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Tier 4 - not the same for everyone in it

197 replies

bagpuss90 · 20/12/2020 14:20

To be a bit fed up with Facebook comments saying “Christmas isn’t cancelled”, “it’s not that bad” , “ “ it’s not the end of the world” and so on. These are coming from people who will be spending Christmas cosied up with the family they live with. I know at least three people who will be forced to spend Christmas on their own - at least one of them suffers mental health problems . It’s not the same - you cannot compare the situations. I also know a couple whose granddaughter is tragically terminally ill. It will be her last Christmas and they can’t see her without breaking the law. I’m sorry it is not the same for everyone - it really isn’t . We are not all in the same boat . Rant over

OP posts:
EmmanuelleMakro · 20/12/2020 15:58

If anything Covid is highlighting inequalities.
Completely agree.

JinglingHellsBells · 20/12/2020 15:59

@bagpuss90 This is the list. The people you mention can see someone who is terminally ill.

Where and when you can meet in larger groups
There are still circumstances in which you are allowed to meet others from outside your household or support bubble in larger groups, but this should not be for socialising and only for permitted purposes. A full list of these circumstances will be included in the regulations, and includes:

for work, or providing voluntary or charitable services.

This includes picketing outside workplaces. This can include work in other people’s homes where necessary - for example, for nannies, cleaners or tradespeople. See guidance on working safely in other people’s homes). Where a work meeting does not need to take place in a private home or garden, it should not - for example, although you can meet a personal trainer, you should do so in a public outdoor public place.
in a childcare bubble(for the purposes of childcare only)
for registered childcare, or for supervised activities for children where this enables a parent to work, seek work, attend education or training, or for respite care
education or training - meaning education related to a formal curriculum or training that relates to work or obtaining work
for arrangements where children do not live in the same household as both their parents or guardians
to allow contact between birth parents and children in care, as well as between siblings in care
for prospective adopting parents to meet a child or children who may be placed with them
for birth partners
to provide emergency assistance, and to avoid injury or illness, or to escape a risk of harm
to see someone who is dying
to fulfil a legal obligation, such as attending court or jury service
for gatherings within criminal justice accommodation or immigration detention centres
to provide care or assistance to someone vulnerable, or to provide respite for a carer
for a wedding or equivalent ceremony in exceptional circumstances, as set out below.
for funerals - up to a maximum of 30 people. Wakes and other linked ceremonial events can continue in a group of up to 6.
to visit someone at home who is dying, or to visit someone receiving treatment in a hospital, hospice or care home, or to accompany a family member or friend to a medical appointment
for elite sportspeople (and their coaches if necessary, or parents/guardians if they are under 18) to compete and train
to facilitate a house move

Justa47 · 20/12/2020 16:00

@Whattheactual20201

Re you bubble comments

  1. You can’t stay overnight anymore.
  2. If you are in teir4 and your bubble in tier 3 you can’t.
  3. You have to wait 10 days to change bubble.

The government have utterly ignored people on their own and their guidance is lacking in clarity and basically puerile.

DailyPotion · 20/12/2020 16:03

Yes, I saw it put as "we're all in the same storm, some of us have a rowing boat whilst others are in a luxury yacht."

However, the examples in your OP can and should go with their original plans.

Hellotheresweet · 20/12/2020 16:07

* To be a bit fed up with Facebook comments saying “Christmas isn’t cancelled”, “it’s not that bad” , “ “ it’s not the end of the world” and so on*

I’m a bit fed up of posters spouting nonsense like “Christmas is cancelled” and making out this is the most dreadful awful thing that could possibly happen to them.

carltongirl · 20/12/2020 16:08

So many annoying people saying 'WE are staying home this year and so should everyone else'. No sense of the need for people living alone to move around.

OrigamiOwl · 20/12/2020 16:11

@BlueBottle18

Im properly fed up of people living in their nice houses, with their children and husband/wife saying 'christmas isnt cancelled, its just different'. Just fuck off. Its all over sm and its pissing me off. Yes if your having a christmas with dc of course its not cancelled, thats just a normal but small xmas

I will be spending christmas alone. I am an NHS dr working christmas day. My parents are tier 4, they have 2 children and we decided my brother needed more support. My BF is going to see his parents as a support bubble, because his mum was pretty devastated by being unable to see her dc on xmas, he is my usual support bubble. I will be okay but its shit

So many of my friends live in flat shares, or shitty studio flats in london. Or again crappy accomodation provided by work. So many are now spending christmas alone in a bedroom. So many of my friends didnt see their partners for months and have been so good. Our have been lives completely put on hold.

I dont want to hear that your christmas is just different. I am angry that my parents are apparently perfectly safe to be surrounded by hundreds of teenagers/children daily but not safe to see me for one day. And Im also a bit jealous of the children who get to spend every day with my wonderful mum, never thought Id be jealous of a ten year old.

I keep seeing people on SM posting all the charities people who are struggling can go to for support. I dont need a charity I need my mum.

I'm in a similar boat (emergency services rather then a doctor).

I've seen a few people on my Facebook having the "Christmas isn't cancelled it's just different" and making digs at people at other people ("I can't believe how selfish people are being by visiting family in boxing Day" etc...I doubt the virus knows the different between Christmas Day and boxing Day). All the people posting the digs are people I know are at home in nice big houses, not having to work over Christmas, living with their spouses & children. None of them are lonely. None of them are facing sitting at home Christmas completely alone.
It's easy to put a post on Facebook, but do consider that not everyone is in the same circumstances and it's easy to judge if you're in a privileged position.

nosswith · 20/12/2020 16:12

Tier 4 is not the same for everyone, neither are any of the other tiers. If you have a car your restrictions from pre-Covid life are less than if not, if you live in an urban centre less, and many others.

Over many years we have become a more unequal country and since March this has only got worse.

Inkpaperstars · 20/12/2020 16:13

Lots of people are spending this Christmas alone not because the rules mean they have to, although they may mean that in some areas, but because they assess the risk of catching the virus or contributing to spreading it to be too high.

FightingWithTheWind · 20/12/2020 16:14

@coronaiswatching it isn't just a day though is it. It has been months of restrictions with no end in sight, people were given something to look forward to and get excited about and it was snatched away at very short notice.

AldiAisleofCrap · 20/12/2020 16:16

@Justa47
*Re you bubble comments

1. You can’t stay overnight anymore.
2. If you are in teir4 and your bubble in tier 3 you can’t.
3. You have to wait 10 days to change bubble.

Re point one , what part of a support bubble being as one household is hard for you to understand?

Re Point two , what part of a support bubble being as one household is hard for you to understand?

Re point three, that’s irrelevant see my response to points one and two!

CrispySeaweedIsReallyCabbage · 20/12/2020 16:18

YANBU, but, I have spoken to two women in the past day, who have been in tears; not just dissapointed or a bit sad, but fully sobbing. This is not because it is their mum's last christmas alive, or because they will all be completely alone. Woman A will be spending Christmas Day with her parents and her DP, but not the five days she wanted at her parents'. She lives with her DP. She will not be alone and barely pays attention to the rules with friends anyway, so is usually busy seeing people. Her parents won't break the rules.

Woman B will be spending a few days with her mum, dp and DC as her mum is alone and they have made a last minute support bubble. But her sibling who also has a DP and dcs, obviously won't be able to come.

I guess this is the last straw for people, but I do worry about how people's resilience at the ages of 35-36 ish are so low that this results in a full hysterical sob over not getting the Christmas they expected. Maybe I'm dead inside. But, surely people had an idea this might happen as well? It is so shit to have your plans change last minute, but it was on the cards I think?

I'm spending Christmas with my DH and dcs FWIW. Guests have had to cancel, obviously.

Yellownotblue · 20/12/2020 16:19

Regarding bubbles, many single people live in flatshares. The flatmates aren’t necessarily great friends. But because they don’t live alone, they are not allowed any bubbles.

We were planning to have one such person with us for Christmas Day as she knew she couldn’t go back to her country at Christmas. The new rules mean she is stuck in her flat with a flat mate that she doesn’t particularly get along with. It’s really shit and I feel guilty that I had to rescind our invitation.

AldiAisleofCrap · 20/12/2020 16:19

@Acorn you can stay overnight !

YellowandGreenToBeSeen · 20/12/2020 16:21

@Ted27

its not as simple as saying single people can bubble. I am too far away from my family, most of my friends are not local, those that are local are quite rightly prioritising their own families

So no I can’t bubble as there is no one to bubble with

Absolutely this. My friends have local family / are already in bubbles with their widowed parent / kids are home from Christmas / are vulnerable etc.

My parents are CEV and moved 250 miles away 10 years ago. So even if I were able to see them, I couldn’t put them at risk.

Single people can only bubble if there’s someone to bubble with.

AldiAisleofCrap · 20/12/2020 16:22

@bagpuss90
If you are in an existing support bubble with someone who lives in a Tier 4 area, you can see each other on Christmas Day. If you choose to do so, you must not join a Christmas bubble with anyone else.

AlternativePerspective · 20/12/2020 16:23

Too much emphasis placed on Christmas though. Not just this year, but every year.

Every year the television is full of begging adverts/junk mail from the charities is overwhelmingly geared towards how dreadful it must be to be alone for Christmas

What about the rest of the year? Is it ok to be alone for the other 364 days a year just as long as you’re not alone for Christmas?

ShoesCoatandBag · 20/12/2020 16:24

MIL is bubbled with BIL who is in tier 4. Whilst she could go to him it isn’t sensible to do so.

She’ll therefore be on her own for the first time in 80 years for Christmas. Had the news come out earlier we could have unbubbled my mother - who does have other options for Christmas and formed a support bubble with MIL but it’s too late now. She lives to far from us for it to be a day trip she’d have to stay.

It’s just heart breaking. Properly heartbreaking.

xmasfairybuns · 20/12/2020 16:25

A single person who was planning on spending Christmas with a sibling can no longer go because the sibling has children home from university.

Aren't adult children home from university in their own home though? IDK.

AldiAisleofCrap · 20/12/2020 16:25

@AcornAutumn
Staying away from home overnight
You cannot leave home for holidays or stays overnight away from your main home unless permitted by law. This means that holidays in the UK and abroad are not allowed. This includes staying in a second home or caravan, or staying with anyone you do not live with or are in a support bubble with.

AldiAisleofCrap · 20/12/2020 16:28

@loulouljh it is law
If you break the rules
The police can take action against you if you meet in larger groups. This includes breaking up illegal gatherings and issuing fines (fixed penalty notices).

You can be given a Fixed Penalty Notice of £200 for the first offence, doubling for further offences up to a maximum of £6,400. If you hold, or are involved in holding, an illegal gathering of over 30 people, the police can issue fines of £10,000.

Justa47 · 20/12/2020 16:31

@AldiAisleofCrap

It appears I can read and many other can’t.

EmbarrassingAdmissions · 20/12/2020 16:34

For anyone who hasn't seen it, Adam Wagner's explainer thread about the guidance and Tiers is very helpful and detailed:

twitter.com/AdamWagner1/status/1340568872655708161?s=20

BillysMyBunny · 20/12/2020 16:34
  • Too much emphasis placed on Christmas though. Not just this year, but every year.

Every year the television is full of begging adverts/junk mail from the charities is overwhelmingly geared towards how dreadful it must be to be alone for Christmas

What about the rest of the year? Is it ok to be alone for the other 364 days a year just as long as you’re not alone for Christmas?*

Totally agree with this. I live alone and will be alone for Christmas Day as I can no longer go and stay with family for the 5 days as planned. I’m a teacher and off work until January 3rd. I have had some friends send me links to articles offering advice on how to cope with Christmas Day alone and still make it a nice day etc, I am wondering if they realise that I am expecting to be alone for over 2 weeks until I’m back at work so don’t really get all of the emphasis on Christmas Day, Christmas Day will probably be okay because I imagine friends and family will arrange to call or zoom etc thinking I’ll be lonely but actually its all of the days around it when nobody thinks to check on you that I am expecting to be far more lonely and miserable.

bagpuss90 · 20/12/2020 16:35

Well said FightingWithTheWind

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