Children have been particularly impacted by this outbreak in Leicester

[DomDoesWotHeWants]

Schools will be closed as Leicester goes into lock down again.

Hancock confirmed on Sky news this morning that children could pass on the virus.

So why do people expect teachers to go back to work in September with no social distancing or PPE?

So many people here say it has to happen but at what risk to school staff? Do people think it's ok to put them at risk?

I don't.

Go on then... How do we build it into our opening plans without sacrificing childrens education and socialisation?

The proposed details were leaked to the Huffington Post yesterday. It's going to be a necessary pain in the arse, I absolutely agree

@Barbie222

Go on then... How do we build it into our opening plans without sacrificing childrens education and socialisation?

The proposed details were leaked to the Huffington Post yesterday. It's going to be a necessary pain in the arse, I absolutely agree

But.... Other posters are saying the plans are "back to normal" so which is it?

@Barbie222

Yet it is only schools that people feel the need to keep shut in order to prevent mass transmission

No, schools are open at the absolute maximum that they can to prevent "mass transmission" and even that didn't work in Leicester. Maybe you perceive schools to be shut and that's annoying for you, but that's going to be the case for any restaurant, plane or business which is full before you can get in. It is only shut for the customer who can't get in at the moment.

Oh yes because not having a school place is JUST LIKE not being able to get a table in a restaurant isn't it?

What a fucking stupid comparison.

It's going to be both a complete pain in the arse AND completely ineffectual at preventing spread - pretty much the worst of both worlds.

Visors are better than nothing, I’d be happier with that for teachers and all other plans as listed in leaked document.

A friend works at a school in Leicester and a child was known to have tested positive. If you were to know how they’ve handled it you’d be horrified.

I feel like I post this every day on here, but this Covid crisis will go on and on until we get a grip, face the facts and get this virus under control - and that means getting a functional community contact tracing programme up and running.

@ChavvySexPond

I feel like I post this every day on here, but this Covid crisis will go on and on until we get a grip, face the facts and get this virus under control - and that means getting a functional community contact tracing programme up and running.

Of course that's what we need but none of us can do fuck all about that and in the mean time our children need an education and most of us need to work.

Haven't rtft (i know, sorry..) but just wanted to reply to a question.
I'm vulnerable - not quite shielding, but borderline. I have a heart condition that means ordinary infections can be quite serious for me. I'm also a teacher.
I'm already back at school. There is nothing in place for us - government guidelines say 'do a risk assessment' but also that we mustn't wear PPE. The older kids are meant to be able to social distance but can't/don't. But i need my job to pay my bills and live, I don't have a choice. And there aren't enough teachers without clinically vulnerable in.
So by all means talk about getting children all back to school, but don't do so labouring under the misapprehension that vulnerable teachers are being protected. We aren't.

*We need a lot more information to make any sort of judgement:1. Did the children testing positive catch it at school, home or elsewhere

1. When there have been positive cases in children attending school, has that child passed it to 0 others, 1 other, 15 others? Totally critical to understand this, but it clearly isn't 15 as we've had heard about it. the schools have closed to get people to take it seriously and nip it in the bud I'd have thought, not because the schools were causing a problem.*

Exactly this. Ffs.

@ImInYourMindFuzz

A friend works at a school in Leicester and a child was known to have tested positive. If you were to know how they’ve handled it you’d be horrified.

Pray tell?

@nellodee

It's going to be both a complete pain in the arse AND completely ineffectual at preventing spread - pretty much the worst of both worlds.

And make it much harder to actually educate children. There is no way bubbles of 240 in a year will work, even if you can keep the children separate in school - they have relatives in other years, they get on buses, they live near each other. The way the guidance is worded I think is so that when there are outbreaks in schools they can blame the school for not following the guidance, even though some bits are impossible.

But if teachers stand at least 1m or 2m away at the front of the class, surely they can teach.

This just isn't possible in a primary class, especially the younger children. Very little of the time is spent standing in front of the class "teaching". Most of it is spent helping children with a task. There is a great limit on the amount of valuable learning that can be done in a KS1 classroom with the teacher 1m away from everyone. I've been in a KS1 bubble since June 1st and even with just 10 children in there, it's impossible to do everything from the front.

We can limit contact between classes but I can't see how it can be done within the classroom.

So how exactly do you propose to find out

A) who the child/ adult/ teacher caught it from
B) who the child passed it on to.

This information may never be available. The best they seem to be able to do is identify trends based on versions of the virus with different mutations.

Until the government is set up to test everyone in a bubble when there is a positive case we will have no idea how prevalent the virus is.

Let's not forget when there was a flare up in China the Chinese tested a couple of million to get on top of it

There was an article in the Guardian today that suggested that the guidelines were one of Cumming's cunning plans to make it look like teachers and their unions were the ones responsible for the lack of education for children. By making completely unworkable plans, they can then blame it on us when we say "This doesn't work, it isn't safe." And by extension, Johnson scores points over Starmer. Again, this is the government treating the pandemic as a public relations crisis, rather than a public health crisis.

Oh my stars! I have just finished writing all my school reports and so have had a full day online teaching as well as being attached to SIMS.

Just casting my mind back to a few weeks ago when teachers were the subject of so much vitriol that some of us were considering boycotting threads. We were told that children (by parents on these forums) could not catch the virus. We were told that children (by parents on these forums) that children could not spread the virus. we have been told (you get the drift) that we should not have PPE. We have been told that we do not need SD in schools.

Yet all other workplaces seem to have PPE/SD/WFH rotas etc.

How times have changed!

@nellodee

There was an article in the Guardian today that suggested that the guidelines were one of Cumming's cunning plans to make it look like teachers and their unions were the ones responsible for the lack of education for children. By making completely unworkable plans, they can then blame it on us when we say "This doesn't work, it isn't safe." And by extension, Johnson scores points over Starmer. Again, this is the government treating the pandemic as a public relations crisis, rather than a public health crisis.

Ah yes, the guardian the well known completely non bias source.

@ChavvySexPond

I feel like I post this every day on here, but this Covid crisis will go on and on until we get a grip, face the facts and get this virus under control - and that means getting a functional community contact tracing programme up and running.

What they said ⬆️

@TrustTheGeneGenie peace and love! Lots of raised voices. It's a pain for everyone. I'm a parent of children who are currently not in school, too.

Unfortunately, at the end of the day, schools are just like any other service, necessarily limited in scope as to what it can provide within budget and legal restrictions.

Not "such a fucking difference" after all between schools and the rest of the world, then. We can't work miracles. I think that's why we are all annoyed, no? No need to stamp and shout, as if that can change the realities of the virus.

The proposed plans look like they do as much as is possible, and like it if not we'll clearly have to get used to local lockdowns.

The telegraph article said children under 18s had caught it at an ‘alarming rate’.

[quote Barbie222]@TrustTheGeneGenie peace and love! Lots of raised voices. It's a pain for everyone. I'm a parent of children who are currently not in school, too.

Unfortunately, at the end of the day, schools are just like any other service, necessarily limited in scope as to what it can provide within budget and legal restrictions.

Not "such a fucking difference" after all between schools and the rest of the world, then. We can't work miracles. I think that's why we are all annoyed, no? No need to stamp and shout, as if that can change the realities of the virus.

The proposed plans look like they do as much as is possible, and like it if not we'll clearly have to get used to local lockdowns.[/quote]
I agree with the guidelines for schools, I agree it's pretty much all they can do though I can see it causing problems.

I think we need more research. Local lockdowns are all well and good but it would be so much better if we knew what the actual problem was and didn't have to shut everything down. I don't think people will tolerate it.

Obviously the tracing app has been a shit show but then apparently the actual people ringing folk haven't got that much work to do so who knows. I don't think local lockdowns are the answer myself. They only work whilst people comply, and they won't. It's spreading because people are clearly not complying.

The telegraph article said children under 18s had caught it at an ‘alarming rate’.

Does it cite numbers?

Hard to know what is happening. Is prevalence so high in Leicester that number of children is in line with that

Sen teacher here, clinically vulnerable, mid 40s. I've been lucky enough to wfh. I'm expecting to be going back in sept. Don't feel confident about it and I'm fairly certain my asthma will struggle with it; it starts to struggle in the winter anyway. Who knows? I've had post viral fatigue before so preparing to have to deal with it. So far my school have really thought of staff and been supportive. I have no idea how long they can carry on without staff.

Sen is hands on, we have no ppe. Zero chance to stand at the front so to speak. We don't do that. Children are unpredictable.

I agree we need schools to go back. The guidance leak was bonkers.

It's not just staffing and space. The previous guidance was also centred around toilets and cleaning. That takes time and coordination. That actually affects a lot of what we can feasibly do.

There will be a plan a, the ideal, and a part time contingency plan for schools in sept. It's the only way we can go back.

There was an article in the Guardian today that suggested that the guidelines were one of Cumming's cunning plans to make it look like teachers and their unions were the ones responsible for the lack of education for children. By making completely unworkable plans, they can then blame it on us when we say "This doesn't work, it isn't safe." And by extension, Johnson scores points over Starmer. Again, this is the government treating the pandemic as a public relations crisis, rather than a public health crisis.
Yes, this is exactly what has been going on. The government is very happy to paint teachers as workshy wasters. Tory governments always do.

If children are being taught in groups of 15 then there is potential for them to make better progress as they have more individual attention.

Absolutely this.

The class sizes in the U.K. are bonkers compared to those in the EU which are generally 15-20, in some countries up to 25 absolute max for older children/ teens.

We have y3 classes of 34, 30 at ks1.