Meet the Other Phone. Child-safe in minutes.

Meet the Other Phone.
Child-safe in minutes.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Conflict in the Middle East

Anyone watched the Louis Theroux documentary

405 replies

Ninerina · 30/04/2025 15:06

I knew that things were bad for the Palestinians but after watching the documentary I'm so disgusted by the 'settlers' the government of Israel and especially Daniella Weiss.
Palestinians are referred to as savages and camel riders by a rabbi!
Will we get a chorus of how Louis Theroux is anti- semitic now? The usual battle cry of the Israel supporters

OP posts:
Thread gallery
12
Cvi · 01/05/2025 11:30

Mylegishangingoff · 01/05/2025 11:25

I was raised on someone else's land profiting from their oppression and it was awful for me.

Checkpoints, for instance, were built because of a wave of violent attacks by Palestinians travelling into Israeli cities between 2000 and 2002 known as the second intifada.

Is anybody saying thay they can't have checkpoints on the Israeli border if they want? Nope, the issue is with having them on land that isn't theirs, on roads that aren't theirs, connecting towns that aren't theirs, patrolling streets that aren't theirs. Do what you like in Israel but what sort of person thinks it's OK to do this in territory that isn't yours? Who would defend that, someone who grew up with the belief that they had a right to live in someone else's home.

Edited

There no point sounding disbelieving and self righteous. Surely you can see that the land is disputed and that’s why there is a problem?

Mylegishangingoff · 01/05/2025 11:33

Cvi · 01/05/2025 11:30

There no point sounding disbelieving and self righteous. Surely you can see that the land is disputed and that’s why there is a problem?

Israeli settlements in the Israeli-occupied Palestinian territories of the West Bank and the Gaza Strip, as well as in the Syrian Golan Heights, are illegal under international law. These settlements are in violation of Article 49 of the Fourth Geneva Convention, and in breach of international declarations. In a 2024 ruling by the International Court of Justice (ICJ) relating to the Palestinian territories, the court reaffirmed the illegality of the settlements and called on Israel to end its occupation, cease its settlement activity, and evacuate all its settlers.

Where's the dispute? That's pretty clear.

PollyPaintsFlowers · 01/05/2025 11:43

Not all of the land is Palestinian land

Anyone watched the Louis Theroux documentary
PollyPaintsFlowers · 01/05/2025 11:47

BottleBlondeMachiavelli · 01/05/2025 10:07

No but they’re not the majority, either. There is hope. There are many peaceniks. Netenyahu won’t always be in power. Not that it feels like it after watching that. That woman was unhinged. I feel a bit polluted after seeing so much of her.

I love Louis but I wish he would do a whole series on the conflict. There are so many good stories and interesting people, on both sides. Amazing people who apply themselves to peace projects despite their experiences.

Have you come across this organisation before?
www.handinhandk12.org/

Hoppinggreen · 01/05/2025 11:49

quantumbutterfly · 01/05/2025 11:17

@Hoppinggreen
After all of this and watching LT I am convinced that for a large part of the Israeli population (unfortunately including those in power) nothing short of wiping out Palestine will be enough.

My apologies, it sounded like you were extrapolating.

Accepted, thank you

Nn9011 · 01/05/2025 11:57

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

dairydebris · 01/05/2025 12:05

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

Wow.

devourfeculence · 01/05/2025 12:30

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

So the Israeli government are antisemitic but Hamas aren't. You heard it here first folks.

PollyPaintsFlowers · 01/05/2025 12:40

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

You might want to pay more attention to what Hamas leaders and militants say if you believe their issue is only with Zionists and they don't wish harm on all Jews.

When people tell you who they are, believe them.

PollyPaintsFlowers · 01/05/2025 12:40

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

Nn9011 · 01/05/2025 12:50

devourfeculence · 01/05/2025 12:30

So the Israeli government are antisemitic but Hamas aren't. You heard it here first folks.

I'm sure there are anti sematic members and attitudes among hamas, and obviously that is an issue and I'm not denying it. But what I was trying to say is that the idea of them wanting to just endlessly kill all Jews is not true or at least it's not why they exist in the first place. In fact, members of the Israeli government have admitted that in the 1980s, hamas were funneled money from Israeli government through intermediaries because it was better for them that Hamas wins over the PLO.

devourfeculence · 01/05/2025 12:54

Nn9011 · 01/05/2025 12:50

I'm sure there are anti sematic members and attitudes among hamas, and obviously that is an issue and I'm not denying it. But what I was trying to say is that the idea of them wanting to just endlessly kill all Jews is not true or at least it's not why they exist in the first place. In fact, members of the Israeli government have admitted that in the 1980s, hamas were funneled money from Israeli government through intermediaries because it was better for them that Hamas wins over the PLO.

https://avalon.law.yale.edu/20th_century/hamas.asp

The Avalon Project : Hamas Covenant 1988

https://avalon.law.yale.edu/20th_century/hamas.asp

HaveYouActuallyDoneAnyWashingThisWeekMum · 01/05/2025 12:54

PollyPaintsFlowers · 01/05/2025 11:15

Louis Theroux’s settler documentary shows only half the story
I was raised on a Jewish settlement. We were not taught to hate our Palestinian neighbours

In his latest <a class="break-all" href="https://archive.ph/o/ZIEXG/www.telegraph.co.uk/tv/0/louis-theroux-the-settlers-bbc-two-review/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">documentary, The Settlers, Louis Theroux meets Ari Abramowitz, an Israeli settler living in the West Bank.
Wide-eyed Theroux asks Abramowitz if he’s holding a gun “for effect”. “No”, Ari responds. “I wear it for protection.”
Israeli settlements, to clarify, are Jewish villages (mainly in the West Bank) that were set up beyond Israel’s internationally recognised borders following the Arab-Israeli war in 1967.
I was born and raised in one such village not far from where Abramowitz lives, called Kfar Adumim.
I lived with constant fear throughout my childhood, frightened that a terrorist might emerge from the valley below our home and slaughter my family in our sleep.

That fear was not a product of my imagination. When I was a teenager, Hagit, a 23-year-old woman from my village, was swimming in a natural pool in the nearby valley with her friend when the pair were stabbed to death by a Palestinian attacker.
Thousands of Israeli civilians like Hagit have lost their lives to similar attacks over the years: some blown up in buses, others shot and rammed by cars.
My mother — the daughter of a Jewish refugee family from Baghdad — always slept with a pistol under her pillow. It was not an act of bravado but a matter of keeping us safe. I wonder whether Theroux would think my mother did it just “for effect” too.
Journalists have a duty to gather evidence and share knowledge responsibly when the public relies on their reporting. But The Settlers fails on all counts. Let me explain why.
Firstly, Theroux says that violence committed by settlers is often framed by them as a reaction to Palestinian violence, which he claims is “much less frequent” than the former.

But this is false. Palestinian attacks against Israelis are far more common than the inverse.

According to data from the Shin Bet, Israel’s internal security agency, in 2024 alone, Palestinians carried out 6,828 attacks against Israelis – twice that of the previous year (excluding the <a class="break-all" href="https://archive.ph/o/ZIEXG/www.telegraph.co.uk/israel-hamas-war/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">October 7 massacre). In contrast, there were 673 attacks against Palestinians committed by Israelis in 2024, according to Israeli Defence Force (IDF) statistics.
If you adjust these numbers relative to the population size, it means that last year Palestinians committed between around two and three times more attacks than Israelis (depending on which population estimate is used). Hardly “much less frequent”.
Then there’s the problem of who Theroux chooses to interview. The only Israeli settlers we meet are the most ideological, many of which are militant, foreign-born outsiders. The Palestinians Theroux interviews however are the opposite: like Issa Amro, a moderate non-violent Palestinian activist from Hebron.

This characterisation of Jewish settlers didn’t resonate with my experience. Like many of my friends, my mother made it clear I had to be respectful of our Palestinians neighbours. “Respectful and prudent” she would repeat. Nowhere in my education nor in our community we were taught to disrespect, let alone harass, Palestinians. Even today, a vast majority of those living in the West Bank say they would not move to Jewish settlements if built in Gaza.
Theroux’s film also leaves out the key historical context which explains why the West Bank is governed in the way it is. Checkpoints, for instance, were built because of a wave of violent attacks by Palestinians travelling into Israeli cities between 2000 and 2002 known as the second intifada. In 2023, many Palestinian stabbing plots were thwarted only because knives were found on the people intending to carry them out as they passed through checkpoints into Israel.
Let’s be very clear. Every single attack directed at civilians whether committed by Palestinians or Israelis is criminal, immoral and unjustified. Our community must do better to address the root causes of this shameful violence as these are not our values. <a class="break-all" href="https://archive.ph/o/ZIEXG/www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2025/04/15/israeli-settlers-emboldened-by-trump-lay-siege-to-west-bank/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Settler extremists do not act in our name.

But this simplistic worldview — in which the Israelis are oppressors and Palestinians the weak oppressed – is plain wrong. The reality is far more complex.
Dr Eitan Oren is a war studies lecturer at King’s College London

From The Telegraph

I have every respect for your childhood experiences as they sound incredibly traumatic but why did your parents choose to bring you up in the occupied territories? You outline the situation in your third paragraph so as an adult now you are aware that these settlements exist outside the law.

As a complete outsider to the very complex historical, political and religious background and context of the documentary one of my observations is how deliberately provocative the outposts consisting of tents which then become settlements (illegal under international law but legal and recognised by the Israeli authorities) are. Isn’t there enough land outside the occupied territories for Israelis and for people moving to Israel to settle in?

Whatsinanamehey · 01/05/2025 13:22

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

I knew we would get there eventually, i see your true colours and biases against pro-Palestinians as a whole are really coming out. Imagine if in reverse I said 'pro-israelis really are a whole new level of deranged' would you think that's an acceptable thing to say?

hareclive · 01/05/2025 13:58

Nn9011 · 01/05/2025 12:50

I'm sure there are anti sematic members and attitudes among hamas, and obviously that is an issue and I'm not denying it. But what I was trying to say is that the idea of them wanting to just endlessly kill all Jews is not true or at least it's not why they exist in the first place. In fact, members of the Israeli government have admitted that in the 1980s, hamas were funneled money from Israeli government through intermediaries because it was better for them that Hamas wins over the PLO.

Hamas have no ambitions outside of Palestine

Twiglets1 · 01/05/2025 14:43

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

Yes it is possible to be pro Israel and anti Settler.

I am myself pro Israel and anti Settler.

The Settlers are an extreme type of person, they are not representative of most Israeli people.

Starbri8 · 01/05/2025 14:53

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

PollyPaintsFlowers · 01/05/2025 17:08

Whatsinanamehey · 01/05/2025 13:22

I knew we would get there eventually, i see your true colours and biases against pro-Palestinians as a whole are really coming out. Imagine if in reverse I said 'pro-israelis really are a whole new level of deranged' would you think that's an acceptable thing to say?

No, because comparatively there's no competition

stonecutter · 01/05/2025 17:09

You sound like you're talking about some Labour MPs who have made some dodgy comments on Whatsapp. Of course they hate Jews. Their 1988 charter literally features gems such as:

"Israel, Judaism and Jews challenge Islam and the Moslem people. "May the cowards never sleep."

"The Day of Judgement will not come about until Moslems fight the Jews (killing the Jews)"

"The Islamic Resistance Movement consider itself to be the spearhead of the circle of struggle with world Zionism and a step on the road. The Movement adds its efforts to the efforts of all those who are active in the Palestinian arena. Arab and Islamic Peoples should augment by further steps on their part; Islamic groupings all over the Arab world should also do the same, since all of these are the best-equipped for the future role in the fight with the warmongering Jews."

In 2017, they of course switched out Jews for Zionists, but presumably you can forgive not completely trusting them, after decades of making very clear who they are.

In 2019, Hamas Political Bureau member Fathi Hammad called for millions of Palestinians abroad to kill every Jew on planet Earth and in 2021, instructed the people of Jerusalem to cut the heads off Jews.

Then there's the fact that "oh it's just Zionism is the problem" still means that they want to destroy Israel.

In 2011, Cleric Yunis Al-Astal stated that the purpose of the Jews arriving in Palestine was for the great massacre. In 2012, Hamas official Sheik Ahmad Bahr prayed for Jews, Americans and supporters to be destroyed.

They have been very upfront that they will never recognise Israel and that their aim is for Israel to be destroyed.

By 2016, they were bragging about their rockets and the tunnels they made specifically in preparation to attack. They have outright said they will continue attacks like October 7th until Israel is destroyed. Note that they did not say, until we are free or have a 2 state solution. They clarified they meant Israel's total annihilation.

We are not talking about the settlers from this documentary. We are talking about every Israeli citizen, even the ones who were born there. How can peace be achieved with Hamas?

Even if there's a ceasefire for a few years, do you think they will just suddenly become friends? Or will they take the time to rebuild and continue attacking as they have promised to repeatedly? Hamas have to go.

There is literally video footage of the things they did on October 7th. If you haven't seen it I really urge you to watch 'We will dance again' and come back and tell me that Hamas just have a little bit of an antisemitism problem amongst some of their members.

And as for the people who now find it acceptable to have a chat with a couple of Israelis and decide that all of Israel supports settlers? Have you actually looked at the polling? It is not a majority in any polls I see.

What about the polling on how many Palestinians support Hamas or how many thought October 7th was a good thing immediately after? Does that change the way you think of Palestinians? Does it mean that either side deserves to be eliminated? Both Palestinians and Israelis have the right to live in their homes.

It is an extremely complex conflict that does not have an easy solution.

The Avalon Project : Hamas Covenant 1988

https://avalon.law.yale.edu/21st_century/hamas.asp

Nn9011 · 01/05/2025 17:21

hareclive · 01/05/2025 13:58

Hamas have no ambitions outside of Palestine

Yeah that was a reply to someone saying they wouldn't stop until they kill all Jews in the world.

Nn9011 · 01/05/2025 17:23

Twiglets1 · 01/05/2025 14:43

Yes it is possible to be pro Israel and anti Settler.

I am myself pro Israel and anti Settler.

The Settlers are an extreme type of person, they are not representative of most Israeli people.

I disagree, I understand those who take a 2 state solution view to achieve peace similar to Northern Ireland or other countries but to say you are pro-Israel means you support them and Israel is by it's very nature and occupying settling state.

Twiglets1 · 01/05/2025 17:27

Nn9011 · 01/05/2025 17:23

I disagree, I understand those who take a 2 state solution view to achieve peace similar to Northern Ireland or other countries but to say you are pro-Israel means you support them and Israel is by it's very nature and occupying settling state.

Disagree all you want. I know what I mean by pro Israel, I mean I take their side in this war as they were the ones attacked and did not initiate the killings.

The Settlers are a specific community of extremists and I don’t agree they should be there.

Whatsinanamehey · 01/05/2025 17:29

PollyPaintsFlowers · 01/05/2025 17:08

No, because comparatively there's no competition

And again, it just spills out without much prompting.

Whatsinanamehey · 01/05/2025 17:43

Whatsinanamehey · 01/05/2025 17:29

And again, it just spills out without much prompting.

The same rhetoric and attitude as seen by the settlers.

Whatsinanamehey · 01/05/2025 17:47

PollyPaintsFlowers · 01/05/2025 17:08

No, because comparatively there's no competition

The whole attitude of we are better and superior than them - the attitude the settlers display in the documentary is echoed in your words, I really hope you can see that.