This scientist thinks we have got everything very, very wrong

[queenofknives]

I mean, he's pretty convincing so far tbh. Anyone else watching?

Try digging a little deeper into how this government have been going about introducing new laws which goes against everything our grandparents and great grandparents literally gave their lives for.

Rationing , evacuation, in WWII

Trench warfare in WWI

conscription

Our forebears accepted quite a lot of limitation on personal freedom and preferences for the greater good.

@queenofknives

I'm getting to the point where I think the only way forward now is to ditch masks, forget about social distancing, ignore the lockdown and just go back to life. We can't lose all our rights and freedoms, give up the nhs and go into a devastating economic depression for a virus that kills virtually no one.

Tell my next door neighbour and her two daughters that this virus kills virtually no- one, she buried her husband today, he was not an elderly man, in his late forties. It's easy to be dismissive when it hasnt affected you personally

When I was young we said there was one born every minute - but production has ramped up since then.

You cant argue with stupid. No matter how many times you give them evidence they are wrong it wont get past their blind conviction that they know a truth not revealed to lesser mortals.

There are a lot of scientists who are legitimately questioning the current approach. And the more you look into it, the more it does become very questionable.

• The data we are fed by the MSM is skewed and without context and designed to create fear. Even our own watchdog on government statistics has warned the government about this www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-54831334

• The above is fundamental, but actually is very related to a constant theme on this thread and others. 50,000 deaths sounds like a lot. But the pp who said it isn't very much is sort of right. 450 people die of cancer per day www.cancerresearchuk.org/health-professional/cancer-statistics-for-the-uk so that is roughly 121,000 who have died in the same time period (of course, this will increase massively at some point as cancer referrals are down by up to 50%)

At this time of year, other respiratory illnessses are usually part of life, but the deaths and numbers are never put in this context. We don't really know how 'bad' it is today with 500+ deaths - what is normal for this time of year with respiratory viruses? It is either horrifying or misleading - I suspect the latter.

• The tests that we are using. The government has consistently failed to publish false positive rates for the tests. This is so crucial because this will literally never end if the test is (as many critics are saying) not fit for purpose (we are using cycle thresholds that are too high and it is picking up old virus) as it will be impossible to actually say the virus is contained if the FPR is high (and ironically the FPR gets higher the lower the prevalence in the population - think that one through!)

• We have not acknowledged the T Cell defences that it is estimated by many scientists to be approx 30-50% of the population. Again this needs to be cleared up as it may mean that 66,000,000 people were never at risk, and instead it was 46.2m - 33m who were at risk. massively decreasing the potential number of deaths

I could go on....but so many unanswered questions and a total lack of diverse thought in the msm, which is what science is all about.

Batshitteryness

@queenofknives

I'm getting to the point where I think the only way forward now is to ditch masks, forget about social distancing, ignore the lockdown and just go back to life. We can't lose all our rights and freedoms, give up the nhs and go into a devastating economic depression for a virus that kills virtually no one.

Let me just interpret that for you:

You want to ditch masks, ban social distancing and go back to life as it was. You do not want to lose your rights and freedoms but are not willing to expect anybody else's. You do not think there is a middle ground where some life and livehood can both be protected. It is not about other people but about your specific needs you wish to put above society. You also assume that the NHS will not fail if it is overwhelmed and tens of thousands of people are turned away and that individuals working at the front line within our largest employer (and the world's fifth largest) have to decide on who they treat and who they do not treat. You are an expert on morale and economics too and clearly would never vote for a political party that would tax and spend or, as will be the case, spend and then tax. Your explanation of a 'devastating economic impact' will no doubt omit that substantial money has been injected into the economy and is now circulating. You have forgotten that if all those wishes of yours were to be implemented the virus would no longer 'kill virtually no one'. In might in fact kill a great deal of people.

Here is my advice to you OP. You do not need a parachute to jump out of an airplane. You only need one if you wish to do it again.

This is so crucial because this will literally never end if the test is (as many critics are saying) not fit for purpose (we are using cycle thresholds that are too high and it is picking up old virus)

Yet again you persist with this misinformation from your dubious "non msm" sources, despite being corrected before.

Here is what the people who actually set up and run the labs say, why not listen to them instead?

"All samples need to have 2 genes amplified at Ct

a virus that kills virtually no one.

I despair.

I haven't watched this particular scientist so I don't know exactly what is being said. But I agree lockdown is potentially misguided. The vast majority of people dying from Covid are very old. The average age of death from Covid is higher than the average life expectancy. It's clear that most (not all) deaths are amongst those near the end of their lives. If you look a the 2020 stats for cause of deaths (ONS website), the normal leading causes of death (e.g.dementia/pneumonia/ cerebrovascular disease etc etc.) are almost all BELOW the 5 year average. So Covid is replacing other causes of deaths from those who would otherwise have died quite soon. 600,000 people die in the UK every year. Yes there are excess deaths this year but not just from Covid. Lockdown has caused loads of deaths too - and will be killing more young people than Covid is. People saying things like - tell the relative of a Covid victim that lockdown is wrong Such a ridiculous argument. People die from many causes, many of which are preventable if society were to lockdown on a more or less permanent basis. We have always accepted these risks before. We don't lockdown every winter to prevent the thousands of flu deaths that wouldn't occur if we all stayed at home (and please don't jump on the "COVID ISN'T FLU!' bandwagon. I know that. I'm just talking about the measures we are prepared to take to prevent death from any cause during our lives. Loads of infectious diseases and accidents kill people all the time. We don't normally weigh down in favour of stopping life to prevent deaths. We normally accept death as a risk of life and carry on.) I'm not saying Covid deaths aren't sad. They are. I'm not worried about lockdown because I don't care about people. I'm worried about lockdown because I do care about people. Mental health, jobs, homes, precious time with family and friends during our short lives, childhoods, youth are all so important. I am against extreme restrictions on an indefinite basis on citizens in order to protect the mainly very elderly (who have already enjoyed all the freedoms we are denying younger people) The impact on mental health and livelihoods and quality of life for those with years ahead of them is too high a cost. There has to be a balance - I'm all in favour of social distancing/ masks/ hygiene/ some restrictions. But not living in an open prison indefinitely, as we are now. It's easy for those in power to make us live this way - their jobs ,income and sense of purpose in life isn't affected at all while ordinary people despair in their living rooms. It's not cold and heartless to think that we are perhaps sacrificing too much.

@queenofknives

Oh, and the Great Barrington Declaration has also been completed discredited.

Do you have a link to the discrediting? I just looked and nearly 12,000 public health scientists have signed it. Have they taken back their support?

Did you actually look at the names? I think Dr. DArth Vader was one. :)

@TheSunIsStillShining yes some stupid names but also some very credible scientists. It has not been written off as nonsense at all.

You haven't lost your rights or your freedoms Yes I absolutely have. We all have.

What freedoms have I lost? I can see my friends, go for walks, do photography outdoors, go food shopping, go internet shopping for almost anything, make cakes. Order take outs. I didn’t go to pubs or bars anyway. I can work from home more which gives me more freedom.

We all have.

Nope.

[quote Notspecialflake]@TheSunIsStillShining yes some stupid names but also some very credible scientists. It has not been written off as nonsense at all.[/quote]
It has. By Dr Fauci, the WHO, Chris Whitty, the Federation of American Scientists, the Academy of Medical Sciences and many others.

Dr. Anthony Fauci, director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, called the declaration "ridiculous" and "total nonsense" in an interview with ABC News.
www.politifact.com/factchecks/2020/oct/27/facebook-posts/great-barrington-herd-immunity-document-widely-dis/

www.wired.co.uk/article/great-barrington-declaration-herd-immunity-scientific-divide

acmedsci.ac.uk/more/news/navigating-covid-19-through-the-volume-of-competing-voices

@CoffeeandCroissant yes, it's been criticised by scientists with an opposing view. Wow! The Professor of Evidence-Based Medicine at Oxford is one of the signatories good enough for me. Heneghan, Gupta... These people aren't idiots and are esteemed in their fields. Who knows who is right but it's not nonsense. In fact, the only proven nonsense comes from UK scientists who have been criticised by the ONS for their dodgy stats. Don't dismiss something suggesting lockdown is misguided because those advising for the lockdown dismiss it. It's hardly surprising they would say that

@CoffeeandCroissant
I don't understand how you have the will to say the same thing again and again. When there is obviously no hope of it reaching that one lonely brain cell in some people's mind.

Lockdown is not designed to prevent people dying. The purpose is to prevent hospitals being overwhelmed.

Hospitals becoming overwhelmed would cause huge numbers of deaths, from multiple causes, not just Covid. You can't save the life of someone who's been in a car accident if the surgeons are off sick with Covid.

Hospitals have a finite amount of space and equipment - if they are overwhelmed by patient numbers then sick and dying people will be turned away. Although judging by some posts on this thread, I wouldn't be surprised if some people started to suggest that if the hospitals became overwhelmed, elderly and vulnerable people shouldn't be allowed treatment for any medical issue and resources should be saved for younger people.

The Great Barrington Bullshit was funded by the Koch Brother billionaires.

They also deny climate change.

There is too much wooooo on this thread. Great Barrington is a laughing stock.

There must be a shortage of tin foil by now.

*"All samples need to have 2 genes amplified at Ct

Apologies, Dr John Lee

www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-way-covid-deaths-are-being-counted-is-a-national-scandal

@Notspecialflake

I haven't watched this particular scientist so I don't know exactly what is being said. But I agree lockdown is potentially misguided. The vast majority of people dying from Covid are very old. The average age of death from Covid is higher than the average life expectancy. It's clear that most (not all) deaths are amongst those near the end of their lives. If you look a the 2020 stats for cause of deaths (ONS website), the normal leading causes of death (e.g.dementia/pneumonia/ cerebrovascular disease etc etc.) are almost all BELOW the 5 year average. So Covid is replacing other causes of deaths from those who would otherwise have died quite soon. 600,000 people die in the UK every year. Yes there are excess deaths this year but not just from Covid. Lockdown has caused loads of deaths too - and will be killing more young people than Covid is. People saying things like - tell the relative of a Covid victim that lockdown is wrong Such a ridiculous argument. People die from many causes, many of which are preventable if society were to lockdown on a more or less permanent basis. We have always accepted these risks before. We don't lockdown every winter to prevent the thousands of flu deaths that wouldn't occur if we all stayed at home (and please don't jump on the "COVID ISN'T FLU!' bandwagon. I know that. I'm just talking about the measures we are prepared to take to prevent death from any cause during our lives. Loads of infectious diseases and accidents kill people all the time. We don't normally weigh down in favour of stopping life to prevent deaths. We normally accept death as a risk of life and carry on.) I'm not saying Covid deaths aren't sad. They are. I'm not worried about lockdown because I don't care about people. I'm worried about lockdown because I do care about people. Mental health, jobs, homes, precious time with family and friends during our short lives, childhoods, youth are all so important. I am against extreme restrictions on an indefinite basis on citizens in order to protect the mainly very elderly (who have already enjoyed all the freedoms we are denying younger people) The impact on mental health and livelihoods and quality of life for those with years ahead of them is too high a cost. There has to be a balance - I'm all in favour of social distancing/ masks/ hygiene/ some restrictions. But not living in an open prison indefinitely, as we are now. It's easy for those in power to make us live this way - their jobs ,income and sense of purpose in life isn't affected at all while ordinary people despair in their living rooms. It's not cold and heartless to think that we are perhaps sacrificing too much.

I totally agree

Just saw something on Twitter that can be summarised as:

If your uninformed opinion directly contradicts the general expert consensus please consider "they know things I don't know" may be more valid than "I alone have solved this puzzle".

It may be that restrictions on movement and the subsequent impact on the economy has been the plan most countries are following for a reason.

Why would you throw the masks abs hand washing out the window? Sure, you may think lockdown is not the right action but throwing away all measures is just stupid. It's not all or nothing.

*Except it's not 50k deaths out of a population of 66.9 mil.

It's 50k deaths from an infection in the populations of 1.4 million people.*

Just highlighting this.

It's 50k deaths from an infection in the populations of 1.4 million people

1.4m who have been identified. Many more have had the virus.