Thread 2 To think Hamas have given Israel the excuse they were looking for?

[MistyMooPup]

First thread here:

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/conflict-in-the-middle-east/4916801-to-think-hamas-have-given-israel-the-excuse-they-were-looking-for?page=38

I haven't changed my views in the slightest.
I DO think that anyone still defending Israeli Government action has a dark soul.

I do think anyone defending the Israeli Government referring to Palestinians as human animals is horrific.

I am absolutely a 💯 supporter of a free palestine
I am absolutely against the current Israeli administration

I am Horrified at the terrorism & vile horrific murders of innocents by Hamas

I am Horrified at the horrific bombing & murder of innocents by the Israeli Gvmt.

I've been consistent.
I misread one post & corrected at earliest opportunity.

Anyone defending dehumanising language or bombing of civilians or ignoring the plight of those babies has a very very dark soul indeed.

@EasternStandard which part of my subsequent post can't you agree with. Not a provokey question - just generally can't see what's controversial about that one & want to try and see it through your eyes.

You can't dehumanise what's not human. Terrorists are not human.

I'm not spending another day being made to feel guilty by those putting themselves on pedestals.

On a more positive note did anyone see the video of the two elderly ladies being released? They seemed like such sweet souls I saw one of them actually turn back around and shake the man's hand before walking away
When I saw her I just remembered my grandmother. Praying the rest of the hostages are released soon

I type really fast, as you must have gathered by now 😜

But yes, although it's clearly not a solution, I also think if I were anyone in Israel now I'd want a gun to defend myself. Actually, I probably wouldn't sleep in my bed without a rocket launcher at the door and windows.

I find the "yes, but" finger-pointing at Israel very difficult to stomach after the events of 7 October. I'm not sure what the appropriate response is to that kind of sadistic savagery. I don't know how they are supposed to honour and spare civilian life when Hamas has so completely infiltrated and corrupated Gaza. A PP mentioned that you can't get a job there if you're not Hamas, and you get your legs broken if you disagree with them.

Sorry if I'm missing something, but what does that say about all the people who have chosen to stay living there over the past 17 years of non-elections? It's hard for them to leave now, but was it hard in the past? I don't know, so excuse my ignorance.

Survivors of the attacks have said that some of the terrorists were women, and that many of those who raped and tortured were ordinary men who crossed the border for work. If this is true, it must make it very difficult to work out who the enemy is.

The hostage situation has really put Israel into a predicament. I'm assuming that the families of the hostages are calling for a ceasefire as their is a greater possibility of them being killed in the bombardment

Yes, I was just watching that. I couldn't get my head around them holding her hand! Very strong ladies.

@Parkingt111 - I agree.
An elderly woman turning to her masked, gun toting captor and saying "shalom".
He shook her hand, and waved her goodbye.
Maybe some humanity exists in this pit of horrors.

I was hoping he'd think - she's just like my grandma.
A touching moment.

Yes she was very dignified and composed considering her ordeal
I read her husband is still a hostage though

I don't know, are they kept in the tunnels under Gaza?

I understand that she's a lifelong peace activist [if it's the same person]

Yes, indeed.

No idea. I'm sure I read somewhere that Hamas said some hostages had been killed in the bombings but don't quote me on it I'll see if l can find a source.
I'm not sure if the strikes can damage the tunnels either

She is. She and her husband (still captive) had a system of driving to the border with medicine and other supplies, and taking people for medical care in Israel. Their daughter was on the news.
I hope he gets released soon.

Changing your tone again. What happened to the peace you want.

Best not to acknowledge your BS anymore.

Yes, I think they're kept in the tunnels because I remember reading about Israelis capturing a tunnel and finding evidence that hostages had been kept there. It's entirely possible some have been killed in the bombing though.

Aye but according to @Wonkasworld they aren't human. This lady certainly found them human.

Hate begets hate.

She is worth a million of most of us.

On a previous incursion, I should have said.

I dread to think what the hostages have witnessed.

She did. That's what gives me hope. She treated him as a human, he responded in that moment.

I did see on the news the name of these two hostages on Friday. That Hamas said they wanted to release them on humanitarian grounds and they said Israel had refused. And only accepted the two American hostages.
And then I saw there were some protests in Tel Aviv. Now before you all jump on me and say how can you take Hamas's word over Netanyahus, I'd like to clarify that I'm just relating what I read.
As many of us on here have agreed that in war their are alot of politics. As a rhetorical question IF Israel did reject the release what reason could there be?
Would there be more pressure on them for a ceasefire? Is that something they wouldn't want at this stage

Well said @Maireas unmumsnetty hug