People are going to start feeling a bit silly

[LemonSherbetFancies]

So many talking about how this is the great reset, how this doesn't stop until we say it does and how we are never coming out of lockdown etc.
Think they are going to feel a bit stupid over the coming weeks!

You're the crazy one on this thread. None of what I said alludes to any conspiracy theory.

I said you needed to be careful of what you were reading because it is the sort of idea that leads to antisemitic conspiracy theories.

Another poster from this thread picked up on what I was talking about and posted a video seriously claiming that the world is run by a secret Jewish satanic sex cult (now rightly deleted).

So no, I'm not the crazy one on this thread, and my concerns that the sorts of conversations being had on this thread could lead to antisemitic conspiracy theories were entirely justified and horribly validated.

@dividedwefall

Yes but it is factually incorrect, not just dumbed down! *@NeverDropYourMoonCup*

OK, then, here's a request/suggestion - how about you explain it for posters in first a way that is accessible to somebody with the literacy level of a seven year old (the sort of language level The Sun might use), and then one for somebody around 11-14?

Pictures/diagrams would be welcome.

Its not for personal reference ffs and you know full well thats not what I meant, you're clearly bored

Actually, if you go back through the thread, I wasn't anywhere near the only person asking you what you were on about.

@NeverDropYourMoonCup why would I? Most posters on this thread don't need an explanation and that article isn't aimed at 7 year olds or 11-14 year olds for that matter. It's a news piece.

Does misinformation only attract criticism when it is unfavourable to the consensus opinion?

@noblegiraffe I really don't need to be careful what I'm reading. I'm neither a child nor a gullible fool. If I read something stupid I have the mental capacity to dismiss it, so you don't need to worry about me sliding down the rabbit hole of zionist conspiracies. I do appreciate your concern for my spiritual welfare though.

I was right and flushed out a Jewish conspiracy theorist.

Some people may not be aware of the standard conspiracy theories and it's always worth flagging up. Awareness is a good thing.

Aren’t most media articles written aimed at the same level of reading age as a child (9-14)? That’s not always a commentary on the reader, just a recognition that no one knows everything and some concepts need to be communicated as if the reader knows nothing about it.

There’s no shame in not knowing everything.

Another poster from this thread picked up on what I was talking about and posted a video seriously claiming that the world is run by a secret Jewish satanic sex cult (now rightly deleted).

I totally missed that one. Sad, as it destroys the credibility of everyone with concerns, much like the 5G BS.

It's entirely fine to have concerns about vaccine passports - Tim Farron, ex leader of the Lib Dems was posting about his concerns from a liberal perspective on Twitter yesterday.

I suspect talk of vaccine passports is being amped up to counter the fears about Astra Zeneca safety - it's vital to the lockdown exit plan that people continue to be vaccinated at a good rate.

[quote dividedwefall]@NeverDropYourMoonCup why would I? Most posters on this thread don't need an explanation and that article isn't aimed at 7 year olds or 11-14 year olds for that matter. It's a news piece.

Does misinformation only attract criticism when it is unfavourable to the consensus opinion?[/quote]
Because, surely if it's so easy to do, you'd wish to illustrate your point by providing correct information in an accessible format, rather than simply saying 'well, this is wrong'?

Why is it wrong? Please, do explain. I'm happy to explain again that the information was intended for adults with comparable literacy skills to an average 7 year old or 11 year old, not that I asked you to produce teaching materials for KS1 and KS3. Adults - with a similar level of vocabulary and knowledge to the standard expected of an average child of those ages.

Or is it easier to say 'well, that's deliberately wrong' as long as you aren't asked 'Why is it wrong? What is the correct explanation?' because then you might get something wrong or have to admit that you don't actually know, you're just saying it's wrong to sound clever?

I wouldn't get something wrong and I don't need to try to sound clever. I wouldn't say something was wrong unless I it was wrong. It's wrong because the adenovirus is not modified to look like coronavirus as claimed and once injected it does not teach the body's immune system to fight the virus as claimed.

If you would like a more comprehensive explanation of how it DOES work then you only need to go back a few pages where I explained it's action in detail to someone who tried to insist it was a whole virus vaccine and not a brand new viral vector vaccine.

Anyway, this is a total side issue bordering on a personal attack. I was highlighting that misinformation was everywhere, including the BBC. Contorting the issue so it looks innocent seems to me to be the fundamental problem we are facing this year. People are ignoring facts that don't chime with they want to believe.

@dividedwefall

Anyway, this is a total side issue bordering on a personal attack. I was highlighting that misinformation was everywhere, including the BBC. Contorting the issue so it looks innocent seems to me to be the fundamental problem we are facing this year. People are ignoring facts that don't chime with they want to believe.

Who are you that you're so important to think I'm personally attacking you?

You said it's wrong but didn't explain why. I asked if you could explain it in a similar style to how they had (as perhaps I don't have the scientific knowledge to be able to understand in a more complex manner) and you're off on one about it being personal, when it would be just as valuable in being able to see whether they were lying/peddling misinformation for some reason as it would be useful to see whether a) you do actually know what you're talking about or b) are bullshitting to sound clever.

So which is it? Am I bullshitting to sound clever? @NeverDropYourMoonCup

Do I sound clever?

@dividedwefall

So which is it? Am I bullshitting to sound clever? *@NeverDropYourMoonCup*

Do I sound clever?

I'd use the word evasive.

I was asking, believe it or not, genuinely - but you've taken it personally and sought to deflect away from the request/question.

It's obviously going to be a waste of time repeating the request to explain how the vaccine works in simpler language for the benefit of those who do not have the benefit of whatever superior knowledge and understanding you may claim to have.

Maybe it's because you don't actually know and you just like implying you are smarter than the average bear, maybe it's because your skill set is not in making concepts relatable and understandable for the purposes of sharing knowledge. I don't know. But it isn't instilling a sense of faith or trust in your opinions, whatever it is.

@NeverDropYourMoonCup ok well whatever you say really. We'll just leave it there shall we and the readers of the thread can make their own mind up?

@toocold54

I'm genuinely interested to know when you think things will be 2019 normal.

I don’t think anyone can answer that as we have no idea what is going to happen next year, there could an outbreak of another disease or WW3.

Things are already opening up and I assume when everyone is vaccinated then more things will re-open.
But there are several things that I would be happy to not go back to normal like washing your hands more often, limited numbers of people in places at the same time, signing in and waiting in your car for your gp appointment instead of being in a room full of sick people for an hour, wearing masks in hospitals etc.

Yes. And social distancing from people not in your group in cafés, restaurants, on public transport etc. And finally people getting the message that it's not appropriate to go to public places/ on public transport if you are unwell.

"Heyupeasterbunny
@tormentil Why would they want rid of the middle classes?
Do the government know all this and are going along with it? How could they?
They/we won't be needed anymore...
AI and robots, remember?

Our government is taking much (most?) of its' direction from the UN and The World Health Organisation, as are many of the other western nations - the US and Australia being the most obvious.
The United Nations and the World Health Organisation have morphed into invisible leaders. It is a massive infiltration of our governments.
Governments which are supposed to serve us, the people.

We really do need to pull together to fight this."

So @tormentil in your view the UN and WHO have an evil plan to take over the world by releasing a virus, so that robots can take over?

[quote Stovetopespresso]@Nousernamesleftatall
"the vaccine doesn’t stop you getting or transmitting Covid so what difference does it make if I take it or not"

it kinda does...

...the whole sitation is obviously far from ideal, the world is in an uncertain place, I get everyone's unease. I think some pps are counting their chickens, we're not there yet.
probably climate change is a threat to democracy as much as this. as is believing conspiracy theories originating from the far right or wherever.[/quote]
Climate change is a far bigger threat to democracy and stability that Covid. Orders of magnitude more serious. I'm not sure the general populace of most countries has grasped the full implications yet as they seem so unimaginable, but we're on the brink of several tipping points (points of no return) which will set in motion catastrophes where tens of millions of people are displaced, mass migration on a level never seen before, and there won't be sufficient resources left to sustain the world population. If our Government were remotely competent, their main focuses would be ensuring that the country becomes self-sufficient in food and energy.

So many talking about how this is the great reset, how this doesn't stop until we say it does and how we are never coming out of lockdown etc.
Think they are going to feel a bit stupid over the coming weeks!

"The information is freely available on the World Economic Forums website, I think you will look silly after this."

Since when does the WEF run the world? They publish "visions" and "ambitions" and "goals" and "plans" all of the time, most of which never come anywhere close to fruition (sadly in many cases). Do you understand what the WEF is?

[quote Ephe17]Conspiracy theory
Term weaponised by the CIA in the 1960's to marginalise people who questioned the conclusions of the Warren Commissions report into the assassination of President Kennedy.

Event 201
A coronavirus pandemic exercise run in New York on 18th October 2019

Great Reset
A proposal by the World Economic Forum to rebuild the economy sustainably following the COVID-19 pandemic. It was unveiled in May 2020 by the United Kingdom's Prince Charles and WEF director Klaus Schwab.

[/quote] Event 201 looks like strategic "war-gaming" exercises which all responsible institutions do periodically to examine how potential risks might play out in reality, drawing in experts from the relevant fields. This is a classic risk assessment technique. It's a shame it wasn't done earlier so that findings could have been implemented before this pandemic took place, although thankfully it isn't as bad as the "war-game" scenario presented. The UK did a similar exercise in 2016 I think, based on the premise of a flu pandemic (and implemented none of the required measures to mitigate the risks it identified, sadly, as they would also have helped to mitigate the impact of SARS-COV-2.)

As for the "Great reset" video - aside from the hilarity of Prince Charles suggesting we all live more sustainable lives while his family maintains several ridiculously large residences far beyond their needs just for themselves and fly around on private jets etc - most of what was said was prescient and sensible (particularly regarding the need to address climate change imminently) and should be listened to.

I'm not usually into conspiracy theories but one thing I read recently does make sense.....

The vaccines have only been approved for 'emergency use' meaning they can only currently be given during a pandemic. If the pandemic ends so does the ability to use the vaccine....

None of the vaccines are due for 'full' approval til 2023.....

Yes. And social distancing from people not in your group in cafés, restaurants

But will there be any cafes/restaurants to social distance in if this is long term? I think its widely accepted that they can't make a profit operating at reduced levels. Maybe in the short term until things get back to normal but not indefinitely

@BonnieDundee I just saw a rather depressing article in the local news. It was a list of city centre bars and restaurants with a pavement outside wide enough to fit a few tables and chairs.

Why would they open just to squeeze 3 customers on the walkway of a busy street? No profit, not even worth turning on the lights.

Been keeping up with this thread.

Thought those interested might want to read these two things:

www3.weforum.org/docs/WEF_Digital_Transformation_Powering_the_Great_Reset_2020.pdf

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Economic_Forum

In the first article, one thing that is said is that small businesses who don't get with the complete digital model will die. Obviously two sides to this - the first is meh, well, any idiot knows that is inevitable, so what. The second is it is removing consumer choice. Everything online. Surveillance capitalism is a thing.

Covid has been identified as an opportunity to move things forward apace.

www.theguardian.com/books/2019/oct/04/shoshana-zuboff-surveillance-capitalism-assault-human-automomy-digital-privacy

If you are interested in any of this Shoshana Zuboff's work is an interesting place to start, she's a Harvard professor so not just some left field crackpot.