Israel has bombed the front of a hospital / 2

[Readingallnight]

Discussion re Israel’s bombing of hospitals, infrastructure and residential buildings

@Parkingt111 I'm hopeful too tho' feel it's quite fragile

Absolutely awful what's happening at the Indonesian hospital - will be 'interesting' to see what evidence is produced to justify it

From Haaretz today. (I signed in and get occasional paywall-free deports.)

The IDF said it used the last few hours before the cease-fire to destroy the tunnels beneath Al-Shifa Hospital, and that it completed its operation in the hospital complex itself.

I wonder if we’ll ever really know what exactly was down there now? If any system under there was the Hamas headquarters? Or a node? Or a useful Hamas entrance and exit to other parts?

Or an unused hospital extension, as it was originally supposed to be an extension when Israel built it?

The amnesty 2015 report referred to Hamas using a disused outpatient’s clinic in part of the hospital grounds for tortures and interrogations of Palestinians they accused of collaborating. The article did not mention Hamas using an underground section.
Some were interrogated and tortured or otherwise ill-treated in a disused outpatient’s clinic within the grounds of Gaza City’s main al-Shifa hospital
https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2015/05/gaza-palestinians-tortured-summarily-killed-by-hamas-forces-during-2014-conflict/

@Readingallnight I am surprised that you are stunned. The deal Israel has is with Hamas so why would it include the West Bank?

@Thereissomelight 'I don't think some of the other countries are perfect either' is the biggest understatement going.
Iran?

'Resistance' = terrorism. Do you often refer to rape as resistance?

There is still concern over the director of Al-Shifa. The IDF have murdered so many medics, it's laughable that they even attempt to take a moral stance now. The mask has completely slipped for all to see.
Still no conclusive evidence that Hamas used the tunnels they found, as mentioned by another poster.

@ChickHenLittle I would want to talk to him as it's been shown Injured hostages where in his hospital with Hamas.
You know the Hamas he denied ever being there.
Also bodies in the compound.
It's on his watch so to be speak.

We do not refer to U.K. and American soldiers who raped in WW11 as terrorists. We think of them as people fighting for their country. We cannot not be so naive as to think there were no rapists among those heroes. Sadly, I have checked it out and there were plenty.

But yes, Hammas are vicious and savage even to their own, as well as being a resistance organisation under occupation.

My post · Today 11:27
should have said ‘We cannot be so naive as to…’

I have a question if anyone can help answer please
According to the Geneva convention there are certain places like hospitals schools places of worship that have a protected status

If the country at war and not just Israel but also any other country attack a hospital and say that it has lost its protected status, then who decides if this was lawful?
Keeping in mind in this war that Israel has attacked many hospitals not just Al shifa.
For example the indonesian hospital where I haven't seen any 'proof' presented to show why it has lost its protected status

I know the ICC is one that investigates war crimes but Israel contests that they have the right to do so when previously they have tried

Is it then just up to other countries to implement sanctions at percieved crimes at their own discretion?
It seems that many of the rules of war has loop holes that countries can take advantage of and then what are we left with except words and moral outrage. How effective is that as a deterrent?

No that’s a really good explanation. Thankyou.
I suppose I assumed it was all occupied areas and maybe just wishful thinking on my part.
I understand 17 more Palestinians were removed from their homes in the West Bank yesterday by the IDF yesterday.

@Parkingt111 I heard that ICC can investigate crimes committed in Palestine, as they have signed up to it. This means they can investigate crimes committed in Gaza by Israel and by Hamas. It will be difficult for them, but they can issue arrest warrants for Israeli personnel if they think it justified - which means if that person leaves Israel at any point, they can be arrested abroad. I think they are already investigating events from 2014, which would include Oct 7th and the invasion of Gaza. I imagine it could take them years, though.

@stormy4319trevor thank you!

Like Al-shifa the report on the Indonesian hospital also stated medical equipment , solar panels and basic life saving infrastructure had been wrecked. What is the point in demolishing such infrastructure in a hospital other than to make its purpose unviable.

Whilst the IDF questioned staff there have been no reports that anything has been found or any extensive searches made.

Of the other hospitals we see the same.
A country cannot function without hospitals, without schools, without clean water. Everything is being bombed to prevent, it seems, a return to normality by the Palestinian people in Gaza.

By “resistance” I meant that when Israel was founded there was understandable resistance from people who had lived there for generations and were forced off their land. Also by “resistance” I meant that Palestinians resisted being further forced off their land by settlers.
I think you know this perfectly well.

The videos on social media of Israeli soldiers shooting people going north are horrifying. Absolutely depraved behaviour.

As an aside
Another Mumsnet thread of interest called

Ideas to support Palestinian businesses and charities this Christmas

ps
i have no idea how to link the thread or I would….honestly! ….feeling a bit crap about that tbh!
I have tried, dummies guide keeps telling me to paste…..but I’ve run out of glue😳

Here it is 😊

Thanks @ChickHenLittle i saw you on the other thread and thought you might be the one to help
👍

Mention of al-Shifa evacuation - looks like something positive

''Eleven ambulances, three coaches and a flatbed were delivered to al-Shifa hospital, which had seen heavy fighting in recent days, “to assist with evacuations”, the OCHA statement said.''

Guardian

@Efacsen thank you that's great

It was just those 3 lines at the end of a longer piece about the distribution of humanitarian aid after midnight - the fate of Al Shifa isn't news any more - really hope it's not forgotten what has happened there

Nothing about the director - hope he doesn't just get disappeared he has evidence for both parties

I can assure you the IDF will be doing than "talking" to him 😔.

Health warning: Al Jazeera - not sure if these poor patients in the carpark are actually in the process of being evacuated rather than 'stranded'

WATCH: Dire conditions at al-Shifa Hospital revealed during Gaza truce New images from Gaza’s al-Shifa Hospital show the badly wounded and elderly patients stranded on hospital beds outside among debris in the car park.