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Original poster

Narcissistic ex is "shielding" should he see dd

231 replies

kipperthedog · 30/03/2020 11:52

Hello all, hope everyone is keeping safe and well. My narc ex is extremely difficult and is using the current circumstances to be even more so. He's putting demands on me (and therefore dd) to protect his own health and making this time extremely stressful. His demands should go without saying such as distancing etc but he always makes out I'm a bad parent and wants it in writing that I agree to these things. Having spoken to her this morning, he says he's had a text to say he has to stay in for 12 weeks. As a chronic asthmatic I assume this means he has been told to "shield". My question to you is should dd go to his next week for 10 days as planned? He has no outside space so she will be cooped indoors apart from daily exercise - which if he adheres to the advice he won't be taking. As far as I can see he should be isolating from her.

Any advice welcome thanks Smile

OP posts:
TooTrusting · 07/04/2020 14:37

OP: "That wouldn't take into account his increased risk or how she would feel if he got it and died after she been there..?"

They may consider this if you can show he is down playing his vulnerability and risking his health for the sake of continuing contact. But I think you'd have to show she is already aware of this issue and anxious about it, when you are sayings she isn't. If she isn't joining those dots and he does die, why would she subsequently blame herself?

Point out in your message that you are genuinely worried about his health and his denial of being at risk. The important thing here is for DD to have a father who remains alive by taking a sensible long term view in light of the virus's highly contagious nature and suspending direct contact, not one who sacrifices his health and possibly his life for the short term gain of seeing her now.

In your communication with him making the proposals, you need to say that if he decides to leave her with you you can review the situation in, say, a month (when rules and recommendations may have been relaxed) And in the meantime she can FaceTime him every day at a set time.

Reassure him that you are not motivated by stopping contact but ensuring DD has a dad who stays healthy and alive (even though he is unlikely to listen).

If you think the DP is more reasonable, copy it to him. He too will want his DP to stay healthy and alive.

TooTrusting · 07/04/2020 14:48

Your weakness here is that the only thing the court will consider is DD's welfare/best interests.
Her going to him is a risk to HIM, not her. Even if he is a 12 weeker, he's saying he isn't going to observe it. Foolish, but his choice and he isn't putting DD or anyone else at risk.
I think the "how will DD feel if he dies, she'll blame herself" argument is a bit remote.
I understand the cooped up point, but again this is a bit remote. It's better to be cooped up and see DF than not see him. Lots of DCs are cooped up in flats. That's a matter for him to deal with. If it went to court, a judge could accept the argument and split the time up a bit, or may just leave it. As a PP pointed out, splitting up the10 days into shorter chunks increases movement and risk.

TooTrusting · 07/04/2020 14:55

Btw, I'm not unsympathetic on a personal level. I'm trying to demonstrate why the court may not agree with your stance. As I've pointed out, things have changed significantly since you started the thread.

I come across his type all the time. Determined to have "his" 50% at any cost.

Original poster
kipperthedog · 07/04/2020 16:15

So I forked out for a solicitor appointment this afternoon. They said that basically I have no case as the risk is his and court wouldn't see my concerns as valid and would most likely enforce the order. So I've back tracked and told him that I am willing for dd to go for 5 days and make up the other 5 in the summer holidays. He's playing games already by saying he's excited to be seeing her and he's in meetings so can't reply properly until tonight (when he told dd he had no work to do as he's caught up with it all) but can I confirm FaceTime at 7pm. I've said I want arrangements confirmed first. Everything is about control with him. I feel quite deflated and wonder still if I've done the right thing.

OP posts:
TooTrusting · 07/04/2020 16:49

If you frame it as I suggested - that you had only done what you did because of the fuss he made about being vulnerable - then it's not too much of a climb down OP.

TooTrusting · 07/04/2020 16:58

Don't feel deflated.

He created this situation by being a dick and demanding that you observed social distancing at home, because he was vulnerable and in the 12 week category. This was either true or a lie.

Either way, he then massively backtracked when you (quite rightly at the time) said you wouldn't allow DD to move between homes.

You then reconsidered what you should do. Which was entirely proper and appropriate.

So he's the one with egg on his face. Not you.

Original poster
kipperthedog · 07/04/2020 18:10

Thanks @TooTrusting will wait to see what he has to say in response later. No doubt more messing about to be done yet. He won't ever be satisfied or stop haunting me. Time to get myself some professional help with how to deal with him I think. It gets to me way too much and I feel totally wrung out, not only that buts he's spoilt my week with dd. If he try's to haggle I don't think I'll be able to cope. Thanks for all your advice today x

OP posts:
Original poster
kipperthedog · 07/04/2020 19:51

Well.. another long FaceTime tonight, no snipey comments and a polite reply to my email saying he's happy to have dd for 5 days (instead of 10) as I requested due to small house issues) and then back to normal after that, making up the 5 missing days in the summer holidays. He says he will inform me if anyone at his house gets ill. Also said he will inform his solicitor when dd gets there.. on good Friday I doubt it!! Not sure he's even done the court application so maybe he's called my bluff back but whatever, it's been a stressful week that's thankfully over in a way and I feel relieved and like I might get some sleep tonight plus dd is looking forward to seeing him so I feel not the worst out come in the end. Thanks again all of you lovelies for your help and advice ThanksSmile

OP posts:
UYScuti · 07/04/2020 20:07

Glad you're OK KipperHalo

TooTrusting · 07/04/2020 20:47

You've successfully navigated this particular crisis. Don't look at it as a win for him. You dealt with your concerns and conceded an issue you should have conceded.

My mantra is pick the battles you can win (and which really matter) - the others are just white noise and you need to learn to let them go.

You are right that you need strategies to deal with him because it's not good for you or DD for him to get to you with every encounter. I have had a horribly abusive relationship which ended 2 years ago and thank my lucky stars we never had a child tying us together.

Original poster
kipperthedog · 07/04/2020 22:25

Thanks @UYScuti 

@TooTrusting yes you're right, thank you. Got there in the end. And hopefully this is the end for now.

Really sorry to hear you had a tough time, hope you're in a much happier place now.

I know I absolutely wouldn't change dd for the world but I do wish he was easier to deal with.

Anyway a good nights sleep is forecast for me thank goodness! Thank you again for all your help, really do appreciate it x

OP posts:
timeisnotaline · 08/04/2020 15:25

Well done op. He’s having to work with you for all he’s pretending he isn’t, and you are doing better and better. He probably won’t play the I’m so vulnerable card again but if he does you can just play the concerned for dd as well as your health card back again.

Original poster
kipperthedog · 08/04/2020 20:33

@timeisnotaline thank you, Yes I hope it'll be ok. Am actually very worried he is going to say one of them has symptoms while she's there and not bring her back. @TooTrusting can I pick your brains on that front please? I assume there would be nothing I can do?

OP posts:
TooTrusting · 08/04/2020 21:15

That's why some people are doing the treating both households as one unit thing. But I do t think you can do that because there's at least one more household involved in your scenario.

You won't be able to force him to hand over a symptomatic child, I don't think. And if he or his DP show symptoms.

Original poster
kipperthedog · 08/04/2020 21:34

Hmm that's what I thought. And so he wouldn't be in breach of the order in that case would he.. he could easily say dp has symptoms without me actually knowing if he was telling the truth or not. This whole situation is just riddled with potential problems. I'm so worried that I'm really wishing I'd stuck to my guns now.

OP posts:
truthisarevolutionaryact · 08/04/2020 22:07

Hopefully OP he wouldn't use your dd like that. Confining her to the flat with him for 14 days??
I'd try to relax and, if he does do this, I'd have a variety of 'casual' rehearsed responses. It seems that getting a reaction from you is important to him so maybe aim to not react or even anticipate the worst. I know it's hard but now you've made your decision and you've been clear that he's not a threat to her - if he decides to play this game then maybe just let him? Flowers

TooTrusting · 09/04/2020 13:14

If you speak to her you will know whether it is true or not.

TooTrusting · 09/04/2020 13:15

You did the right thing. The fear he will a act badly isn't a reason to have kept her. Try not to worry.

midnightstar66 · 09/04/2020 13:28

I think because the risk is to him and not your dd then contact will need to go ahead if he chooses to take that risk. Lots of dc are cooped up without gardens and the 12 weeks is just a suggestion not a rule. Both I and friends (nrp parents too) have taken legal advice and need to send out children (and are allowed their contact) as per court order as long as the nrp aren't putting them at risk/breaking lockdown rules

midnightstar66 · 09/04/2020 13:30

Absolutely message him though and let him know you plan to follow government guidelines but are not prepared to add his extra ones to your restrictions

Original poster
kipperthedog · 10/04/2020 10:36

Thanks all. I really wouldn't put it past him but like you have said I will have to wait and see. Dropped dd off this morning she was really excited to be going and so I'm going to have a few days with my teens and try not to worry!

Hope everyone has a lovely Easter weekend.

OP posts:
midnightstar66 · 10/04/2020 11:11

Fwiw i know how you feel OP. DC are going next week and I'm equally anxious but need to adhere to the order. I know he's not taking the whole thing seriously but he'd lie about that in court just like he's lied about everything else. These men always seem to be believed.

TooTrusting · 10/04/2020 13:15

"let him know you plan to follow government guidelines but are not prepared to add his extra ones to your restrictions"

Actually I wouldn't highlight that now. It may give him an excuse to keep her.

TooTrusting · 10/04/2020 13:16

If he asks you again to observe special measures at home just ask him why, given his denial that he is in the vulnerable class of people

Original poster
kipperthedog · 11/04/2020 09:09

@midnightstar66 yes it's so worrying isn't it. Feels like a horrible game of roulette! Really hope all goes ok for you and your DC's. Trying to put my fears at the back of my mind at the moment but still feeling anxious to look at my emails.

@TooTrusting yes you're right, I'm not going to say anything else to him unless her either says he's not bringing her back or asks me again.

I have everything crossed that it'll all be ok x

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