Be ashamed of yourselves

[Thisworld10]

That’s right be ashamed of yourselves. I come in these threads thinking I’ll read someone saying what’s happening to the people of Palestine is awful but what I end up reading is people saying they brought it on themselves because they elected Hamas.

So, what if they elected Hamas. We elected the Conservative party but they don’t speak for me, they certainly don’t act on behalf of the everyday citizen of this country. Be ashamed of yourselves for not valuing the lives of Palestinians but putting so much value on the lives of Israelis.

be ashamed of yourselves for justifying the ethnic cleansing of over 2 million people because Hamas attacked Israel in early October. Be ashamed of yourselves for standing for genocide in 2023!

be ashamed of yourselves for saying we would never allow the holocaust to happen again yet Palestinians are held in an open air prison. It’s literally been called a concentration camp, with no way in or out and they are being rampaged with bombs, white phosphorus bombs being dropped on them non stop. On Sunday night 400 died because of the bombs, over 2000 children are now dead. Be ashamed of yourselves for justifying their deaths and blaming them for it.

be ashamed of yourselves for condoning the protestors for wanting Palestinians to have a right to live a peaceful existence.

be ashamed for bringing history into justifying the slaughter of so many people. Yes, Palestinians did welcome Israelis into the holy land in the 1940’s, it doesn’t mean they get to die now. Yes, Israel has a right to exist, but that doesn’t mean Palestine doesn’t. Yes, Israel has land grabbed and continues to do so but no one is allowed to say anything. Yes, their is no Hamas in the West Bank but why are the Palestinian still being killed. Why are so many people illegally arrested mainly kids - held for decades in Israel prisons. Are they not hostages? Yea, Israel asked asked the Palestinians to move to the south with 24 hours notice for their ‘safety’ yet they are being killed in the south.

be ashamed if you ask any one who stands to defend the rights of Palestinians if they condemn Hamas. Everyone condemns Hamas. Being pro Palestinian doesn’t mean your pro-Hamas. I also condemn the barbarian acts of genocide committed by Israel. I condemn the open displays of hate for Palestinian people - calling them human animals etc.

Be ashamed if you think it’s so great they are letting a trickle of aid in but no fuel to run hospitals. Electricity ran out last night in the hospital. So many babies reliant in incubators will die as a result. be ashamed if you think it’s okay for world leaders to not call for a ceasefire and instead show 100% support to what Israel
is doing.

no one has the right to hold one life more dearer than another.

you should be ashamed of yourselves for valuing some over others.

@Thisworld10

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/i-am-zionist-how-joe-bidens-lifelong-bond-with-israel-shapes-war-policy-2023-10-21/

Two disgusting criminals.

We trust Israel's numbers because they didn't say, within minutes of the massacre, that 1400 people had been murdered. When I first woke up that morning they were saying something along the lines of "at least 12 people". Same with the kidnappings - they don't report someone as being a hostage until it's confirmed, which is why the number keeps increasing.

Meanwhile Hamas announced at least 500, but possibly up to 800, were killed in a hospital parking lot within minutes of a rocket attack. There's literally no way they would have known that number. They just make it up.

Clearly Hamas' PR people are doing a great job as so many people on here believe them, but you really should try questioning how they get to numbers so quickly. I also want to know if the number they state includes the 1500 terrorists that invaded Israel. Does anyone know?

The words "trust" and "Israel" don't work together at all. There's simply no entity in the entire world which uses different kinds of propaganda/ manipulation/ brazen impunity/ mind games, etc. as effectively as Israel. They have tremendous resources entirely dedicated to this and I will never trust anything coming from them. You don't need to take Hamas as a source; I don't. People who try to justify the unjustifiable and minimise the genocide should be ashamed of themselves. But then, they can't, as they don't have any conscience.

@OhHelloTheres its been confirmed now the total number in the hospital killing so that now forms part of the overall number. I’ve woken up this morning and counted atleast 15 dead bodies myself just on my feed, and that’s from what I saw when I logged on for a few minutes and no it wasn’t the same people over and over again.

I’ve also just realised that Semitic means people who speak Semitic languages such as Hebrew and Arabic etc. I always thought anti-Semitic was a term only associated with Jewish people and anti-semitism was a term used to refer to when people were being anti-Semitic to Jewish people. I’ve only just now learned it’s wider meaning. So what I can now see is that people are being anti-Semitic to Palestinian people because they are Semitic too. I’ve seen a Sky Interview broadcast on Wednesday (last night) with the former UN ambassador of Israel and he called Palestinian people, ‘horrible, inhuman animals.’ That is anti-Semitic. But he won’t be called out for it because it is turning out more and more is Palestinians don’t matter.

@Ohlalalalala
Give it a rest. You really think Israel is worse, less trustworthy than Hamas? Who would you rather be responsible for taking care of your child, the IDF or Hamas?

What's your definition of genocide?

@Thisworld10
In the kindest way possible, you need to keep reading if that's your takeaway. Anti-Semitism is specifically about Jewish people. Yes, Arabs are semites too. Hating Arabs isn't called anti-Semitism though as that word is only related to Jews.

If you're not careful and you go around saying what you're saying, you really will be accused of anti-Semitism and it will get you into a lot of trouble. So please, educate yourself a bit further to find out why what you just said isn't ok. I'll try to find you some links later to help you, but it's half term so not sure when that will be.

@OhHelloTheres thanks for that - that’s interesting and I would like to learn more about this term.why is anti-semitism specifically about Jewish people if the actually definition of the term Semitic is as I said above? What is the term for those who hate Arabs then?

@Thisworld10

https://www.quora.com/Can-we-call-racism-against-Arabs-anti-Semitism

There's a good response there.

I don't know what the word for hating Arabs is, I'd personally just call them a generic racist! My family are all Jewish Arabs. You can probably imagine the amount of hate and racism we've all faced in our lives 🙃

I don't have time to find links now but basically, the word antisemitism started being used to describe hating Jews, presumably because Jews were the only Semitic people these particular racist Europeans knew. So it was coined to mean anti-Jewish, used interchangeably, and therefore that is what it means. Not all words mean what they "should" mean, and this is just an example of that. Like inflammable! That one has always annoyed me.

You think the IDF are better than Hamas?

https://www.savethechildren.net/news/stripped-beaten-and-blindfolded-new-research-reveals-ongoing-violence-and-abuse-palestinian

For all of you who say it's not a genocide these are the words of the ex ICC chief

This

It's sad that you attribute compassion and empathy for Palestinian deaths as "Hamas PR". Tbh says more about you than anything else.

If you bother to look at any genuine Palestinian accounts of people - poets, painters, doctors, students, just like us - on Instagram, you will see firsthand the razed buildings, the pieces of bodies flung around, the child without a head, the bleeding torsos, the tears in parents eyes as they bury their children, doctors being told live on air they have lost 15 members of their families. You will see the rubble.

Gazangirl, byplestia and Sbeih are some lovely people I've been looking at, if you don't want to be led by one sided stories on TV. There is also the incredible journalist motaz azaiza who is risking his life to bring you live footage. Sadly, some authentic accounts have been taken down by Instagram as they don't fit the narrative of no targeted civilian deaths.

Oh bore off.
I’m tired of seeing people who are upset about the daily ongoing mass murder of innocent children being told they must educate themselves about the killers who have a speshul right to do this because of things that happened thousands of years ago before any of us were alive.

We’re all descended from people thousands of years ago. Jewish people are no more or less speshul than any of the other 7 billion plus people currently alive and Israelis are a lot better off than many of the poorest people on the planet.

And right now, today, at this moment, the Israeli government is a major contributor to significant ongoing suffering, including to innocent people who have done nothing wrong.

@PureBlackVoid
Has anyone else confirmed this? Studies would normally be peer reviewed. Honestly, I don't trust any charity who on 7th October mentioned "Palestinian armed groups" instead of calling them what they are - terrorists. Do you not see how that shows their bias? Anyway, if you can find a few other legitimate organisations who have verified it I'm happy to come back to this later.

@Parkingt111
They are getting water, food and medical supplies and clearly have fuel since Hamas are still firing rockets on a daily basis. So I guess by the definition you posted it's not genocide? Did you read about Hamas stealing fuel and medical supplies from UNWRA last week? None of this is anywhere near as straightforward as people like to pretend it is.

To be clear, I don't want any of what is happening. But you are all showing you only care about the Palestinians and not the root cause for any of it, so I'm trying to help you understand what is happening. I realise no one is actually listening to what I'm saying but at least I'm trying.

@Dinkydaisy1
But it is Hamas PR! That's exactly what it is. Israel do the same, they also have a PR department. Most organisations and governments do. Hamas stated at least 500 people dead in a hospital and no one questioned it. Turns out it was a hospital car park and nothing to do with Israel, but that no longer matters because the damage is done. It's 100% PR.

@Coughingdodger
You're taking out your anger on the wrong poster or at least the wrong comment. I just explained why anti-Semitism doesn't have anything to do with racism against Arabs, just Jews. That's all that comment was about. And then I did say to keep educating herself and that I was happy to help her do so. I didn't have a go at the poster for what she said, just tried to help her clarify the terminology. I didn't think she meant any harm by it. She seems to realise that as well so not sure why you've got a massive issue with it. I also didn't say that because of anti-Semitism Jews or Israel have a right to do whatever they want. I just explained what anti-Semitism is.

@OhHelloTheres
You’re right, you yourself haven’t been offensive.

But there is a definite angle everywhere right now that no one should be allowed to challenge Israel’s current behaviour because of its history. Which is not acceptable. We are the people currently alive and we should take responsibility for what we do.

@OhHelloTheres please reference the report that says they are stealing supplies thank you

Also there are 2.1 million civilians in Gaza
There has been 60 lorries grudgingly allowed in by Israel so far (note these are supplies from other countries)
That is in essence a drop in the ocean for what is required. I stand by my words
This is a GENOCIDE

The way I see it (and I started off a fortnight ago vaguely on the "Palestinian" side, without much reflection), Hamas has demonstrated itself as such a vicious and terrifying threat to humanity that we should unit with Israel to destroy them if possible. I do realise those last 4 words are a bit like the cartoon below, but given that Hamas has totally fucked over the people of Gaza too, you'd think everyone would want to see them gone.

It's all very well accusing Israel of war crimes, but Hamas's preferred ploy of using its own peole as human shields is also a war crime, one that's recognised as complicating the whole picture of what is a fair battle.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_shield_(law)#

There would be fewer civilian casualties in Gaza if Hamas had spent some of their $300 million on missile defence systems like Israel's iron dome; if they did not deliberately site weapons and launchers in kindergartens, mosques and hospitals; and if they released the hostages.

There would be far more civilian casualities in Gaza if Israel was indiscriminately bombing them instead of preparing for a ground attack. They'd all be dead by now.

"Hamas has demonstrated itself as such a vicious and terrifying threat to humanity that we should unit with Israel to destroy them if possible."

Unite with Israel - so egg on the genocide/ignore the international law violations vs calling for ceasefire?

@OhHelloTheres a meagre 62 trucks of aid have come in since the start of the war in comparison to the 100 needed daily

Aid explained: Four aid convoys have entered Gaza since 7 October, totalling 62 trucks.
But this is far fewer than the 100 trucks a day that UN officials have said were needed to meet just the essential needs of civilians in Gaza.
Even before the conflict, Gaza was reliant on hundreds of aid lorries.
Israel continues to carry out checks on trucks seeking to enter the territory through the Rafah crossing, on the Egyptian border, and has blocked any access to fuel.
Earlier today, the UN Palestinian refugee agency said it was having to share its own fuel within Gaza, facing choices between powering bakeries or incubators.

It's not a report, UNWRA tweeted about it but then deleted it 🙃 Happy to find you a screenshot of it, or an article referencing the tweet if you'd prefer?

I stand by what I say
ISRAEL IS COMMITTING A GENOCIDE

@Parkingt111
please reference the report that says they are stealing supplies thank you

Well, you could start by watching this, especially from 07:10 onwards. The son of a Hamas founding leader should have a pretty good idea of how his dad operates.

He has a lot of other interesting things to say about the situation...

@Alcemeg we have already seen and discussed this remember 😊

Shout it from the rooftops. This needs to be said.