Worried about coronavirus thread 25

[ofwarren]

Here's the new thread
I'll get Mumsnet to add the links later as I'm busy.

Sebastian Payne
@SebastianEPayne
·
8m
Since mid Feb, Cummings has been driving the government’s approach to coronavurus:

“He operates with a campaign mentality, combined with consistent message and making sure everyone is on the same page and every government department is working together.”

Personally
I think the media are acting irresponsible. The amount of hysteria they are creating is probably more destructive than the virus itself

We now have nations closing borders

I’ve just read up on the flu pandemic 1918 which infected 500m people I/3rd of the worlds population resulting in 50m deaths
The bubonic plague killed 200m

This is nowhere near as dangerous according to what I read online - yet the media is going hell for leather whipping up hysteria.

It’s flu for gods sake. You are not gonna be taken outside and shot!

To think this country spent 7yrs in ww2 - that was grim.
We’ve turned into a nation of snowflakes.

Get a grip

@Brig93

Small children? Not babies? Do they need formula milk?

sixth formers, students & other volunteers enlisted for national campaign to help

Is this a watered-down variation of the Netanyahu idea of using young people to bleach things because they don't die of coronavirus.

It was pointed out that this idea of exposing young people in this way would be politically very unpopular with mothers...

— sixth formers, students & other volunteers enlisted for national campaign to help does that include offspring of the better off, or is it like WW1 where the upper class sit well behind the line sending less well off into the trenches?

I keep reading different things about the peak. Many say we are two weeks away from the peak and that is how we are tracking behind Italy and other sources say the peak will be May/June.

Is there no consensus on when the peak will be?

Alex Wickham
@alexwickham
·
29m
NEW: Britons should get ready for “changes to our way of life and what our country looks like”

— ministers say measures will be extended for months rather than weeks
— lasting from the end of March until at least the summer and “perhaps a lot longer”

Alex Wickham
@alexwickham
·
3m
Replying to
@alexwickham
Johnson allies think the Whitty / Vallance press conferences are good at communicating info to the media

— but have concerns the wider public does not understand herd immunity strategy
— fears that people are either not taking it seriously or panicking

Same here @Delatron but I think the peak being later is a good thing.

To think this country spent 7yrs in ww2 - that was grim.

Total number of UK deaths ww2 = 450,900
Predicted number of COVID-19 deaths (government figures) = 500,000

I keep seeing talk of herd immunity but is there any actual proof you gain any long term immunity to this from having it?

sixth formers, students & other volunteers enlisted for national campaign to help

My sixth formers will still be revising for their exams, not acting as volunteering fodder for the Tory massacre plan.

Delatron I wonder if it's because Italy was essentially concentrated in one area of country (don't known if still case).

But in UK we don't have the same clusters and it is throughout the country.

I have heard 2 weeks from.many bit then they said 4 weeks on the press conference the other day.

@contentedsoul If our government continues to follow their current plans, more people will die in the UK than died in WW2. Read a little bit about what is happening in Italy right now- from doctors and frontline healthcare workers, rather than the media.

More generally, our policy on this should not be decided by what plays well with focus groups. This is not about campaigning- it's about saving lives. We need a PM who is willing to make unpopular decisions right now, rather than working out which slogans play best.

Boris has a massive majority right now. There won't be another election for 5 years (in theory). Surely he can focus on what's right for the country, rather than what's popular for once.

Are the people running these focus groups his "experts"?

fears that people are either not taking it seriously or panicking
The 'neither camp get it' fear

The peak thing is a wide band versus actual peak

Two weeks time is start of the peak period with actual peak in mid to late May / start of June and finishing end of July.

Alex Wickham
@alexwickham
·
9m
One particular area of frustration is NHS 111

— it is severely underperforming, Whitehall officials believe
— No10 exploring how the public can better receive healthcare advice
— including potentially via private tech companies

So we’re doing pandemic planning by focus group?

Is there no consensus on when the peak will be?
Nobody has said we’re two weeks away from the peak. We’re two weeks behind Italy. Italy hasn’t reached their peak yet.

If our government continues to follow their current plans, more people will die in the UK than died in WW2. and in a much shorter time scale. And in a way that was partly preventable due to our own government.

mobile.reuters.com/article/amp/idUSKBN210362?__twitter_impression=true
Germany, Italy rush to buy life-saving ventilators as manufacturers warn of shortages

Germany's Draegerwerk said its government placed an order for 10,000 ventilators for intensive respiratory care, the medical gear maker's largest order ever and equivalent to a year's normal production.

Hard-hit Italy, with more than 10,000 infections and 1,000 deaths from the virus so far, tendered for 5,000 ventilators and other desperately needed medical equipment.

The UK only ordered our a day or so ago...

... Based on this the full order isn't coming.

Jenni Russell
@jennirsl
·
26m
Riveting breakdown, Italian #coronavirus deaths. Men dying at 4x women's rates. Average age at death: 81. 42% of those who died were 80-89, 32.4% 70-79, 8.4% 60-69. Over 90; 14.1%. Just 2.8% were aged 50-59.
More than two thirds had diabetes, or ex smokers, had CVD, cancer etc

I keep seeing talk of herd immunity but is there any actual proof you gain any long term immunity to this from having it?

Caught the tail end of a woman from WHO on Radio 4 this morning saying that there is no evidence that herd immunity possible with this disease. They just don't know enough.

I feel like I'm in a parallel universe - reading about Italy, China, what WHO are saying and then my child's school social media is all about upcoming events. I'm like WAKE UP PEOPLE.

Even if kids get it mildly (I'm not convinced that's entirely true for the over 10s) how are their lives going to be affected if 1.2 million additional deaths in this country happen - it's going to be death on a scale no children have experienced. What about mental health? What are the scars they're going to carry going forward? How are they going to blame the adults when they find out what happened - how uniquely in the world the UK did nothing because of some half-baked 'behavioural science'. Rather than medicine, rather than epidemiology. Because BoJo thought we were too stupid and reckless to change our lives for a while. They are going to blame the adults in their lives and rightly so. They're going to have their lives affected FOREVER and all because BoJo think people don't want to cancel their social engagements now.

Also the economic argument doesn't stack up - I simply don't believe that 1.2 million extra deaths would be economically better than lock down now.

What is wrong with people that they're just carrying on in the face of clear and absolute incompetence? Please everyone, write to your MP (mine has stopped responding to me!).

And dear WHO scientists - if you're reading - I know you're trying to speak up within the confines of politics. Please be more pointed and clear about what Johnson and the Tories are inflicting on this country.

Please make the message loud and clear - herd immunity is NOT PROVEN for this virus. Johnson is out of his depth. He thinks an Eton eduction and personal wealth can protect him from this like it has from all his other bad decisions - it can't.

Alexandre Afonso
@alexandreafonso
· 1h
Age and gender of Italian coronavirus fatalities in the Lancet:

• mean age 81;
• median 83.4 for women, 79.9 for men
• 80% of fatalities are men. thelancet.com/journals/lance

@Angryrant55

Can you explain your posts? All I see is @ somebody then a comment then something scored out then more guff and I can't even work out who is saying what, if it's a conversation or your opinion on the above or anything remotely factual.

It's just a load of spam