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Original poster

Now 79 cases of AZ-related blood clots in the U.K. and 19 deaths *title edited by MNHQ at OP's request*

392 replies

Boringlynormal · 07/04/2021 15:32

How have we gone - in the past 10 days - from:

5 cases - all men
To
30 cases, 7 deaths
To
79 cases and 19 deaths, 2/3 of them are women.

What the hell is going on?!

Yes I know it’s still low compared to overall number than have had the vaccine but that’s not reassuring when they don’t seem to have had a clue about the numbers and let us all continue getting the vaccine with no warning even when Europe was sounding huge alarm bells.

I’m 12 days post AZ, mid 30s and very upset.

OP posts:
Bumblebee1980a · 07/04/2021 21:05

@Noname99

I’m not ‘young’ .... in my 40s and supposed to be having the vaccine next week. But if it’s AZ, I shall be saying no. Much rather take my chances with covid .... I have no risk factors for covid so very likely it’s going to be a mild infection for me. Mild cough/cold type symptoms vs blood clot on the brain .... easy choice as far as I’m concerned!
I did listen to a professor say this morning that you have more chance getting a bloody clot with covid than you have with the vaccine.
AzureTwist · 07/04/2021 21:06

@YoBeaches I too had to take medication only in pregnancies due to blood clotting disorder. The rest of the time it is totally ignored by medical people. Yet in 3 preganancies had to inject daily and post birth.

Sadly, our Gp practice is like Fort Knox and no way of discussing this situation with a medical person who knows my history. Thankfully, I am not due my second AZ dose until end of May, so more news no doubt will be out before then!

Bumblebee1980a · 07/04/2021 21:07

@AzureTwist

Worrying. I have 3 blood clotting factors and am under 50, over 30, and had one dose of AZ.
Apparently you can ask for the Pfizer for your second one if you're really concerned. They won't like doing it but there is no basic scientific reason why you can't.
Gwenhwyfar · 07/04/2021 21:12

"Isn't the risk of blood clots higher with Covid than from the vaccine?"

Maybe so, but I think it's different. We're trying to AVOID Covid while being asked to go and take the vaccine so the risk analysis is different isn't it?

GypsyWanderer · 07/04/2021 21:12

[quote YoBeaches]@GypsyWanderer I agree with your post. I have a blood clotting disorder that so far is only medicated in Pregnancy and as I'm
Not pregnant was advised to get the vaccine. I was given the AZ one 11 days ago.

Yes I'm feeling on edge. I'd like more information on risk factors before I accept the second dose.[/quote]
It is a small risk though so try not to worry although I know it must be really difficult. But the risk looks like it’s minimal. I just would like more information that’s all before I decide (I’m under 40, just, so won’t be offered it yet but I want to make an informed choice).

YoBeaches · 07/04/2021 21:14

@AzureTwist yes same - daily injections during and post partum plus aspirin. BBC now says to discuss with your GP for risk factors of having or not having the vaccine if you have existing blood disorder, but they don't know the risk factors so I suspect you'd still be encouraged to go.

Yeah hopefully a bit more info in the next few weeks will come to light.

murbblurb · 07/04/2021 21:16

So much for giving people information - as this thread demonstrate s, many are way too stupid to cope.

Note the blood clot risks of flying, let alone covid. So many clearly sat in maths classes flicking their hair..

Anyone wanting 100% safe doesnt really get how life works. And I bet miss holistic medicine will be dialling 999 bloody quick if someone she cares about has a heart attack...

Gwenhwyfar · 07/04/2021 21:19

"With respect to the vaccine, when people say "I'll wait and see how things pan out" what they are really saying is "I'll wait until a lot of other people have taken a risk that I'm not prepared to take"."

But what you're saying is 'I want you to sacrifice yourself'.

Barbadosgirl · 07/04/2021 21:22

@mollypuss1

This is getting ridiculous now. Why have so many people lost all perspective of risk?

79 people in the UK have had blood clots following their first Oxford-AstraZeneca jab up to the 31 March out of 20.2 million doses. 19 people have died. Therefore the current risk of dying from a blood clot after getting this vaccine is 0.0000009

We need to be aware of this risk but the fear demonstrated by some on here is completely out of proportion.

Agree. I read today that the chances of getting a fatal blood clot from COVID are something like 7% so you are more risk of a clot from not getting the vaccine if you look at it that way...
GypsyWanderer · 07/04/2021 21:23

@murbblurb

So much for giving people information - as this thread demonstrate s, many are way too stupid to cope.

Note the blood clot risks of flying, let alone covid. So many clearly sat in maths classes flicking their hair..

Anyone wanting 100% safe doesnt really get how life works. And I bet miss holistic medicine will be dialling 999 bloody quick if someone she cares about has a heart attack...

It isn’t DVT though. It’s a specific type of very rare blood clot. I think what's bothering me is why that particular type?
Gwenhwyfar · 07/04/2021 21:25

"79 people in the UK have had blood clots following their first Oxford-AstraZeneca jab up to the 31 March out of 20.2 million doses. 19 people have died. Therefore the current risk of dying from a blood clot after getting this vaccine is 0.0000009

We need to be aware of this risk but the fear demonstrated by some on here is completely out of proportion."

The risk of dying from a blood clot is low, yes. However, as you pointed out, it's the current risk. It might be higher next week.
Also, the risk of dying from Covid is also low for most people so we have to consider the balance.

conkersarebonkers · 07/04/2021 21:26

I had a large area of petechiae after the first dose of AZ on the arm that was injected but at the inside upper area (so pretty much opposite injection area). I mentioned it to GP as it was around the time that the clotting issues were starting to be talked about and she said she wasn't concerned. No issues since (nearly 4 weeks post-vaccination now), so I'll be keeping an eye on any new developments but planning to have my second dose unless I'm told not to. (I am early 40s.)

hodgebit · 07/04/2021 21:26

@murbblurb

So much for giving people information - as this thread demonstrate s, many are way too stupid to cope.

Note the blood clot risks of flying, let alone covid. So many clearly sat in maths classes flicking their hair..

Anyone wanting 100% safe doesnt really get how life works. And I bet miss holistic medicine will be dialling 999 bloody quick if someone she cares about has a heart attack...

^ This, 100%.
LostToucan · 07/04/2021 21:26

[quote GypsyWanderer]I read though that this particular type of blood clot is rarer. 5 in 1 million people.

www.google.com/amp/s/www.hopkinsmedicine.org/health/conditions-and-diseases/cerebral-venous-sinus-thrombosis%3Famp%3Dtrue[/quote]
5 in 1 million people every year. On average, that would be 325 people in the UK every year.

Sunshinegirl82 · 07/04/2021 21:26

@Gwenhwyfar

I'm not really sure how you've got there to be honest. It's not a lethal injection and it's not compulsory.

What do you think should be done? How do you think we should get on top of covid? If you were in charge what choices would you make?

The idea that not doing anything or waiting longer before vaccinating people would be "safer" is misconceived. In the current situation not doing anything, not using the vaccines we have, means more infections, more hospitalisations, more deaths. There is no perfect solution, it's a balance.

Gwenhwyfar · 07/04/2021 21:26

"I read today that the chances of getting a fatal blood clot from COVID are something like 7% so you are more risk of a clot from not getting the vaccine if you look at it that way..."

Only if you actually get Covid so not a useful comparison imo.

Gwenhwyfar · 07/04/2021 21:27

[quote Sunshinegirl82]@Gwenhwyfar

I'm not really sure how you've got there to be honest. It's not a lethal injection and it's not compulsory.

What do you think should be done? How do you think we should get on top of covid? If you were in charge what choices would you make?

The idea that not doing anything or waiting longer before vaccinating people would be "safer" is misconceived. In the current situation not doing anything, not using the vaccines we have, means more infections, more hospitalisations, more deaths. There is no perfect solution, it's a balance.[/quote]
I never claimed to have all the answers. Obviously, from a society wide point of view, we should all get vaccinated. From an individual's point of view, it's not so simple.

Noname99 · 07/04/2021 21:35

Abraxan
mollypuss1

No - that statistic is only true if you compare the whole statistical sample of anyone who has caught COVID no matter age or risk factors.

If you do the maths ... probability of any person catching covid and then add to it the probability of it then leading to blood clot for female, 40-50 year old with no underlying health conditions ... the maths favours no vaccination not vaccination.

YoBeaches · 07/04/2021 21:39

Yes the type of clot is substantially different. DVT and pulmonary embolism are usually quite symptomatic and quickly diagnosed, survival rates are extremely high. The symptoms of this type could much more easily be brushed off as normal side effects of the vaccine before medical intervention is sought. And there are mixed reports on the timeframe for which the clots occurred post vaccination and no information on risk factors relating to medical history or external factors.

You know that sitting and being immobile in a pressurised aircraft is a risk factor. You also know that being overweight increases your risk assessment, as do several other pre existing conditions.

We don't know these things for the vaccine (any of them) as they couldn't possibly cover the range medical conditions in the time frame to roll out. So not everyone is making an informed decision when being asked to board the plane. It's not irrational to have worrries about that when you are trying to support the best interests of yourself and your family, let alone society as a whole.

littlepeas · 07/04/2021 21:40

@Gwenhwyfar

"I read today that the chances of getting a fatal blood clot from COVID are something like 7% so you are more risk of a clot from not getting the vaccine if you look at it that way..."

Only if you actually get Covid so not a useful comparison imo.

7 out of every 100 people with covid get a fatal blood clot? That can’t be right. Is it 7% of people hospitalised with covid?
lightand · 07/04/2021 21:43

@Abraxan arthritis - try eating oily fish two or three times a week
blood pressure - try cutting down on salt quite a lot
svt - no idea what that even is
birth - cant say holistic would help with that
adhesions - op. had that myself.

GypsyWanderer · 07/04/2021 21:44

@YoBeaches

Yes the type of clot is substantially different. DVT and pulmonary embolism are usually quite symptomatic and quickly diagnosed, survival rates are extremely high. The symptoms of this type could much more easily be brushed off as normal side effects of the vaccine before medical intervention is sought. And there are mixed reports on the timeframe for which the clots occurred post vaccination and no information on risk factors relating to medical history or external factors.

You know that sitting and being immobile in a pressurised aircraft is a risk factor. You also know that being overweight increases your risk assessment, as do several other pre existing conditions.

We don't know these things for the vaccine (any of them) as they couldn't possibly cover the range medical conditions in the time frame to roll out. So not everyone is making an informed decision when being asked to board the plane. It's not irrational to have worrries about that when you are trying to support the best interests of yourself and your family, let alone society as a whole.

Yes exactly! All I’ve read today is ‘but the pill causes blood clots’ etc etc. But they are different blood clots for one and two, there are known risk factors. I’d feel better if I knew what the risk factors are. I mentioned earlier, I have a family history of heart disease and cerebral embolism. If these are risk factors (and they’re quite possibly not of course) id like to know when making a decision whether to have it. I think if you have a high risk of complications with covid then it might be worth the risk but I don’t have any known risk factors so I’d like more information. Which will hopefully happen over the next few weeks once they know more.
Oly4 · 07/04/2021 21:47

Not having a vaccine with a 1 in 250,000 chance of a brain blood clot is ridiculous in my view when the risk of clots, DVT, stroke and low blood platelets with Covid is so Much higher.
I’d much rather take my chances with the vaccine than Covid. It’s simple maths..
Fine if you think you can avoid Covid forever. But that’s pretty unlikely

Sakura7 · 07/04/2021 21:49

I read today that the chances of getting a fatal blood clot from COVID are something like 7% so you are more risk of a clot from not getting the vaccine if you look at it that way.

Where on earth did you come up with a mad statistic like that? How on earth is there a 7% chance of a fatal blood clot from Covid when the actual mortality rate from Covid is only a fraction of that??

GypsyWanderer · 07/04/2021 21:50

@Oly4

Not having a vaccine with a 1 in 250,000 chance of a brain blood clot is ridiculous in my view when the risk of clots, DVT, stroke and low blood platelets with Covid is so Much higher. I’d much rather take my chances with the vaccine than Covid. It’s simple maths.. Fine if you think you can avoid Covid forever. But that’s pretty unlikely
I think you’re right if everyone who gets covid had a serious form of it. But because for many it will be mild it is still a risk and one that each individual should weigh up depending on their circumstances.