Be ashamed of yourselves

[Thisworld10]

That’s right be ashamed of yourselves. I come in these threads thinking I’ll read someone saying what’s happening to the people of Palestine is awful but what I end up reading is people saying they brought it on themselves because they elected Hamas.

So, what if they elected Hamas. We elected the Conservative party but they don’t speak for me, they certainly don’t act on behalf of the everyday citizen of this country. Be ashamed of yourselves for not valuing the lives of Palestinians but putting so much value on the lives of Israelis.

be ashamed of yourselves for justifying the ethnic cleansing of over 2 million people because Hamas attacked Israel in early October. Be ashamed of yourselves for standing for genocide in 2023!

be ashamed of yourselves for saying we would never allow the holocaust to happen again yet Palestinians are held in an open air prison. It’s literally been called a concentration camp, with no way in or out and they are being rampaged with bombs, white phosphorus bombs being dropped on them non stop. On Sunday night 400 died because of the bombs, over 2000 children are now dead. Be ashamed of yourselves for justifying their deaths and blaming them for it.

be ashamed of yourselves for condoning the protestors for wanting Palestinians to have a right to live a peaceful existence.

be ashamed for bringing history into justifying the slaughter of so many people. Yes, Palestinians did welcome Israelis into the holy land in the 1940’s, it doesn’t mean they get to die now. Yes, Israel has a right to exist, but that doesn’t mean Palestine doesn’t. Yes, Israel has land grabbed and continues to do so but no one is allowed to say anything. Yes, their is no Hamas in the West Bank but why are the Palestinian still being killed. Why are so many people illegally arrested mainly kids - held for decades in Israel prisons. Are they not hostages? Yea, Israel asked asked the Palestinians to move to the south with 24 hours notice for their ‘safety’ yet they are being killed in the south.

be ashamed if you ask any one who stands to defend the rights of Palestinians if they condemn Hamas. Everyone condemns Hamas. Being pro Palestinian doesn’t mean your pro-Hamas. I also condemn the barbarian acts of genocide committed by Israel. I condemn the open displays of hate for Palestinian people - calling them human animals etc.

Be ashamed if you think it’s so great they are letting a trickle of aid in but no fuel to run hospitals. Electricity ran out last night in the hospital. So many babies reliant in incubators will die as a result. be ashamed if you think it’s okay for world leaders to not call for a ceasefire and instead show 100% support to what Israel
is doing.

no one has the right to hold one life more dearer than another.

you should be ashamed of yourselves for valuing some over others.

@Thisworld10 If you look at this poll you will see the vast majority of GB people do not support what the Israeli Govt is doing. That was 5 days ago I suspect it is even higher now From what you’ve read and heard, do you think there should or should not be an immediate ceasefire in Israel and Palestine? | Daily Question (yougov.co.uk)

You said that they deserve what came to them not me. I very clearly just stated the truth. Israel chose to inflict collective punishment on 2.2million people for 17 years. This was a choice they made. Nobody can make you do that. When you make that choice you can't just decide that you are no longer providing them with water or food or aid.

Actually I'm not sure how you lept to your crazy conclusion that I said Israeli civilians deserved to by massacred by Hamas by me saying that Israel chose to be an occupying power and as such they have responsibilities. I think you are just trying to stir the pot tbh.

I don't think you understand the concept of being able to see things from both sides. You should try it. It gives you a more objective understanding of the subject and the subsequent situation.

How pompous

Released hostages families are still in captivity. What do you think they are going to say

Such naivety

Ahh @flufferknutter the irony! You and your vacuums!
Unfortunately I can see it from both sides and you have to go a bit further back than 1947 (little tip for you there). The question is how far back do you go when talking about systems of oppression? I wouldn’t go too far or you’ll ruin your narrative.
Try understanding the history of the region which you clearly do not. You should try it. It gives you a more objective understanding of the subject and the subsequent situation :)

Actually I'm not sure how you lept to your crazy conclusion that I said Israeli civilians deserved to by massacred by Hamas by me saying that Israel chose to be an occupying power and as such they have responsibilities. I think you are just trying to stir the pot tbh

Because it's become so painfully clear who everyone's real enemy is that it seems futile and crass to keep jabbing the finger at Israel instead of uniting rather urgently against the greater threat.

Imagine how much it would reduce the casualties and deaths in Gaza if Israel had support there that could help them infiltrate the Hamas network.

@Gruntsandgroansyes, I see, I didn’t word that very well. And no I wasn’t insinuating that the withholding of aid was all on Hamas although they clearly do not give a jot about Palestinians.
I meant more the cognitive dissonance regarding some lives being more valuable than others (which they are not) but I see that wasn’t clear particularly as I then segued into aid.

I was talking about a very specific thing(Israels responsibilities) in the part of my post that you quoted. It was clear what I was talking about and clear that you were trying to twist that.

These are the lovely neighbours that Gazans (50% of whom are children) have had to deal with.

Why go back in history when you have this going on?

And I have read up on the history, going back to the bronze age and it's still wrong to commit genocide.

But you were very happy to go back 80 years a minute ago to explain what Hamas is allegedly responding to? When someone suggests going back a little more than 80 years suddenly there's no need to go back in history at all! Seems a little arbitrary now doesn't it?

Go back in history, don't go back in history, wtf are you going on about? How far do you want to go back? It doesn't matter. Nothing excuses the genocide which is now taking place.

Read what those politicians have said. Nothing excuses those sick attitudes.

This was you, one page ago:

'Hamas wasn't created in a vacuum. They're a response to 80 years of being displaced, killed, raped, imprisoned and treated like second class citizens by the Israeli authorities.'

So terrorism is a response to being second class citizens, among other things, according to you. But you'd rather not discuss the centuries of history prior to 1948 when the Jews, and all non muslims, were second class citizens under Islamic rule. As they remain in several Islamic states to this day, including those supporting Hamas.

Do you want me to tell you something? I used to support Israel until this trouble started. I then started looking into what's been going on over the decades and it began to dawn on me that perhaps the Palestinian people have good cause to be depressed and hostile about their shitty non lives.

This is one sick headfuck and I won't be replying to any defenders of genocide. Just make your excuses, go back as far as the stone age if you like. I don't care. What this sick government are doing is wrong and everyone knows it despite how much they might despise Muslims - and let's not pretend there's not a hefty dose of islamophobia and racism going on.

I'll pray that people find their humanity before any more people, on either side, die.

Have a nice life.

Oh I see those little quotes are being shared again to prove how evil Israel is. Should we go through and find truly despicable things Palestinian politicians have said as well? Or politicians in other anti-Israel Muslim countries?Do we start with Mahmoud Abbas' blatant antisemitism through the decades? Most recently this summer. Even the Guardian reported on it, so it must've been bad!

My point is that five right-wing nutjobs don't represent a whole country. Specially not a country as divided as Israel.

It's amazing how people will talk human rights and mental health and sanctity of life and yada yada but in the same breath think genocide is perfectly acceptable because "they bought it upon themselves".

An Israeli minister literally said today that the media should not be objective and only and only show the Israeli pov.

Thank you OP for saying it what it is, depiste the hate coming your way.

Remind me of the name of the Palestinian officials who signed off 56% of their land... and opened the door to forced removal of population, destruction of 500+ villages, village wells poisoned, properties looted, to make space for others.... because right now, I can only recall the US and UK who gave away a land that wasn't theirs.
Half of the Palestinian population was expelled, more than 700.000, are the conservatives numbers.
The line between occupation and invasion is very blur. The two words almost told into one.
Misinformation seems to lie in your post as well.

Khan Younis in south Gaza was bombed indiscriminately last night. For anyone uninformed that is on the south of the Gaza Strip. The exact place the Israeli government told the INNOCENT Palestinians to flee to.

I’m thinking more and more that the quotes @Coughingdodger put up are true. What kind of a world do we live in where people, government officials, can say these types of things so openly, so brazenly, and get away with it - the answer seems to be only in Israel, backed by the US and it’s allies.

its said 700 Palestinians have died in the last 24 hours. Sorry, I mean murdered.

I have seen things I can’t in unsee:
a man carrying the body of his child in carrier bags - because that was all that was left of him
a boy with half his face blown off and both legs gone. He died a slow painful death.
a doctor saving others only to find his son died in a blast
People on their way to the south when they were asked to go get bombed
a baby without a head (I cried at this one the most) because he/she lost it due to the force of the Israeli air strikes.
so many people trapped under rubble being helped by men who have only their bare hands to get them out
and so much more.

I have no words for this disgusting acts of violence on innocent people. So I still stand with what I said you should be ashamed of yourselves if u justify the acts of Israel. This isn’t self defence it’s ethnic cleansing.

You are part of the problem OP. Stop being part of the problem- people with no skin in the game whipping up hate- and start being part of the solution.

If you think hating strangers on the internet is somehow saving lives. And that your sound bite campaigning can end a war like this then you need take some time off from the internet.

Quite frankly you assessment of the situation comes of as some privileged western person sticking their beak into someone else’s conflict and shit stirring. You don’t get to tell people in another country and culture how to feel about things. You don’t get to dictate based on your own morality and beliefs what everyone else does.

The fucking cultural imperialism of the U.K. left wing. Identical to the days of the British Empire but they just can’t see it. And before you ask- I am currently politically homeless.

@TheFirie

Remind me how many millions of Jews were expelled or cleansed from the surrounding Arab nations in the build up to 1948? Or do you not know that part of the story. How the Arab nations decided it was time to push the Jews out of Aleppo and Baghdad and Cairo.

Why were the Jewish people buying up land in Judea? Because they were being murdered and burnt out of their homes all across Eastern Europe and the Middle East.

Christ, how is it that all the ‘Jews are colonisers’ gang only ever know half the story.

Well, the colonies, the settlers are a big hurdle in the resolution of the conflict

@TheFirie
I feel like there are two aspects you're missing - some of the land was bought by Jews. The rich landowners who lived elsewhere quite gladly sold their land. I don't know about you but if I were to buy some land, I'd want the people who live there to leave so I could do whatever I wanted with it. Secondly, Arab leaders told the Muslims to leave so they wouldn't be in harm's way when the surrounding nations all attacked Israel. They displaced them because they assumed they'd win and they'd all be able to go back after a couple of weeks. That's not what happened though.

Of course, some people were expelled by force as a result of war but the majority had already left eg Haifa and Jerusalem by then after being told to leave by the surrounding countries, who then refused to help them once they'd become refugees

You claimed that 'the US and UK who gave away a land that wasn't theirs' and you're referring to 1948 and the Nakba.

That's absolutely false. There had been Jews living on the land the entire time, as second class citizens, dhimmis, as all non-muslims were for centuries after the Islamic conquest. It was their land, as much if not more so than the Arabs. The British and French were legally entitled to administer that territory after the Ottomans lost WW1, and were obliged to decide what to do with it. They did offer the Jews and the Arabs a state, several times in the 1920s, 30's, 40's. The Arabs refused to let them have any, not an inch. Not even 500 square miles as was offered in 1938. The British gave up. It had nothing to do with the US.

The French also offered the Christians a state, where they could live free of religious supremacism. The Arabs also refused to agree to that. Because of course you simply can't hand over lands conquered by Islam to non-muslims, let alone your own former dhimmis.

Israel declared its independence anyway and was attacked by all the neighbouring Arab states. It survived and it got its state formally from the UN.

Stop accusing others of spreading misinformation.