Lisa Shaw death possibly connected to the vaccine

[Notagoodtime]

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-tyne-57267169

This is so very sad

I do understand the anxiety but I think it's a shame that some people have had a first dose and now due to stories aren't going for their second. Reactions are much more likely on your first so I don't see the logic in this and you're just lowering your immunity coverage.

People who have a certain type of illness inform themselves and research the issue themselves. When people know somebody with issues and talk about them, they find similarities. This is completely normal when it comes to health.
Nobody knows that second vaccines are less likely to react. That is simply untrue as not enough people have had second doses.
The same was said with AZ initially when it was being rolled out in the UK. When Denmark raised issues and other European countries followed suit, people said it was only being raised as an issue because it was anti Brexit. The UK finally came out and admitted to there being issues in the UK then. Its the constant drip of info and vaccine rollout at any cost that is wrong. The AZ should have been stopped when 25 other countries world wide stopped it or at least give people a choice.
The only choice appears to be AZ or nothing. Why should the people put themselves in the firing line? At the minimum hold off and slow it down for a couple of months and give people an alternative. There may well be enough people happy to take AZ anyway.
Information is the key thing and it is the very same thing that is missing.

"there is risk in everything we do" the last time i saw someone say this they got called a Covid denier. Seems that label only works one way.

Also the "you're on your own"/"we don't give a shit" and "you're making it up" attitude that's the problem too

Yeah funny how the community rhetoric disappears then.

@RachyRoo89

I don’t think that’s really the case at all. I know loads of people who have had the AZ vaccine quite uneventfully myself included. At worst they felt rough for a few days. I also happen to know one lady who suffered a blood clot after her second vaccine. Im sorry that offends you.

That’s not catastrophising, that’s just an unfortunate event. This site gets a colossal amount of hits so clearly some people will know of people who suffer adverse effects.

So we can't risk death by Covid, but we can risk death by vaccine, right?

How many deaths do you think there would be if either covid was left to spread with no controls, or if lockdown continued indefinitely? More or less than an absolutely tiny %?

@RachyRoo89

Yes I misunderstood I apologise.

@Fishandhips

Isn’t the clot risk more for younger adults though? AZ has been successful on the whole due to its protective effects of older people. This is specifically about the risk the vaccine poses to younger adults who statistically would survive a covid infection anyway.

Isn’t the clot risk more for younger adults though?

I read the average age of death from AZ clots was 46. More strokes reported in the under 45's

@Oysterbabe she did, but unfortunately her FB posts are now being shared and have gone viral with anti vax stuff which is upsetting her family and they're trying to get her FB to a memorial account to lock it all down. This isn't what they wanted, or what she would have wanted

Yes I saw that. Awful.
I found her FB quite chilling, her post about getting the jab and then about becoming increasing unwell.

[quote QueenPaw]@Oysterbabe she did, but unfortunately her FB posts are now being shared and have gone viral with anti vax stuff which is upsetting her family and they're trying to get her FB to a memorial account to lock it all down. This isn't what they wanted, or what she would have wanted [/quote]
Ohno that is sad. Why do people do this?

An American doctor talking about what the vaccine spike protein does in the body. Everyone should listen to this, especially breast-feeding Mums.

Just 10 minutes but might be a very important 10 minutes. He waffles at first but once he gets going he explains what they have found about blood clotting and the implications.

omny.fm/shows/on-point-with-alex-pierson/new-peer-reviewed-study-on-covid-19-vaccines-sugge

RachyRoo. 1% of those with Covid die. That’s a high death rate! 20-25% of adults and 8-15% of children get long Covid.

0.0001% die of a blood clot from the vaccine.

You absolutely cannot compare the two.

1% of those with covid do not die. Its estimated that the IFR is 0.3% or thereabouts

@Drawcilla

RachyRoo. 1% of those with Covid die. That’s a high death rate! 20-25% of adults and 8-15% of children get long Covid.

0.0001% die of a blood clot from the vaccine.

You absolutely cannot compare the two.

Where have you got those numbers from?

[quote Celticwaves]An American doctor talking about what the vaccine spike protein does in the body. Everyone should listen to this, especially breast-feeding Mums.

Just 10 minutes but might be a very important 10 minutes. He waffles at first but once he gets going he explains what they have found about blood clotting and the implications.

omny.fm/shows/on-point-with-alex-pierson/new-peer-reviewed-study-on-covid-19-vaccines-sugge[/quote]
He's talking about mrna vaccines in particularly so not relevant to those worried about AZ.

And just for the record, he's Canadian, not American, and he teaches at a veterinary college. He may still be right, but I'd wait until the research he talks about is published before getting too worked up about it.

@FromEden

1% of those with covid do not die. Its estimated that the IFR is 0.3% or thereabouts

That's when there's hospital capacity to save lives. Overwhelmed hospitals change that number.

So many people dismissing or downplaying serious and/or long term illness. Do they ever think how it would be to be incapacitated and unable to work? Particularly in a country with very little left of the safety net? Why did we have furlough and £500 self isolation payments? It's because benefits are so often not enough to live off. Many people with Long Covid are at risk of being unable to pay their mortgage or rent and bills - struggling to provide for their children.

@Gwenhwyfar

He is talking about the damage that the vaccine created spike proteins do in the body. He talks generally about the spike proteins in the vaccines but he then talks about the MRNA ones because they are what was tested in the studies he is referencing.

The MRNA and AZ vaccines all create spike proteins in the body but do so in different ways. The Pfizer jab is an MRNA jab anyway and millions of Brits have had that one. It creates spike proteins in the body. The AZ vaccine also most definitely tells the trillions of cells in our blood to each create spike proteins.

It is these spike proteins that numerous doctors and experts in the field of viruses are saying are causing the health problems. It does not matter whether it is Pfizer or AZ as they both create the spike proteins.

@Celticwaves

Interesting. It seems he's saying similar to what I was thinking. That the vaccines sort of give a mini dose of Covid? Although it sounds scary, we need perspective.

Those of us in countries that chose to let Covid spread have little alternative option. Covid is causing many more deaths or serious illness than vaccines. Perhaps because it's such a small exposure of the spike protein whereas Covid infection is so much greater?

Obviously the sensible thing to have done would've been the Australian, New Zealand, East Asian way but we didn't. An example of their policy of containment. Taiwan has a mini outbreak - their deaths are around 80 (in total out of a dense population). That is considered bad enough to warrant further containment measures.

If we'd all done the same we'd have the luxury of time - perhaps to wait for drug treatments as well as vaccines. Sadly we're not in that position in the UK - and the government seems set on importing any and all new strains to boot.

Our situation here in the UK means we need to do the risk benefit calculation. Vaccine issues are very very low compared to the deaths and long term illness and organ damage from actual Covid. It's safer in the UK to get vaccinated.

Shaun Lintern
@ShaunLintern
753 Covid patients in NHS hospitals today - increased rates of discharge are helping to keep numbers steady against small rises in daily admissions . But no big surges yet. In Bolton, 48 Covid patients now in hospital. 3 admissions in past 24 hrs against 7 discharges.