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To be worried about the Coronavirus Part 6

999 replies

Jenasaurus · 27/02/2020 23:17

Old thread here

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3833553-to-be-worried-about-coronavirus-part-5

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7
ofwarren · 29/02/2020 08:22

Washington state high school student who tested positive for coronavirus was feeling better this morning and attempted to return to school. Then positive result came in, student was notified, and went home before attending class.

(from WA state press conference)

CornishPasties · 29/02/2020 08:22

Ive been following this thread but have yet to post although after seeing the american bloke who is apparently 'fine' sharing a drink during the interview with his small daughter im now more than a little concerned about the Americans definition of healthy.

Im not sure theres much point in them even bothering to test and treat even if they do offer both for free if hes an example of what they deem cured. Hmm

HasaDigaEebowai · 29/02/2020 08:25

Interesting that symptons don't include a runny nose, sneezing etc.

They DO! I sat in the doctors surgery watching the PHE video on a loop on thursday. Runny nose and sneezing are symptoms to indicate you might have it.

janemaster · 29/02/2020 08:25

It seems to start with a fever, followed by a dry cough.

After a week, it can lead to shortness of breath, with about 20% of patients requiring hospital treatment.

Notably, the COVID-19 infection rarely seems to cause a runny nose, sneezing, or sore throat (these symptoms have been observed in only about 5% of patients). Sore throat, sneezing,and stuffy nose are most often signs of a cold.

Statistics:

80.9% of infections are mild (with flu-like symptoms) and can recover at home.
13.8% are severe, developing severe diseases including pneumonia and shortness of breath.
4.7% as critical and can include: respiratory failure, septic shock, and multi-organ failure.
in about 2% of reported cases the virus is fatal.
Risk of death increases the older you are.
Relatively few cases are seen among children.
Pre-existing illnesses that put patients at higher risk:

cardiovascular disease
diabetes
chronic respiratory disease
hypertension
Examples of possible development of symptoms (from actual cases)

A man in his 40s in Japan:

Day #1: malaise and muscle pain
later diagnosed with pneumonia
A man in his 60s in Japan:

Day #1: initial symptoms of low-grade fever and sore throat.
A man in his 40s in Japan:

Day #1: chills, sweating and malaise
Day #4: fever, muscle pain and cough
A woman in her 70s, in Japan:

Day #1: 38° fever for a few minutes
Day #2-3: went on a bus tour
Day #5: visited a medical institution
Day #6: showed symptoms of pneumonia.

HasaDigaEebowai · 29/02/2020 08:29

COVID-19 is classified as an airborne high consequence infectious disease (HCID) in the UK.

This is now on the Public Health England website thus clearing up any confusion about whether its airborne. It is.

ofwarren · 29/02/2020 08:32

I can't believe we have to wait till Monday before we hear anything about more safety measures from the government!
I wonder how many cases today will bring?

jimmychooing · 29/02/2020 08:32

We've always known it was airbourne via droplets though haven't we?

keepmoving · 29/02/2020 08:34

HasA the PHE statement that it is airborne has been there for several days. I wonder if this will be updated post the WHO report that was only published yesterday based on findings in China?

Routes of transmission^
COVID-19 is transmitted via droplets and fomites during close unprotected contact between an infector and infectee. Airborne spread has not been reported for COVID-19 and it is not believed to be a major driver of transmission based on available evidence; however, it can be envisaged if certain aerosol-generating procedures are conducted in health care facilities. Fecal shedding has been demonstrated from some patients, and viable virus has been identified in a limited number of case reports. However, the fecal-oral route does not appear to be a driver of COVID-19 transmission; its role and significance for COVID-19 remains to be determined.

HasaDigaEebowai · 29/02/2020 08:35

Through droplet transmission yet but airborne means aerosol as far as I am aware though the reading I've done - i.e. it floats about and can be breathed in rather than someone coughing on you and droplets landing.

Parker231 · 29/02/2020 08:36

I don’t think what is released publicly On Monday will be any more than has already been leaked - larger class sizes, use of other medical services. Don’t see what else they can do.

MrsStrangerThing · 29/02/2020 08:36

To those who say the UK response has been rubbish - I am curious as to what you think they should have done? China is a very different country to here, the social control enforced by the authorities is abhorrent. How on earth do you think a lockdown could have been enforced here, especially before now, when there were so few cases? I honestly am not convinced there would be enough people to enforce it nor enough motivation from citizens who are used to being able to go where they want, when they want and but what they want. UK culture is so very different.

As for closing schools, this is all very well for many of you guys who clearly are able to be at home, judging by the frequency of posts on here all day every day, but what about those of us who work in the NHS? I don't think this virus is going to stop women having babies so I will absolutely have to continue to work. What do you expect me to do with my DC if schools and childcare facilities are all shutdown? My DH is a police officer so will also not be able to just stay off either. I think a lot of posters need to lift their eyes from their own family and think of others. Obviously the UK government are looking at the population as a whole and not a few individual families. Anyone who feels schools should close could surely go ahead and take them out now and home educate, less kids in school and less traffic on the road will benefit the rest of us, for whom life must go on.

keepmoving · 29/02/2020 08:41

HasA do you know what if certain aerosol-generating procedures are conducted in health care facilities refers to? I took some comfort from the report findings, understanding that the virus didn't linger in the air, I am not an expert!

Ciwirocks · 29/02/2020 08:43

MrsStrangerThing I think that the advice for self isolating should be better and more cautious. When there was a big outbreak starting in Italy nothing was mentioned until 9am Tuesday morning and that was only hot spot areas to self isolate. I think people travelling from high risk areas should be asked to self isolate for 2 weeks regardless of symptoms. I don’t think schools should be closed but children or teachers who have been to high risk areas should have been told to stay at home.

HasaDigaEebowai · 29/02/2020 08:44

HasA do you know what if certain aerosol-generating procedures are conducted in health care facilities refers to? I took some comfort from the report findings, understanding that the virus didn't linger in the air, I am not an expert!

No idea I'm afraid, I'm a lawyer not a doctor so also not an expert on the medical stuff. I was also pleased to read the WHO statement. Perhaps the PHE website is lagging behind - it is the weekend after all...

Ciwirocks · 29/02/2020 08:45

Keep moving I think it refers to suction/ intubation etc

MrsStrangerThing · 29/02/2020 08:46

Yes, that is a fair point and certainly it was clear on here that inconsistent advice on this was given by 111.

jimmychooing · 29/02/2020 08:49

It often means that the virus aerolises after someone sneezes/coughs etc - obvs there are other examples but this is most common

DressingGownofDoom · 29/02/2020 08:53

@MrsStrangerThing I completely agree. I think it's quite impressive actually that we only have 20 cases so far given that daily life is continuing pretty much as usual.

I think the Govt are waiting until Monday to see how many cases appear over the weekend, if any.

EmmaBridgewater20 · 29/02/2020 08:56

@MrsStrangerThing totally agree with you on all of your examples it’s just not feasible/justifiable at this point. Here’s what I think they could have done. Suspended flights to and from Hubei province into the UK quicker - it was obvious that this was bad up to a week before the Chinese suspended travel - we should have been on it first, not giving people getting off the flights leaflets for passengers. If you live in a uni town you’ll know that the Chinese students all came back about 5/10 days before the travel ban - more than adequate time for them to have been incubating an infection.

The Tenerife hotel - we know there is a long incubation period so we know the Italian guest will have been mixing with people who have since flown home before he was diagnosed and hotel placed on lockdown. These passengers and crew have been allowed to come back into the country unchecked, they’re now this week (they’ll have been back nearly 2 weeks) being chased up by the airline - but not the government!!! Absolute madness.

The government has given no advice formal advice to the travel company that still has 100 guests in the Tenerife hotel.

We’ve had no proper advice on what makes it distinctive from a normal winter virus.

They’re still allowing flights from Italy. They can quite easily decide to just not let flights from the country in.

Advice is confusing between agencies @HasaDigaEebowai is saying PHE advice says symptoms include runny nose. But the NHS choices website (which 111 use) just mentions fever and dry cough.

RunningAwaywiththeCircus · 29/02/2020 08:57

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janemaster · 29/02/2020 08:58

The information given out by the UK Government has been very poor.
They were very slow to help British citizens on the cruise ship. much slower than other countries. That does not bode well. The number of cases is small at the moment in Britain. The Government should be responding efficiently and effectively.
Instead we hear stories about mass graves in Hyde Park being a possibility and patients less likely to survive probably will be denied intensive care beds. Hardly reassuring.

The number of hospital beds has been gradually reduced in this country. And hospitals already struggle with seasonal flu. Basically our infrastructure is much poorer than it should be.

Terrybenny · 29/02/2020 08:59

Should I stop my kids participating to activities as football or going to birthday parties like in indoor play area? Or going to the temple to classes to learn their language of origine. Also I m a carer assistant for the community and thinking of starting to wear a mask. I am feeling so confused with all this happening. What do you think?

MrsStrangerThing · 29/02/2020 08:59

Thanks for your thoughts everyone, really interesting discussion

Fucket · 29/02/2020 08:59

Regarding schools. What about a half way house situation. Those who can self-isolate with their children do school work at home. Lessons set by teachers by email each morning. Lots of schools use online teaching programmes anyway, mathletics, to rockstars etc. Those that absolutely have to go to school, taught by teachers in masks? Temperature checks at the school gate. Anyone with a cold/cough sent home.

No fines for non-attendance.

For teenagers not adhering to self-isolation surely they should be rounded up by the police and sent home. Then fines for ignoring self-isolation imposed to parents.

Think There is already legislation to cover the need to fine people ignoring public health requirements.

www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2020/129/contents/made

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