I understand why people are against vaccine passports but...

[User135644]

I understand why people are against vaccine passports, but a lot of those most vocal against it are the usual crowd who have been anti-lockdown and anti-mask throughout (and often anti-vaccine). They won't accept vaccine passports but will be the first to complain if and when nightclubs are forced to close again due to the impact of the virus which without vaccines would already be a lot worse with the Delta variant.

They can't always have it both ways.

They are wrong. State control of our bodies and medication is wrong. A two tier society is wrong. I’m double jagged btw

I was against vaccine passports until I'd had both jabs. Now I'm 100% for them.

I live in a country that didn’t really lock down. Shops and malls all stayed open. Restaurants with outdoor terraces could stay open with full capacity. Indoor restaurants closed briefly and then re-opened at 30% capacity. This has now increased but is not yet at 100%. Numbers of new infections have been between 20-40 each day for weeks, with deaths in single figures. The population of the country is smaller than UK, at around 20 million, but these figures are amazing. There are large parts of the country that haven’t had a new case in weeks.

Why should some people get to do exactly what they want and take no responsibility for the impact of their actions?

And ironically many who talk about not wanting the vaccine because they don't want to put that into their bodies have no problem doing illegal drugs, eating processed crap for decades or being regularly exposed to chemicals in hair dyes. And yet they are "waiting to see the long term effects" of the vaccine before deciding. 🙄

@toolatetooearly

I was against vaccine passports until I'd had both jabs. Now I'm 100% for them.

That was the plan.

Will you feel as enthusiastic when you’re required to do something you don’t want to do?

I just don't really understand the point of them. The vaccine has not stopped the rising infections so what will it actually achieve?

@TheOnlyWayisher

Also it’s not exactly like the vaccine stops you getting and spreading covid. By ditching the testing option could actually end up with more people in the nightclub with covid.

Very true- there was an event in Utrecht, NL a couple of weeks ago - to attend you had to be double jabbed or have a negative test on the day - said event has been responsible for over 1000 cases,

Questions should also be asked why the need of a specific shiny new app for travel when the world had a travel vaccine programme that was already established.

I agree there are a vocal group of covid deniers who are against all types of restrictions and mitigations and largely just think it's about govt control

But in real life most people don't hate all restrictions just some of them

Personally I don't want the direct vaccine pass port route as some people genuinely cant be vaccinated for mental or physical health reasons

I believe there ought to be say free twice weekly testing, as apparently works well in Denmark and is close to proposed for France , as an alternative

But as you say, some people would oppose everything and for them I have no time whatsoever

When everyone is vaccinated (willingly or not) if the vaccines are not stopping infections in the vulnerable what if the government then decided they should have their freedoms curtailed as they are a threat to the NHS? Let’s face it, shield the vulnerable wasn’t very well received, except this time the government will have the mechanisms in place to force it just like vaccines.

I have followed all the rules but this is a step too far. It's scary what is being accepted.

@Oysterbabe

I just don't really understand the point of them. The vaccine has not stopped the rising infections so what will it actually achieve?

This is exactly how I'm feeling now.

Yes deaths have dropped but we are in an awful mess and tangle. So many small shops and business are still saying they want customers to wear a mask - a nail studio, an independent deli because they don't want to risk getting COVID... what's next? Only being allowed in with proof of a vaccine?

I've had both my vaccines and am pro, but I'm even more so pro choice. Choice to have the vaccine or not, without a two tier society.

I'm feeling scared.

I'm generally opposed to ID cards etc and pro civil liberties, but I can't really see the problem with needing to be vaccinated aaginst a disease before you enter an area where there's an increased risk of transmission of said disease.

Can someone spell it out to me? Ideally without shouting?

I’ve had health issues since the first vaccine so am really on the fence about having the second. My clubbing days are behind me so that won’t impact me personally (although would still argue against it for others) but what’s next?

Double jabbed, stuck to the rules, still rocking my mask and think it’s a disgrace to discriminate against those choosing not to get vaccinated.

wear masks and have had my vaccine. I'm by no means a covid denier although I do question the sense of many of the restrictions and believe we now have to live with covid as we do the numerous other deadly diseases in the world.

As a human being one of your most basic rights is having choice over your own body. It’s the beginning of all kinds of moral dilemmas. I value the freedoms we have as a country and the freedom of choice. I’m safe, I’m vaccinated and if people want to make different choices that’s fine. They are not to blame for the pandemic.

Because some people can’t be vaccinated? Because bodily autonomy is a fairly basic human right? Because the state should not control medication?

They are already doing Covid passports in Switzerland, a country with absolute democracy and eg Denmark. These are socially minded forward thinking countries. There is nothing to be scared of except this virus dominating our lives and killing vulnerable people. Even France are going to do it and they are very vocal about their rights.

But the state isn't controlling medication.

Its a free choice to have the vaccine or not (I understand medical exclusions obvs), but that choice affects the safety of everyone around you, so why should you be allowed to enter a high-risk area? I mean, sure, if they were making benefits contingent on it or something Id be opposed... I guess I don't really see how going to a nightclub is a human right

Like, it's a free choice to take a driving test or not, but if you don't, you cant expect to be treated the same as someone who has a licence? Because of the safety of everyone around you

Vaccine passports are not a new thing - they are used in many countries to get/fly into. But people like to think they are hard done by and love to play the victims and talk about “ rights”.

People cannot bare people being treated differently due to vaccine status....but they don't care about people being treated differently due to being vulnerable to covid and I can assure you the second group is a lot larger than the amount of unvaccinated in the UK.
Apparently we can't keep restrictions anymore to protect a minority yet we are up in arms to protect a smaller minority who won't get the vaccine?

It isn't mandatory for to be vaccinated but in all areas of life, choices come with consequences and this will just be another of those.

Interesting (and scary!), doradoo

Was going to ask for a link but I found it: www.politico.eu/article/coronavirus-1000-people-infected-in-dutch-festival/amp/

Negative test up to 40 hours beforehand is where they reckon they went wrong, I wonder if an increased % of delta variant is a factor too.

How isn't it the state controlling medical intervention when it's them that is putting this on people?
There are lots of places that have mass gatherings not just clubs.
Churches, schools, universities, factories, weddings, funerals, train stations and more. Once something is given away it's hard to take it back. One something is introduced its easy to add more things to it.
And given this government's dealing with changing the goal posts do you really trust them to only keep it to nightclubs?

The main issue is that it's not really about going to a nightclub, it's about the impact those people have elsewhere if they are infected. Younger people don't exist in their own bubbles, they come into contact with lots of others at home, work, on the bus, at the gym etc. An unvaccinated person who has been mixing with dozens of others in close contact at a nightclub will be much more of a risk to others elsewhere.

And if exemptions are put into place chances are they will be so vague just like the mask ones.

However pre-existing laws gives us the right to not share our medical details with anyone. We have to give our consent to share even across nhs departments.
So will this mean a change in the law to give nosy fuckers the right to know?