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Secondary schools are fucked

467 replies

noblegiraffe · 31/10/2020 11:45

The latest ONS data for infection rates in pupils in Y7-11 shows that they are now nearly as high for university students, the ones who were getting blamed for catching it at pubs and parties.

The latest data for number of cases per 100,000 in each year group looks alarming, even more so when you realise that the latest column is an underestimate. The figures for Y11 in particular are horrendous, and this is a crucial exam year group.

Attendance data for secondary schools is going down each week - 82% according to the latest data (excluding those on half term).

On 22nd October an estimated 557,000 pupils were off school, either isolating, or with covid (this includes primaries, I can't see the data for just secondaries).

On 22nd October, 55% of secondary schools had at least 1 pupil self-isolating due to contact with a case in school.

There is, as far as a I can see, no discussion from those in charge about what to do about this. Schools are a priority, except when it comes to talking about them. Data is hidden, covered up or just ignored. People use arguments about primary schools (parents need to work!) to apply to all ages of pupil.

Secondary schools were set up with 'bubbles'. Risk assessments were based on premise that bubbles would be mixing, and would be sent home if there were cases. This was abandoned a few weeks into term when the DfE elbowed PHE out of the way and took over the the decisions about who would be sent home. Now only 'close contacts' are sent home rather than whole bubbles, which makes no sense in the context of what we know about covid transmission in poorly ventilated spaces with no social distancing. Kids who were told that they could mix 'because they were in a bubble' are now wondering why they're in a bubble but not in a bubble in any meaningful sense.

If, when it comes to any upcoming lockdown, the message is 'schools will stay open' and there is no distinguishing between primary and secondary, and no discussion about how this trend in secondary can be addressed, then be aware that any lockdown isn't going to solve the problem because it's spreading in secondary schools.

PS: I don't want schools to close but they shouldn't stay open as they are because the data shows there's a real problem with as they are. I do want a discussion about specifically secondary so talk about primary elsewhere. If you find the data scary then that's a problem with the situation, not me posting it. I don't want any anecdotes about how your school hasn't had any cases unless you put the word 'yet' at the end of it. If your school has masks everywhere that's great for your school, but the government says their use should be avoided in classrooms and their use in corridors is only mandated in lockdown areas. Schools are not all open in Europe.

Some suggestions: masks, ventilation, review of who is being sent home, regular testing (especially if there are cases), review of fines for pupils who would be safer at home, review of working conditions for ECV teachers, it to be made clear that if a school sends your child home they are legally required to isolate.

Secondary schools are fucked
Secondary schools are fucked
OP posts:
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noblegiraffe · 31/10/2020 12:19

Because the government says so, howsers. No idea why not, probably they want to discourage kids from getting tests.

OP posts:
OverTheRainbow88 · 31/10/2020 12:20

How’s this thread any different to all your others?

Can’t you go back and read everyone’s suggestions on all the other ones you’ve created about this?

noblegiraffe · 31/10/2020 12:22

How’s this thread any different to all your others?

New data, Rainbow and an upcoming lockdown where schools are supposedly staying open.

What is the point of you coming on my threads?

OP posts:
RigaBalsam · 31/10/2020 12:22

I agree what is the point in a lockdown when it's increasing like that in schools.

Seeing it everyday too is obvious why. Bubbles of 250 in close contact. Adults in rooms together ok at 2m but that doesn't negate it. Then there's the buses the canteen staff and the kids all mixing on ybe way home.

canigooutyet · 31/10/2020 12:23

Because the government put it in the guidelines Howsers.

theluckiest · 31/10/2020 12:24

@Hmmph

GCSEs and A Levels should take into the pandemic- either by some kind of reduced syllabus or teacher assessment (not algorithms!).

But I think SATs should be taken unchanged as usual. We need to see the effect of Covid on education and this is the easiest and fairest way to measure it.

I know this thread is mainly about secondary (sorry Noble!) but couldn't let this go unchallenged.

SATS are an enormous waste of time. Particularly KS1.
If we want our children's (& teachers) mental health to suffer even more, yeah, let's keep SATS. As a primary teacher, I tell you now that teachers will be pressured to get children to 'pass' SATS and all the lovely fun stuff will go out of the window. As will all the ways to try and get children back into how to learn and enjoy it. As will proper, deep learning - SATS test what a kid can remember for a test, not what they can really do.

Even more so this year as the children have a hell of a lot of gaps to fill.

Keeping SATS will tell you one main thing - that young children have missed 6 months of school. No shit, Sherlock. And instead of trying to address this, we will be forced to temporarily try and plug gaps to pass a bloody test which will then instantly be forgotten. It's a total waste of everyone's time and detrimental to children's education.

As you were...Grin

Mistressiggi · 31/10/2020 12:24

Masks are coming in to Scottish secondary schools in higher tiers. Will have to wait to see if it has any impact.
Classes might be smaller as I see parents on fb saying they won't send teenagers in if they have to wear masks all day!

ihearttc · 31/10/2020 12:25

As far as I’m aware DS1’s school (he is in Y11) have had no cases at all. Definitely none in his year and I’ve got friends with children in other years and nothing there either. The only difference between his school and other schools that I can tell is that they all need to wear masks 100% of the time, in class, in corridors and outside. They are allowed to take them off to eat and drink but must be put back on immediately. I must admit I was very angry about it in August before they went back but it doesn’t bother the kids and for the moment at least it seems to be working. Surely it would make sense to trial that approach in all schools before closing them all?

BelleSausage · 31/10/2020 12:26

Totally agree with all you’ve said @noblegiraffe

This is exactly what teachers on the Staffroom threads predicted would happen. It frustrates me so much that there was a chance to provide a more consistent style of schooling but the government CBA.

canigooutyet · 31/10/2020 12:27

Does it really matter if there is another thread about this issue?
There's loads about furlough and everything else when there's an update, education shouldn't be any different.

If it wasn't because of people like the op then there would be very little talk about education during CV.

howsers · 31/10/2020 12:29

@canigooutyet but what is the reasoning? data protection?

howsers · 31/10/2020 12:30

I mean it seems ludicrous

EternalOptimist7 · 31/10/2020 12:30

DD11 is in year 7. Her year had to self isolate a few weeks ago as a boy in her tutor group tested positive. Miraculously they have had no more cases & thank goodness DD escaped, despite having close contact with the boy

EndoplasmicReticulum · 31/10/2020 12:31

If only the government had been less than useless and prepared to spend a bit of money to save some in the long run, things could have been organised over lockdown / the summer to make the schools safer.

From my personal point of view - I have a year 11 and a year 10. I'd be happy to home school them at least up to Christmas, but the uncertainty over exams means I dare not take the year 11 out, in case we're in a CAG situation again. Plus that choice isn't there - it's go to school or get a fine.

noblegiraffe · 31/10/2020 12:32

I started this thread because there was someone on another thread still insisting that the problem was in university students. And yes, there are more recorded cases in university students but that's because they've had mass testing in universities. What would it look like if there was mass testing in secondary schools?

Instead every time I go on twitter I see promoted posts from the DfE telling me only to get my child tested if they suffer one of the three main adult symptoms that children mostly don't get when they have covid.

OP posts:
canigooutyet · 31/10/2020 12:32

@howsers
No idea. There's no rationalisation for it. Email your mp and ask them.

howsers · 31/10/2020 12:33

If it wasn't because of people like the op then there would be very little talk about education during CV.

I disagree, I would wager a high % of MNs have school aged children so there would definitely be interest.

As a parent I think it has been made very clear that another school closure is not what the gov want & they will try to avoid it.

howsers · 31/10/2020 12:35

@canigooutyet why doesn't the OP do that then?

See this is what I meant by no discussion 😆

howsers · 31/10/2020 12:35

I'm out

noblegiraffe · 31/10/2020 12:36

why doesn't the OP do that then?

My MP replied with a bland cut and paste response that didn't actually address any of the points raised in my email. He's useless.

OP posts:
CodenameVillanelle · 31/10/2020 12:36

@SpookyNoise

Schools need to close to break the cycle of Covid.
Hmm The cycle of covid isn't going to be broken until we have a vaccine.
Aesopfable · 31/10/2020 12:36

@SpookyNoise

Schools need to close to break the cycle of Covid.
What does that even mean?
Mistressiggi · 31/10/2020 12:36

Why can't you do it? Is the OP your mum Hmm

Teateaandmoretea · 31/10/2020 12:37

You are wrong OP, only year 11 and above have higher incidence than the national average across all age groups. This bearing in mind they are in school is surprising.

Unfortunately the exam years it doesn’t look grea, however.

canigooutyet · 31/10/2020 12:38

I am amazed that the official symptoms don't mention the main ones for younger people. It's no wonder this is ripping through schools as it is.

Around a third of ds secondary was closed by the end of half term. No ventilation, all lessons in one class, lunch by year group, masks worn in corridors and if they want a mask can be worn in class, which the majority were.

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