Shocked at how anti vax it seems to have got on here

[daisiesinmay]

Haven't been on this board for maybe a week and it seems to have some real scaremongering about AZ vaccine now. People are losing sight of the benefits I think because cases have gone down, but if they start to go up again and people are refusing vaccines then we'll have problems.
I remember when this board started up it was people all worried about the virus. Has the anxiety just transferred to the vaccine? FWIW had my AZ and no regrets

I think you’re confusing anti vaxxers with people rightly concerned about serious side effects OP. Absolutely not the same thing.

I comment frequently on the Covid threads, and work as a vaccinator ( as well as my normal day job). I would say generally, as my experience in real life, and what i see on other social media, is that the very vast majority are fed up of lockdowns, Covid etc and are taking a measured, sensible approach, researching, and asking advice. The vast majority are taking the vaccines quite happily and are so relieved and delighted to have been offered it.

My experience is that the tiny, minute, vocal minority shout the loudest!

What I find weird is how this lockdown has made everyone so physically distant (from families separated to people literally jumping into oncoming traffic to avoid walking next to someone on the pavement), but on the other hand so psychologically 'close' - to the point that people feel they can judge someone they have never met on their willingness / not willingness to have a vaccine, go to work, go to the park, get an ice cream, take a shit. It's all so fucking weird.

Mumsnet has been heavily astroturfed before about covid measures. It wouldn’t surprise me if it was being on this issue too.

That's good to hear enjoythesun

In the middle you have the rest of us trying to make the best of a bad situation and trying to figure out why the UK cut off is 30 when it's 50 in other countries. Don't confuse concerns about AZ with antivax and remember most people wary of AZ would happily take a different vaccine and are actually pro vaccination. If the blood clot risk rises as the age groups become younger then it's natural for people to be worried and it's good to talk about it.

I think that's a really good point. What worries me is that the conversation on here seems to have got into almost a hysteria over the very rare blood clots and it's as if the virus, which also can give blood clots as well as other things, doesn't factor into decisions. I'm not trying to tell people what to do of course, nor should anyone. It's just that MN surprised me.

@daisiesinmay I think it's because the latest figures have shown that the average age of those effected by clots is 47 i.e. the age group that we are currently vaccinating and it has frightened people, even if they were previously 'we're all in this together' thinkers.

Hysteria? Just because we’re asking questions?

I would suspect MN would pull bona fide anti vax posts OP. Are you suggesting the mods at @MNHQ are not doing their job?

What is astro turfed please??

Astroturfing is when a group of people with an agenda pose as normal people and post heavily with one opinion on a forum to make it look like it’s a way more common opinion than it actually is. They seek to influence opinion by sweeping others along with them.

That's interesting AppleJane is there a link? Are people saying there's more risk to 47 year old people or is that just the average when all the ages are put in and added together I wonder.

Nevertheless it's still very rare. Not criticising MNHQ I'm just saying in general terms the Coronavirus board has gone down this route

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/coronavirus-covid-19-vaccine-adverse-reactions/coronavirus-vaccine-summary-of-yellow-card-reporting

The figures are not broken down into those specifics so it's impossible to say. Hence why more people are talking about it

Thanks AppleJane It would be useful to know that. I think the government gives off quite a shifty and untrustworthy feeling which doesn't help. The thing is, it's a risk not having the vaccine of course.

I think businesses have the right to determine who is allowed on their premises due to the risk they may present to paying customers and staff. Be that drunk and disorderly, or being unvaccinated against medical advice.

It's weighing up risk vs. Benefit on an individual level I suppose.

Taking myself as an example, I've had covid, it didn't kill me. A blood clot from the AZ vaccine could well kill me.

I will still have whichever vaccine I'm offered (I'm 30s) as I know the risk is minute, but I can see where the hesitancy comes from.

Yes it is a risk. We all agree that an 80 yr old is more at risk of dying of covid than a vaccine side effect. We now all agree that 30 and under are more at risk from vaccine effects than covid. It's the bit in the middle that many are disagreeing about. Especially if you are in your 40s, healthy, no underlying medical conditions and perhaps already had covid with no ill effect. So you can see how this person is now being labelled antivax when they are not?

I’m pro vax.
I’m going to have the one that gives 100 per cent protection and 0 side effects..guaranteed.

Is this a joke?

Im 47 I was refused the Pill in the late 90s. I was told it was too risky for me
Ive never been a big fan of Whitty or Vallance but i did respect Van Tam.
Until last Monday.

@AppleJane

The risk profile only really shifts for the under 30s when there are very low levels of Covid circulating in the community. At high levels the risk of covid outweighs the risk of the vaccine in all age groups.

I find the whole "vaccine passport" thing a bit odd as, as far as I'm aware, it has always been the case that you would need to prove vaccination OR have proof of a negative test. So if you don't want to have the vaccine, you have a test? Assuming that the option of a test is available I can't see that non vaccinated people would be prevented from doing anything, they'd presumably just opt for the test.

@babbaloushka

I think businesses have the right to determine who is allowed on their premises due to the risk they may present to paying customers and staff. Be that drunk and disorderly, or being unvaccinated against medical advice.

Businesses have no business knowing your medical record.

[quote Sunshinegirl82]@AppleJane

The risk profile only really shifts for the under 30s when there are very low levels of Covid circulating in the community. At high levels the risk of covid outweighs the risk of the vaccine in all age groups.

I find the whole "vaccine passport" thing a bit odd as, as far as I'm aware, it has always been the case that you would need to prove vaccination OR have proof of a negative test. So if you don't want to have the vaccine, you have a test? Assuming that the option of a test is available I can't see that non vaccinated people would be prevented from doing anything, they'd presumably just opt for the test.[/quote]
Given that there has been several threads here now about how people have still caught Covid despite being vaccinated, I would feel safer around people who had been tested and proved to be negative, rather than someone who was assumed to be negative because they had the vaccine.

@babbaloushka Would you be happy for a devoutly religious employer or business/service provider to consider you for employment or whether or not they will provide you with their service based on whether or not you have had an abortion or whether or not you take hormonal contraception. If we go down the road of domestic medical passports this is entirely possible.

@Sunshinegirl82 I've seen some discussion doubting the official risk graphs because they are not differentiating between healthy and vulnerable people.

What are you using to define someone as anti? I'm in my 30s and had AZ a wk before they decided to offer alternatives to under 30s.

@rarat how did you feel about that? Shit timing for you.