine. It's only an argument because seemingly people who have had it can't accept that others don't want it. You all resort to name calling and thinking you're above them.

You've made a choice, I respect your choice. I'm glad you've been able to get what you wanted. Why can't you respect others?[/quote]
I don't think a decision that causes other people to die is respectable.
I do believe that people have the right to reject the vaccine. But don't expect that I say "oh that's very respectable". It's not. It's ignorant, arrogant and it kills people

I bet there are very few minimum wage earners and people on zero hours contracts who don't want to take steps to prevent themselves from catching the virus

I'm self employed and earn nothing if I don't work.
i have no intention of taking any of theses injections

@MistressoftheDarkSide

So all the hype around LFTs was another bunch of smoke and mirrors? Interesting.

Was that aimed at me? Who suggested that they were 'a bunch of smoke and mirrors'?

heart n lung consultant said they’ve seen quite a few cases which they believe are vaccine related but are not being encouraged to report this

Patients report themselves directly via the Yellow Card scheme. You don't need the consultant to do it for you.It's a pretty simple process.

I don't think vaccine refusers should be made to pay! I do think international travel should be allowed now or very soon for double vaxxed and tested people. Surely a combination of these two is safe enough?

I'm young and healthy. Covid isn't a worry for me.

There a limited amount of vaccines in the whole world.

I'm not in line for the vaccine for my age, or my county or my country. I'm in line for the vaccine with the rest of the world.

Because my country is run by wealthy White males who are making money from this virus left right and centre and my government can make money from the vaccine and poorer countries can't we are being served our vaccines first.

So I'd much rather wait in line for my turn after the poorer more vulnerable citizens of the world can have there's.

There aren't enough vaccines to go around and I'm sure a mother of 3 living in a slum in India is more likely to die then I am.

So ill wait.

@RampantIvy

Those of you arguing that it is a mild illness why have we even bothered with lockdowns or screwed up the economy to try and prevent the spread?

I have no idea

[quote IHTC]@foxandbee agree that most people are having the vaccine. It's only an argument because seemingly people who have had it can't accept that others don't want it. You all resort to name calling and thinking you're above them.

You've made a choice, I respect your choice. I'm glad you've been able to get what you wanted. Why can't you respect others?[/quote]
I have no issue if someone chooses not to be vaccinated in general.

However, I do have issue if people then post inaccurate, and often totally untrue' 'facts' about the vaccine - we have seen this many times on MN, as well as social media. Sadly, these people often thing that Fred from Twitter's view is of the same scientific sounding of actual virologists and immunologists, for example, and will post such information as fact. Inaccuracies should be pulled up and should be left unopposed.

I also have an issue with those choosing not to be vaccinated then complaining that there are some consequences to their decision. If you make a decision not to be vaccinated against covid then you also have to,accept that, for now at least, you may be subject to additional restrictions in this country, and in other countries.

Vaccine? Your choice. All choices have consequences. Accept them and move in happy in your decision.

@berrylands Despite the fact you seem to think you're saintly, the vaccine doesn't stop you passing the virus on. That means you could still kill someone too.

@MareofBeasttown
I'm sick of reading people saying it's their personal choice and that making people vaccinate to be able to have a normal life is coercion, but they think it's ridiculous to be made responsible for the damage they cause.a

[quote IHTC]@berrylands Despite the fact you seem to think you're saintly, the vaccine doesn't stop you passing the virus on. That means you could still kill someone too.[/quote]
But is 50% less likely to do so, that's in top of also being less likely to catch covid in the first place as we also know vaccines reduce the chances of catching it and, then of transmitting it.

[quote IHTC]@berrylands Despite the fact you seem to think you're saintly, the vaccine doesn't stop you passing the virus on. That means you could still kill someone too.[/quote]
Yes. I've done what I can to reduce the risk by getting vaccinated. Vaccinated people cause less deaths than unvaccinated people. If you want to call that saintly, well, thank you

@Abraxan But the risk is still there is my point.

@berrylands If only my halo was as shiny as yours, eh?

@IHTC you are so determined that you are right and everyone else is wrong - or saintly .

What don't you understand about REDUCED RISK in terms of spreading the virus?

No vaccine is 100% foolproof. Most of us know that, but as a risk averse person I choose to be vaccinated (and continue to wear a mask, socially distance myself etc). All because I want more freedom for myself, and everyone else.

I suggest you google the Swiss Cheese theory.

@WildSwimming101

I'm young and healthy. Covid isn't a worry for me.

There a limited amount of vaccines in the whole world.

I'm not in line for the vaccine for my age, or my county or my country. I'm in line for the vaccine with the rest of the world.

Because my country is run by wealthy White males who are making money from this virus left right and centre and my government can make money from the vaccine and poorer countries can't we are being served our vaccines first.

So I'd much rather wait in line for my turn after the poorer more vulnerable citizens of the world can have there's.

There aren't enough vaccines to go around and I'm sure a mother of 3 living in a slum in India is more likely to die then I am.

So ill wait.

Ok, that's an argument! The pandemic won't end until most people are immune though. I think the best course of action is to get the first vaccine available as soon as possible. You refusing a vaccine right now doesn't mean that they are shipping your dose to the third world. It means it's staying in the freezer taking space and stopping a newly produced vaccine taking its place. If you want to help the third world, get the vaccine so you don't help the transmission of the virus that ultimately will cause more people in the third world and here to die, and new variants to surge. We need to stop the pandemic as fast as possible. There are ways to question the patriarchy that don't involve helping a pandemic to spread.

@RampantIvy This isn't about right and wrong. We've all made the right choice for ourselves but you seem to have an issue with those who have chosen differently to you.

Maybe you would think differently had you or someone close to you lose their life or livelihood because of these jabs. Clearly, you can't put yourself in other people's shoes so don't think too hard about it.

[quote IHTC]@RampantIvy This isn't about right and wrong. We've all made the right choice for ourselves but you seem to have an issue with those who have chosen differently to you.

Maybe you would think differently had you or someone close to you lose their life or livelihood because of these jabs. Clearly, you can't put yourself in other people's shoes so don't think too hard about it.[/quote]
This is about right and wrong. Completely.
Millions of people have died and lost their livelihoods because of covid. And many more will die and lose their livelihoods because some people refuse to believe the evidence.
Some people might die because of choosing getting vaccinated. Lots of people will die because they, and others, refuse the vaccine. How is this not about right and wrong?

@Heyhohi

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

I’m not sure how ‘informative’ one can find something that has so many blatantly untrue statements. My favourite is:

It can't stop us from spreading the virus.

It can't stop the virus from infecting us once we have it.

I mean, it can stop us from spreading the virus in about half of cases. And it can stop the virus from infecting us in the majority of cases, even with delta.

I also particularly love the suggestion that by reducing symptomatic disease the vaccines are actually increasing asymptomatic spread despite (a) evidence that vaccines reduce infection and secondary transmission and (b) even if they didn’t (but they do), the idea that avoiding death and serious illness is not actually a terrible thing.

Why do you think this person is lying to you? What else are they lying to you about?

(And while we’re at it - why did you lie to us about vaccination deaths?)

@JassyRadlett

(And while we’re at it - why did you lie to us about vaccination deaths?)

Look, I don’t have time to reply to your posts accusing me in lying about deaths - those ones stated in official gov document, I’m not an expert and rely on other professionals and official data. So I did listed the link to that figure of deaths, it’s up to anyone to read, research and make their own opinion

[quote Heyhohi]I find this article very informative for anyone who wants to find out more on vaccination
www.deconstructingconventional.com/post/18-reason-i-won-t-be-getting-a-covid-vaccine[/quote]
Every single point in that article is nonsense or irrelevant. If you want to discuss here what you find informative above that article, please do.