BAME uptake of vaccination

[randomer]

I am reading that the BAME community is disproporionately affected by Covid and the uptake of offers of vaccines is less than non BAME.

I wonder if its true and also why.

I apologise for the clumsy term "BAME" but I can't think how else to word it.

It is true, it also applies to people in more deprived areas.

I’ve read there is a while host of reasons - some distrust of “authorities” and “government”, but also mis-information being deliberately targeted and spread, such as that the vaccines contain non-Halal ingredients.

I hope there will be campaigns to change this - there is already a video involving celebrities from various minority groups explaining why people should have the vaccine and urging them to do so.

I read somewhere that some BAME people are not confident with the vaccine due to lack of trial data on BAME population. Can't find the link now.
The govt on its part are encouraging them. I live in an area with a lot of people who are Sikh. A large vaccination center is opened and the councillors are meeting religious sect leaders and asking them to encourage people within their community to take the vaccine. I think it is a good effort and I really hope they do take the vaccine.
As a town we still have the worst rate in the country and I wish things to improve.

Looking at this headline I think the BAME community need to think again about being vaccinated

www.theguardian.com/world/2021/feb/05/up-to-100-uk-children-a-week-hospitalised-with-rare-post-covid-disease

Black people have been used for medical experimentation for decades, no wonder they might be suspicious when something is directed at them. I am sure there are many other reasons too, such as not knowing how to go about getting it, not receiving enough information on it in their language if their English isn't great, socioeconomic factors, being allowed time off work etc. It isn't really for us to presume the reasons but I am just giving a few, I am sure there are many more.

I dont know about black people being used for medical experimentation.That sounds disgusting.

There has already been a campaign to address this problem and unsurprisingly it has not made much difference, especially among the over 80s - black over 80s are only half as likely to have been vaccinated as white over 80s. It's a tragedy. I can't help being reminded of the Grenfell enquiry and the fact it seemed like the authorities were wriggling out of taking responsibility and as for fixing the problem and helping the survivors, I don't think the authorities did a good job.

You can't simply undo decades, centuries of mistrust of authorities, with a few YouTube videos and a Westminster speech. The scientists and politicians undermine each other, arguing about rates of effectiveness. I know the Imams and Muslim Council etc have endorsed these vaccines but people make up their own minds about their own bodies. Let's face it there have been health scares in the past that haven't forecast well - I remember some experts saying we could all have BSE if we had eaten beef, well that hasn't happened.

I'm absolutely pro vaxx and will have the vaccine myself. But I absolutely understand and sympathise with people who remain suspicious. I just hope it doesnt cause them to suffer from unnecessary rates of covid deaths, fingers crossed the rest of the vaccinated population will create some kind of herd immunity to shield them.

@PrivateHall

Black people have been used for medical experimentation for decades, no wonder they might be suspicious when something is directed at them. I am sure there are many other reasons too, such as not knowing how to go about getting it, not receiving enough information on it in their language if their English isn't great, socioeconomic factors, being allowed time off work etc. It isn't really for us to presume the reasons but I am just giving a few, I am sure there are many more.

I've never heard of this. Could you please link some more information on it?

I have been working at a hub and everyone I’ve seen has been white, except for two people.
It’s time Imam’s and other community leaders stepped up to stop misinformation and lead from example.

Blacks and Asians communities have been treated abysmally by the British for centuries.

Why would they trust a rushed through vaccine by the same people who has killed and abused them?

@randomer

I dont know about black people being used for medical experimentation.That sounds disgusting.

Tuskegee is the principle one but there are many instances that were current until comparatively recently.

atlantablackstar.com/2014/12/02/5-unethical-medical-experiments-that-used-black-people-as-guinea-pigs/

There's controversy over obstetric techniques that were developed on black women (without anaesthesia).

You can encourage but not force people to have the vaccine.

There was a Radio 4 item about this last week

www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m000rmhr

As already said above, black people have been subject to inhumane medical experiments throughout history, such as being deliberately infected with syphilis (search syphilis Tuskegee sorry I don't know how to link).
No wonder lots of them, especially older generations, do not trust medical science.

There's controversy over obstetric techniques that were developed on black women (without anaesthesia).

It was widely believed in the medical community that Black people didn't feel/felt less pain.

I was listening to a piece on the radio the other day regarding two areas in our nearest city with high numbers. The talk was done very respectfully, but they were saying they're trying to get the message across to muslims in the area regarding the fact they're still mixing in eachothers households and also with regards to the vaccine as it's believed about 15% will take up the vaccine. Very sad as undoubtedly they'll create their own herd immunity by catching it, but not great for the city itself as these people will no doubt work, have children going to school, wants to visit the local city centre. Areas have been set up in their community for lateral flow tests, but they're not being well used.

I’m not sure how it can be solved. We can’t force people to be vaccinated and that would just create more distrust anyway. The only way is for the leaders of the religions within these communities to speak positively and encourage them to get vaccinated.

The white man is not going to convince them they need to hear it from within their communities from the people they do trust.

It was widely believed in the medical community that Black people didn't feel/felt less pain.

It still is, judging by the disparate maternal mortality rate of black women and the inhumane withholding of appropriate pain relief for people with Sickle Cell crisis pain.

It’s time Imam’s and other community leaders stepped up to stop misinformation and lead from example

A lot already are, and it's a great thing to see. As ever reaching out to community leaders is vital, and likely to be a lot more effective than leafleting, TV ads and all the rest

I'm still interested, though, that those who refuse the vaccine are usually damned as "selfish b*stards" who should be refused access to this and that - even the Stamford Hill jews were roundly condemned - but not, apparently, those from black or asian communities

www.history.com/news/the-father-of-modern-gynecology-performed-shocking-experiments-on-slaves

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tuskegee_Syphilis_Study

www.theguardian.com/world/2011/aug/11/pfizer-nigeria-meningitis-drug-compensation

For those who asked for links, here are a few, but there are so many more.

The Dr Simms thing is the one I am most familiar with. The awful thing is, he was never discredited as such - there is still a speculum named after him and also a position that we use in obstetric emergencies named after him. No wonder many Black people cannot trust the government or NHS.

@EmbarrassingAdmissions

It was widely believed in the medical community that Black people didn't feel/felt less pain.

It still is, judging by the disparate maternal mortality rate of black women and the inhumane withholding of appropriate pain relief for people with Sickle Cell crisis pain.

Yes, quite.

The way black women are treated during pregnancy and birth can be shocking.

No, Tuskegee did not involve injecting people with syphilis--the syphilis was acquired naturally, but the doctors chose not to treat it so that they could study the effects of the disease (this was still incredibly unethical, because syphilis could be fairly easily treated by the time the study was conducted). I think it's worth mentioning the details of Tuskegee though, because what happened to those men happened because they were not being treated. Someone who refuses a safe, free vaccine and puts themselves at risk of developing an unpleasant disease is making themselves more like the Tuskegee victims, not less like them.

The evidence I have seen suggests that the differences among ethnic groups is not all that high and I think the differences will decline still further as people actually see friends and family getting the vaccine. Familiarity breeds comfort (not among hard core anti vaxxers, but certainly among those who are merely "hesitant.")

No, Tuskegee did not involve injecting people with syphilis--the syphilis was acquired naturally, but the doctors chose not to treat it so that they could study the effects of the disease (this was still incredibly unethical, because syphilis could be fairly easily treated by the time the study was conducted).

The ethics of this study are eye-watering.

iirc, 10% of the wives/partners of the men who had syphilis developed syphilis themselves and, putting aside the accompanying fertility issues for the women, a number of children were born with congenital syphilis. There were huge medical and social consequences for the men, their intimate/wider family and the communities.

I read that a contraceptive was tested on black women without their consent but can't find a reputable source to verify this. If true that's another one to add to list of why there is mistrust.

Maybe it’s lack of trust from a pretty much all white speaking to the public government about covid.

I heard that the first birth control pills were tested in Puerto Rico by the US as they believed they were shaving too many children and they were not told what the effects of the pills were I will try and get more information to link.