Offer made to Israel

[mouthpipette]

Lyse Doucet (From our own correspondent, BBC R4, 6/10) reported that last week the Jordanian foreign minister said,

"57 Arab and Muslim countries will, right now, guarantee the security of Israel if Israel ends the occupation and agrees to an independent Palestinian state. "

That's a pretty good offer and I find it interesting that it hasn't been more widely publicised.

@browserintobuyer There's no such country as Palestine - so how can there be a people called The "Palestinians"?

Sure, do you mean "how can it be genocide or ethnic cleansing if Palestine doesn't exist" right?

Olympic levels of mental gymnastics have gone into justifying the Apartheid, genocide and invasions in the ME. At every turn there's an explanation for how the slaughter of the Palestinians and everyone else, including UN peacekeepers, are their fault.

There have people called Palestinians or Philistines, or Filistines for thousands of years ( as one of other groups)

Jews and Palestinians descend from the same dna in ancient times. Think of Cain and Abel. ( There was a Haaretz article about it.)

The land was called Palestine at the time in 1948 when the Jewish people were given a section to be their homeland, Israel after the war. ( There were also Jewish people who had always lived in this land too but they were a minority.)

Well if Hamas hand over the hostages now I suppose Israel could look at the offer though I'd be dubious.

No hostage return obligation so the price of maybe ending the killing of Jews is to let them keep them? Hands up anyone here who'd let them keep their children

At first glance it seems to boil down to:

1 Israel stop trying to rescue their people (and kids)
2 Everyone recognises Palestine as a state (many don't now including the UK)
3 The other countries will ask Hamas and Hezbollah nicely to please stop killing Jews.

Given that the other countries couldn't achieve that without doing what Israel is doing that seems pretty flimsy.

"At every turn there's an explanation for how the slaughter of the Palestinians and everyone else, including UN peacekeepers, are their fault"

If they are in a war zone UN and AID workers know they take their chances. There is no way to make a bullet that is harmless to 'nice people'.

Unless you mean UNRWA workers who may have died while taking part in OCT 7 murders.

If a population allows it's leaders to murder and rape those in a neighbouring country they are at fault.

If the UK sent soldiers to slaughter people on the streets of Paris we could hardly complain about bombs falling on London. Even if we personally didn't want it to happen we can't evade responsibility for what our country does.

So by your thinking civilians are fair game if their leaders (elected or not) commit atrocities? You have obviously never heard of the Geneva Convention

If they are in a war zone UN and AID workers know they take their chances. There is no way to make a bullet that is harmless to 'nice people'.
Don't fire it! Can't do much damage if it is still in its gun. The UN have been in Lebanon for decades it is crucial they don't leave and remain to bear witness to what is happening and support the innocent civilians.
Aid workers are needed to provide humanitarian aid and medical support. Your excuses for attacking them is very disturbing

If a population allows it's leaders to murder and rape those in a neighbouring country they are at fault.

This is a very shallow level of thinking. Are you saying all Israely children are at fault of committing war crimes just because their government does?
You opionion is not shared by anyone with some humanity left in them.
I urge you to reconsider.

Nobody holds children responsible, dont be silly.

Good point, if that same logic given by that poster was applied to the Israelis, there would not be a single innocent person there because many people their army has murdered and burnt alive. Completely twisted and warped way at looking at thing but some posters think it's fine to say about Palestinians who are going through a genocide.

Firstly, it's a quote from a poster above, these are not my words.
Secondly, if idf snipes, bombs and burns children NOT because they think they are 'at fault', then why?
You can't say "collateral damage" in case of snipers, which is confirmed by the doctor's letter. The reality is grimmer than history.

When you say "the Jewish people were given a section" you realize this was colonisation enforced on the previous occupants, like it or not? Understandably some didn't like it very much. They were given it by Western imperial powers who had no right to do so.

And DNA, Cane and Able are utterly irrelevant.

Whatever the UK may or may not do is completely irrelevant. Where do you get this from?

”Self defence” is Israeli propaganda. Self defence doesn’t involve shooting children in the head or burning people alive.
1200 people died in 7/10 against a backdrop of multilevel security failures and more than 5000 Palestinians in Gaza killed by Israel in the preceding years.
In response 40,000 people killed in Gaza.
In Northern Israel, about 60-100,000 have been displaced but less than 70 Israelis, mostly IDF have been killed. In repose we see thousands killed, more than a million displaced and atrocities that we are not allowed to compare to Nazi Germany for fear of offending the sensibilities of those sharing the religious beliefs of the perpetrators.
Burning people alive, desecrating bodies, raping - now the IDF have equalled Hamas in the depth of depravity but exceeded Hamas in scale. We need to call for an end to the trade agreement with Israel

Yes, I do realise this was imposed on the existing Palestinian population and that that would have been awful. It was very likely to cause trouble. Nevertheless traumatised Jewish people were given this land by Britain as their homeland after the war while the U.K. and USA had refused them a home at that time. It is not their fault.

I also realise that dreadful things happened to Palestinians in 1948. There were Jewish terror groups and soldiers bombing and burning their villages along the border, killing them and in some cases raping them. ( The papers have been relocked up for now according to a Haaretz article).

But I was responding really to the poster trying to suggest there is no such people Palestinians just as you had been:

@browserintobuyer
There's no such country as Palestine - so how can there be a people called The "Palestinians"?

I believe the lurking suggestion behind this. which is one I’ve seen, is that there are just arabs….Palestinians are a trumped idea…they have no roots in this land.

This view comes up. There was an interview with a Texan Jewish woman who would like to live in Gaza saying Palestinians had no ethnicity tying them to the land like Jewish people do so they should be taken in abroad.

I disagree with this argument. That’s why I brought up the dna. Extremist Jewish nationalists do not seem to think about this commonality they have with Palestinians.
Cain and Abel are not irrelevant in this context.

If nobody holds children responsible, why are people justifying shooting them in the head?