New rules Monday.

[PineappleUpsideDownCake]

Looks like England may be following Scotland. Or parts of England? Or new levels to be announced!? Who knows...

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-54457377

I've found it interesting that a couple of posters have pointed to 'the North' not following the rules, and why should they be locked down when they have doing everything right.

Sorry, but rule breaking is happening everywhere. Andy Burnham (Mayor of Greater Manchester) also posted some interesting statistics about the North West coming out of lockdown at higher levels than when London went into lockdown in March. Basically a London centric approach. There have been other articles about coronavirus being endemic in the North.

www.theguardian.com/world/2020/sep/05/covid-19-could-be-endemic-in-deprived-parts-of-england

The North is generally poorer, have more manual jobs out of the home and is obviously densely populated that many parts of the south. We drove through Rochdale on route to holiday in the Summer and it was absolutely chocka.

I don't really know what the answer is, but I guess at least wanted to respond to the North's situation not being solely down to general behaviour.

@PennyDreadfuI

I'm in the north east and the local lockdown here has done absolutely nothing. When it started we were on about 100/100,000 and now we're on about 450/100,000. So tighter restrictions here seem inevitable. I really hope that they're over in good time for Christmas though, particularly if non essential shops have to close.

thing is the north is massive, I'm also in the north east and we have next to no cases round here, we had an outbreak nearly 2 months ago with 14 people infected and it was identified fast and fixed

no outbreaks since just the very odd isolated case which are being isolated quickly and controlled since but we are getting locked down because the city areas like newcastle, gateshead and sunderland (not even in the same county as us... litrally like an hours drive from my parents whose village is covid free) are have outbreaks, its really not fair

I'm in one of the local lockdown areas in the north (Grt Man/West Yorks area) and the way I see it is

People here in general have not been following the guidelines
People here have not used the T&T app

It's as simple as that

In shops about 60% are bothering to wear masks. Havent seen anyone yet scan the QR codes at the entrance. Some big chains haven't even got the QR code to scan, even though some small independent shops have. What's that all about?

The Gov't can out things in place but if people do not follow the rules, then it won't work will it? Then they whine here that lockdown isn't working

Anyone see the figures reported on sky news earlier about where transmission is occurring in England?

Schools and universities; 38%
Workplaces; 26%
Care homes; 18%
Food and hospitality; 4%
Hospitals; 3%

Which leaves 11% maximum for household. Of course some of that percentage would go to 'unknown' such as getting it from travelling on the bus or brought in from international travel.

The fact that people think this can be eradicated by us stopping houses from seeing each other when there are facts like this out there is ridiculous. Its really clear that Johnson is simply putting these restrictions on eating out and seeing family as a show, not as a realistic way of bringing down numbers.

Squidge they're intentionally dodging the schools issue arent they.

Im surprised workplaces is so high. They're still sating work from home if you can and the insistence on covid secure etc. Scary its still so high even with that.

I agree @SqidgeBum

Closing restaurants and not letting us see our parents is NOT the answer!

It’s NOT how it’s spreading. It’s spreading in academic settings and workplaces where there are lots of people together. Grrr.

I’m in NW/Manchester area and I disagree that people aren’t following the rules. The vast majority are doing their absolute best. Yes there are a few exceptions but not many. Everywhere I go it’s track and trace. Rarely see a person without a mask and the saddest thing is that no-one socialises anymore where I live 😔

The proposed Tier 3 restrictions include no contact whatsoever outside the home, it seems. So no support bubbles.

If this comes to pass I think it'll be too far for many. For a lot of people it amounts to sheer cruelty.

@Sunshiney1981
Agree I’m also in GM- can’t speak for the area as a whole but people are very compliant where I am

They're still sating work from home if you can and the insistence on covid secure etc.

'If you can' means 'if your boss will let you'. Anecdotally, those that had returned to the office when Johnson said they should, have not been allowed to return to working from home. It's only those that had continued working from home who are still doing so.

As for covid secure, that was nothing more than a box ticking exercise for the government to claim it was safe.

@ChaChaCha2012 I agree, businesses finally got people back into the office after making it 'covid secure', then the gov did the u turn... business were never going to send everyone back home again - most people work better in the office. I agree they should never have said return to the office, it's a joke.

@PennyDreadfuI

The proposed Tier 3 restrictions include no contact whatsoever outside the home, it seems. So no support bubbles.

If this comes to pass I think it'll be too far for many. For a lot of people it amounts to sheer cruelty.

I agree. I am due a baby in 3 weeks. If they tell me I am not allowed have any support from family during that time, I simply wont comply. I wont be a part of this ridiculous charade. Me sitting at home with a toddler and a newborn, alone as DH will have to go back to work pretty soon after, losing my mind, wont fix this. I am not prepared to lose my sanity playing up to the governments show, when the figures clearly show me seeing my mother isnt the issue. The facts are in black and white, and I am going to use the brain in my head when making my decisions.

@SqidgeBum

Anyone see the figures reported on sky news earlier about where transmission is occurring in England?

Schools and universities; 38%
Workplaces; 26%
Care homes; 18%
Food and hospitality; 4%
Hospitals; 3%

Which leaves 11% maximum for household. Of course some of that percentage would go to 'unknown' such as getting it from travelling on the bus or brought in from international travel.

The fact that people think this can be eradicated by us stopping houses from seeing each other when there are facts like this out there is ridiculous. Its really clear that Johnson is simply putting these restrictions on eating out and seeing family as a show, not as a realistic way of bringing down numbers.

this is my point too

pubs/resteraunts but that accounts for only 3-4% of cases

my DS school hasnt had an 'outbreak' but has had to shut down 3 different years and undergo mass isolations because of 1 case and in such close proxity could spread so fast if the dont take precautions it would be an outbreak (so thats over 200 kids have had to isolate for 14 days)

the major hot spot are all around the universities, Northumbria being the biggest with over 770 cases (which is skewing the whole north easts numbers)

but instead of acting on this they are talking about shutting hospitality industry to curb the spread (not where the infections are coming from) to save jobs (by making thousands have redundant) to keep the schools open (where the infections actually are) so that people can go to the jobs they no longer have

the school set up a portal so isolated kids can learn online via distanced learning... like why is this not already the way?

The issue with closing schools is childcare. People cant go to work if their kid is off school, so the government need to keep the schools open as a form of childcare to ensure the taxes keep coming in from people going to work. People who travel to work also pay money for lunches, petrol or public transport, which all goes back into the governments pocket through taxes. They cant afford to lose that.

Also, the WFH numbers have massively decreased. I know people in offices who have been told to come in despite BJs 'work from home' stance, because in the weeks prior to him saying 'work from home' he encouraged them to go back, so the offices went to extreme lengths to make places covid secure and now insist on them being back in. The traffic in the mornings has definitely increased in the past 4-6 weeks.

@bettsbattenburg

I just hope they don't say schools have to be open in half term, my DCs need a break.

And what on earth has led you to think that this may be being considered ??!

@Strawberrypancakes - I’m with you too.

Schools and universities; 38%
Workplaces; 26%
Care homes; 18%
Food and hospitality; 4%
Hospitals; 3%

The schools/university number will mostly be universities and colleges

The transmission in actual "schools" is quite low

@SqidgeBum - I saw those figures on a Facebook post but after searching various sites I can’t find where the figures came from. Do you have a link?

@Topseyt

But you are not being told you cannot visit your elderly parents if they have a health scare , if they are in their own home, you have always been able to do this . Lockdown starting in March did not prevent this and none of the local lockdowns prevent this . Providing care to a vulnerable family member has always been an exception .

Schools and universities; 38%
Workplaces; 26%
Care homes; 18%
Food and hospitality; 4%
Hospitals; 3%

It seems madness to shut down all hospitality on those figures. Will there be any hospitality to reopen? Rishi told everyone in the arts to retrain/get other jobs but all the traditional 'resting' jobs are redundant at the moment.

@Cheetosforbreakfast I got them from scrolling down the live feed on sky news, link below. Its from 11:02am this morning.

news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-live-latest-news-updates-new-restrictions-mooted-for-covid-hotspots-amid-fears-virus-is-spiralling-out-of-control-12091312

Schools and universities; 38%
Workplaces; 26%
Care homes; 18%
Food and hospitality; 4%
Hospitals; 3%

I do wonder how this list distinguishes between university and food/hospitality? Young people go out a lot for leisure but many are also go to uni and college, or if not, some of their mates do

How is known if it was caught in a pub or a uni? Seeing as a lot of young people are in and out of them both all the time

Huge student numbers in Manchester, Liverpool and Newcastle
(possibly the children of the southerners pointing the finger and the people of Northern cities for "ignoring the rules". Seriously I am done with this divisive shit)

Also, more people working in factories/distribution/manual and front line work, proportionately in the areas most affected.

Lots of school and bubble closures round here too.

Smacks of the second round of "managed decline" for the north as per Thatcher policy

@Flaxmeadow

I'm in one of the local lockdown areas in the north (Grt Man/West Yorks area) and the way I see it is

People here in general have not been following the guidelines
People here have not used the T&T app

It's as simple as that

In shops about 60% are bothering to wear masks. Havent seen anyone yet scan the QR codes at the entrance. Some big chains haven't even got the QR code to scan, even though some small independent shops have. What's that all about?

The Gov't can out things in place but if people do not follow the rules, then it won't work will it? Then they whine here that lockdown isn't working

I totally agree with this.

People complaining about test / track & trace not working but when people are contacted there are huge numbers of people refusing to isolate , and people not filling in the trace details to start with .

People whining 'I'm so over this no-one is going to stop me seeing my family ' when it's been shown that in many areas this was the cause of transmission. And, to be fair , see your family, but see them a couple of people at a time and keep your distance , don't crowd into a room .

I don't think that they need to shut down hospitality . If people remain on tables of 6 (or better still within their own household ), and everyone wears face covering when moving around they should be fairly safe .

If people just adhered to the rules currently in place there wouldn't be any need for additional restrictions.

@Flaxmeadow

Schools and universities; 38% Workplaces; 26% Care homes; 18% Food and hospitality; 4% Hospitals; 3%

I do wonder how this list distinguishes between university and food/hospitality? Young people go out a lot for leisure but many are also go to uni and college, or if not, some of their mates do

How is known if it was caught in a pub or a uni? Seeing as a lot of young people are in and out of them both all the time

Very true, if DD at uni gets it I think the chances that she contracted it in a busy lecture theatre are vanishingly small

I suspect that the new figures showing less cases being transmitted within homes are due to the restrictions in place around visiting people in their homes, and where people are adhering to the guidance then . This is different to what was being said a few weeks back but makes sense .!