BAME uptake of vaccination

[randomer]

I am reading that the BAME community is disproporionately affected by Covid and the uptake of offers of vaccines is less than non BAME.

I wonder if its true and also why.

I apologise for the clumsy term "BAME" but I can't think how else to word it.

No, Tuskegee did not involve injecting people with syphilis--the syphilis was acquired naturally, but the doctors chose not to treat it so that they could study the effects of the disease (this was still incredibly unethical, because syphilis could be fairly easily treated by the time the study was conducted).

Tuskegee was a right ethical terror. There's a good podcast called American Scandal that covered it.

The study started when there was no reliable treatment for syphilis, but the participants were not fully consenting as if I remember correctly, they were not informed they had the illness (therefore increasing the chance of transmission to spouses), and were just led to believe it was some extra health checks.

Then a treatment was discovered. And this is where the ethics fly right out the window. They do not inform the people they have syphilis and possibly even discourage them from getting any treatment if they suspect they do. And they just keep the study going for DECADES.

So much misery.

@flashbac

www.history.com/.amp/news/birth-control-pill-history-puerto-rico-enovid

Speaking from what I've seen in my family, there is a weird amount of faith in "natural" remedies... hot water, lemon, camomile tea plus prayer. These kinds of things have all been heavily recommended or sworn by for cancer, asthma, anxiety, heart failure etc.

There seems to be a lack of understanding of how bad some things can be, my dad died of heart failure and he was getting told by his parents daily to drink hot water and "was he feeling any better yet?".

There's a distrust of medication my mum is understandably not very well mentally right now and she has be prescribed anti-anxiety, antidepressant and sleeping meds and my family is shooting that she must not take them and should just drink camomile tea.

Thankfully, cancer was treated with chemo and surgery but god was thanked for most of it... not science, not doctors

I worked in a public health role on a research project which was designed to understand and improve uptake of screening services etc amongst BAME communities. I shared information about it on a previous MN thread about this topic only to be accused of making it up and the thread being deleted, so I'm not going to waste my time repeating it here.

It would be good if the energy around the BLM movement could be translated into a 'BLM - get vaccinated' message.

'Black people have been used for medical experimentation for decades, no wonder they might be suspicious when something is directed at them. '

It isn't directed at them, it is for everyone. You'd have a point if it was only for the BAME community and white people wouldn't dare have it.

We don't all not take medication because of disasters like thalidomide or unethical practises in the past. Not having any trust in Johnson should be totally irrelevant, these vaccines are made by independent laboratories and tested/regulated by independent bodies.

It’s time Imam’s and other community leaders stepped up to stop misinformation and lead from example.

I'm pretty sure this is happening.

I understand that there have been some horrendous medical practices in the past but it is not like the vaccine is not being given to everyone else.

It isn't directed at them, it is for everyone. You'd have a point if it was only for the BAME community and white people wouldn't dare have it.

…these vaccines are made by independent laboratories and tested/regulated by independent bodies.

It's a circular problem. People in particular demographics are disproportionately affected by COVID–19 for a mass of intersecting reasons. For reasons that relate to a history that demonstrates a lack of medical/organisational/societal trustworthiness, those same demographics are under-represented in clinical trials so there is a comparative lack of useful data relative to other groups.

I shared information about it on a previous MN thread about this topic only to be accused of making it up hmm and the thread being deleted, so I'm not going to waste my time repeating it here.

I'm sorry to learn that the thread was deleted as it sounds as if your resources would have been relevant for a number of reasons.

There is a wide variation in uptake in different groups in BAME[agree op, hate the term, especially as it links or groups people together who are different from each other, as everyone is].

Scroll down to about halfway, to see the huge variations

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9223723/Around-15-Britons-refusing-Covid-vaccine-uptake-lower-BAME-groups.html

My Family members that are non white are very nervous and are currently refusing to entertain the new vaccine.

They are worrying that it hasn’t been trialled on many of the BAME community - I’m unsure how true this is and will be looking over the weekend for some info into this.
As someone else also mentioned above they are more into home remedies and have a huge dislike for medical interference and only use it as a last resort.

It would seem ironic that those from the BAME community would complain they were underrepresented in trials. If they didn't come forward then what is the solution? www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-54512175

Thank god for all the thousands that did volunteer.

It's not surprising but it's also really alarming in relation to care home staff and domiciliary carers many of whom are Black and at risk. What about recent immigrants who might not have a GP, how will they get it?

Thank god for all the thousands that did volunteer.

Yes thank God that those with such white privilege stepped up and were brave 🙄

What about recent immigrants who might not have a GP, how will they get it?

Some GP practices are aware of this and are offering to both register and vaccinate.

It's why the reports of the barracks/hostels where asylum seekers/refugees and those who are restricted by the 'no recourse to public funds' are so concerning. It's absurd to consider withholding the offer of vaccination from anyone - for the individuals, those with whom they live and/or work, and the wider communities.

'Yes thank God that those with such white privilege stepped up and were brave'

Oh fgs, nothing to do with 'white privilege' 🙄. It is however a fact that without those willing to volunteer we wouldn't have vaccines being widely administered would we. Perhaps you prefer the high hospitalisation and death rates, hmm?

Alot of you are talking like racism in the healthcare system is non-existent.

It is.

Black women are 5 times more likely to die during childbirth. They are not listened to. They are dismissed. Their choices in labour are not listened to, including when they want pain relief.

It certainly is white privilege if you have the privilege to not worry about what a vaccine will do to your system.

Even as a woman, I'd be worried about the vaccine too. Medical research isn't well known for testing drugs and pharmaceuticals on women in a parallel trial. Id imagine it's utterly terrifying for a black person to try the vaccine...

@GetOffYourHighHorse

It is a privilege to not be scared of scientists, medicine, the government etc and willing to trust that the British system has your personal best interest at heart , to have and trust a system which usually works in your favour is a privilege.

So yes it is a privilege.

It's not surprising but it's also really alarming in relation to care home staff and domiciliary carers many of whom are Black and at risk

This is why I queried the exclusion from this and that which has been widely suggested for those declining vaccines - the usual attitude is "sod 'em; if they refuse then what do they expect?"

I can't somehow see that going down well if applied to minority communities, especially if it relates to employment, but it's hard to tell as the point's never answered

I am hoping that once half the country is vaccinated, say, and has no ill effects that everyone who wasn't sure will change their mind.

@randomer

In response -
atlantablackstar.com/2014/12/02/5-unethical-medical-experiments-that-used-black-people-as-guinea-pigs/

&

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medical_experimentation_in_Africa

In short is why black people in particular are skeptical about the vaccination programme.

Although many of these things has occurred not in the UK, there is high suspicion. Statistics are regularly put out there that black people are 5 times more likely to be stopped and searched,black people recieve poor medical care than their counterparts, black women are more likely to die in childbirth due to the notion that they have a higher pain threshold, bame community is more likely to be imprisoned longer for lesser crimes etc the list could go on and nothing is done about it or has changed then all of a sudden there is a a huge push and drive by the government that they now care about the bame community.
In addition to this, there has been alot of uncertainty, back tracking with government decisions and policies.
There is distrust and suspicion about it hence why people are hesistant.

In time, hopefully it changes but for now many people I know will adopt a wait and see approach before taking the vaccine.

[quote OverTheRainbow88]@GetOffYourHighHorse

It is a privilege to not be scared of scientists, medicine, the government etc and willing to trust that the British system has your personal best interest at heart , to have and trust a system which usually works in your favour is a privilege.

So yes it is a privilege.[/quote]
Are you serious, it is only black and Asian people who are 'scared' of medicine, scientists etc?! I know many many people who are scared of treatment, of being admitted to hospital. Also, many people don't trust the government regardless of their ethnicity (haven't you seen the 'we hate Johnson' threads) so 'privilege' doesn't really come into that either.

If we were all anti vaxxers we'd be stuck in this situation forever wouldn't we? So stop with the excuses and get vaccinated.

@GetOffYourHighHorse

I will be vaccinated when it is my turn, thank you.

And yes I am am being deadly serious. The fact you can’t even slightly comprehend an experience of an other speaks volumes.

I may not totally understand or agree with someone else’s opinion but I would acknowledge it and then would spend some time researching it before belittling it. But then again, I am an educated person with an open mind.

So should white people not volunteer for anything as that is abusing their white privilege. If people hadn't volunteered we wouldn't have any vaccines. I am eternally grateful to everyone who volunteered, whatever ethnicity they were.

@getoffyourhighhorse

A question was asked why the bame community is hesistant about the vaccine and many people have provided facts and evidence to explain it.
Your dismissing @overtherainbow88 for their views.
Getting vaccinated is down to each individuals own choice and freedom to do so.
Whatever reasons or rationale anyone holds is down to them alone and not for anyone to tell them that they are making excuses. What you may seem as an excuse is logical for them.