Do you support this tier 0 over Christmas?

[notevenat20]

I can see why it might be popular, but won’t it just kill a lot of the people we love the most?

No. Just because something is permitted doesn’t mean it’s a good idea.
Dreading January

I'm single and don't live near family and I'm seeing my family regardless of what Boris or anyone else says. Honestly how would they police it without involving the army?

I think many people on these threads seem to forget that some people have been alone 24/7 for months now and Christmas was the one thing I was looking forward to. I've been sensible but there are still things I need to leave the house for. I'm also in a tier one area which means my risk is low.

And I'm loath to judge but I think families with secondary age children seeing elderly parents/grandparents is just plain reckless. Sorry.

And what if It's the elderly relative pushing it? Making the lives of their family a living hell if they don't see them?

That's the situation I have. My dad is 86 and lives 200 miles away. My children are at primary and secondary with very high cases. He's still being coming to stay once a month and will be back again at Christmas. He doesn't care. I already get emotionally blackmailed and keep being told if he hangs himself it's my fault (he's not suicidal, just emotionally abusive). If we didn't see him at Christmas my life would be made hell.

There are many others in my situation.

I shall be visiting those I've visited all along. My sister's family and each of my children. Regardless of whatever Tier we're in. We socially distance, don't hug, wear masks indoors etc.

It makes me very angry that I work in a school where there is no proper social distancing, many don't wear a mask (we're now supposed to but no-one enforces it) and we're dealing with everyone else's children....but I can't see my own family? Load of bollocks that is.....

If they did a lockdown where they shut all schools too, I would stick to it absolutely. While schools are still open we will never completely get the spread down and no, not at the expense of my family or Christmas.....

If my post makes me a selfish arsehole I'm ok with that, unless you've experienced the level of isolation that single people or those shielding have experienced you can't judge us.

I think many people would have done it anyway.

I think the government have made a big mistake by legitimising it.

More people will do it now and there will be more spread.

I am doing what I feel is best for my family / extended family and we are not mixing.

Not sure about 'support'... But definitely feel relief at it.
The idea of spending one day with my parents, in a 'safe' environment. Then reverting back to the distancing until numbers drop.

And it's the same for them. It's a morale boost to keep them going a few more months until the vaccine reaches them (my mum's only 65, but does have health issues).

No I don’t.
It will just be me and DP this Christmas and I will celebrate with family at a later date when it is properly safe to do so.
People will do whatever they want though and I dread to think how bad Jan is going to be for the country

Candles I don't that is selfish at all.

But there will be much mixing going on that really isn't needed.

Its about getting the balance right.

I can't support making 25%+ of the population into criminals for following human instincts and seeking to get their emotional needs met, which is the only realistic alternative.

Tier 0 would be normal socialising and interactions. The Christmas window is still a zillion miles from normal. I wonder if people have forgotten 'normal'.

Thanks @covidnomore I'm only seeing my parents and my sister who is in their bubble. I just read these threads and feel really attacked. I may have made a different decision if I was in tier 3 but luckily I'm not.

I will be spending Christmas with my family and 2 others. The other households have already had Covid this wave (beginning of November) so they should not get it from us or us from them.

Both me and DH work from home, have shopping delivered including all of our Xmas presents, 2 of our children stopped college/nursery last Friday and we aren't going anywhere before Xmas at all. My other 2 children are at school but this is the only place it would come from.

If one of us gets the virus then the whole Xmas bubble isolates which protects everyone outside our bubble.

The problem is people being stupid with the rules.

My PIL haven't had the virus and are 70 so are choosing to spend it on their own and not with their other children. Super sensible idea.

I think cancelling Christmas at this point would be disastrous. People have prepared for it financially and mentally and will probably do it anyway.

I'm a bit of a hypocrite. I don't think families should be mixing but I will be seeing family.

I recognise I am in a very privileged position that we are now isolating in the run up to Christmas

I'm most worried about how people's mental health will suffer in January and February to make up for the 5 days over Christmas.
I do understand the argument about single people but the option is there for them to bubble with another household for Christmas.
Too many people are interpreting the 3 family bubble rule to mean 3 families for each of the 5 days

@CandlesBlanketsandTea

If my post makes me a selfish arsehole I'm ok with that, unless you've experienced the level of isolation that single people or those shielding have experienced you can't judge us.

No of course you are not selfish, Our DS is single, we haven't seen him since last Christmas, he also lives miles away, only difference this year is that we are picking him up instead of him using the train, that will be handy anyway as we wanted to give him lots of household stuff which would have been difficult to carry on the train.

Exactly this @CandlesBlanketsandTea ! I've yet to see an objection about it from someone who spent March to July home alone.
It does worry me that there will be consequences of this and I'm fully psyching myself up for hard lockdown again in January but some people can mix households in as safe a way as possible and I'm getting a bit sick of being made to feel guilty for doing so. If I had school age kids or a job that involved mixing with the public I certainly wouldn't be doing it but I'm working from home alone and apart from needing to do 1 trip to the post office and a hospital appointment I'm self isolating now until the 23rd.

Tier 0? That's a bit misleading, isn't it? It's not like the hospitality industry and entertainment industry can just throw open its doors and be damned with the restrictions, does it?

Personally we have told everyone we are spending Chrismas alone this year. We have wanted to do this for years without travelling around all week especially as all parents are now remarried which means 4 trips and then brothers and sisters added into the mix. We couldnt pick two other households and i have bad asthma so dont want to risk it particularly as the rest or the family arent sticking to the guidelines anymore either and wont be sticking to the 3 household rule either. Looking forward to a christmas of the 3 of us with no travel amd staying safe

A lot of those not wanting to mix are probably already in a comfy family group of adults and children anyway.

It isn't tier 0 though is it it's very limited mixing (if you follow the rules to the letter).
I think we all deserve to have this opportunity to have a small family gathering and frankly if government cancel it now people will stop listening to them regardless of christmas.
A lot of people I know are not going anywhere just having a household christmas and/or are being very sensible eg isolating in the run-up, getting private tests done, preparing to cancel at the slightest hint of someone being ill etc. I think most of us can be trusted to be sensible, it's the other 30% or so I'm worried about.

In light of the rising cases etc in the SE I think it's crazy to permit unlimited travel/3 households etc over Christmas. But since Boris has made such a fuss about 'saving Christmas' I can't see it changing.

I think more targeted relaxation of the rules would have been much better eg. allowing a household to mix with more than one single adult household for a few days (so those who live a alone but don't have very close family for a permanent bubble are not alone), different rules for those with terminal illnesses etc.

It's fine for the Government to be urging caution but I know quite a few people (especially some older relatives) who seem to be working on the assumption that if the rules allow something it must be OK and treating it almost as a requirement to find a 3 household bubble. Added to this there seem to be loads of people who have misinterpreted the rules (or at least are pretending to have) and thinking it's 3 households per day or that a 'chain' of bubbles (with one household in several bubbles) is allowed. With unlimited travel as well I can see that the December mixing will lead to cases up everywhere and those areas lucky enough to be low tier going in to tighter restrictions after Xmas. I know of at least 2 families who are choosing to stay with family in a lower tier so that they can have meals out etc whilst they are there.

I know that if there are no relaxations in the rules then some people will see family regardless but I suspect it would be fewer than are planning to do so now.

I think people should be able to meet people within the guidelines but should make informed decisions if they re vulnerable themselves or they work somewhere with a higher chance of getting covid.

I isolated myself as much as possible from the begining of lockdown one till my son's birth at the begining of November, I left the house for medical appointments and a walk every 2 days only. I hoped that meant my DH would be there when I needed him, but unfortunately although visiting was better than other areas, I had 2 nights alone in early labour as my blood pressure was dangerously high and staff needing to isolate meant I was left with my waters broken for 60 hours before I was allowed to go to delivery suite for the drip and baby ended up in NICU with sepsis.
I also then got sepsis myself two days later and looking after my son for two nights once he was out of NICU with next to no support on a ward when I had to be hooked up to IV antibiotics and an iron infusion felt quite cruel.

So after that traumatic experience, I was very torn about what to do for Christmas as I don't want to knowingly be risking putting other women through what I did but at the same time, I ve not seen family or friends apart from my in laws once at the other end of the drive for 5 minutes and the fact I m still coming to terms with what happened, we ve decided to see my mum, sister and my nana (my nana is happy to take the risk herself and with DH working from home and us both barely going to the shops our chances of having covid feel low and I d like her to meet her great grandson just once) and my father in law and his wife for a few hours, it's giving me something positive to look forward which I think I need as I know I m lucky I m not showing signs of PTSD after what happened. After those visits we ll go back to not seeing anyone apart from maybe outdoors within our area until the vaccine has been more widely given and we re past the winter months.

I think a lot of people will have a similar moral dilemma to what decision we ve made as a family.

I think so too, Bloodyfrosty. There were always going to be people who did Exactly what they liked at Christmas just as there were people who completely ignored lockdown rules right from the start. But there’s going to be lots of people who generally try to follow the rules who will meet up because they’re allowed and people who think it must be safe now because Boris said they could.

No.

Fuck no. It's absolutely crazy.