TTC a lot longer than 10 months past and present

[Cosmonaut1]

A thread full of the loveliest people

nelly that sounds great. I am a bit sceptical about the menstrual blood testing. We did it because there are a couple of the bugs they test for that can cause implantation failure/mc. Those are what we were really interested in. Our cycle was negative for those, but positive for hidden c and one other thing. As i've said before, we never did any treatment as the antiobiotic situation was too complicated in light of our allergies to them so who knows if it would have made a difference. Two visits to Greece doesn't sound like too much of a harship really.

sea the regular scans must be reassuring. I had one at 6 weeks at my clinic, then 7 and 8 weeks at the EPU when I was bleeding, and then 10 and 12 weeks for the Harmony testing. I now somehow have to get through 8 more weeks without a peek!

free I hear you on the mc sadness. I still feel sad about mine. I intended to do something to mark the occasion but never got around to it. It was Spring (in fact I was told I would lose it just before Mother's Day and started bleeding the day after Mother's Day) so I thought I might get a daffodil charm for my bracelet or something. Maybe I will do it on the first anniversary instead.

critter thank you for your kind words. I am so glad that you have managed a night out. You are doing brilliantly. The weather improving and the prospect of some Caribbean sun must be helping. I hope your dr's appointment goes well.

Critter - that's really interesting about your Dad. It is strange how some people have these premonitions. But I am glad he sees a happy future. How was last night?

Cos - your hormones will be all over the place. I still can't believe you are going through this yet again. It is so bloody unfair. I hope you are ok.

Euro - your posting on here is a good thing and not a negative. Personally it gives me huge hope. There is enough bad luck on here so it is lovely to have positive outcomes.

Nelly - that's all great about Penny. I think she does genuinely care from what I've read. She also chooses good looking donors apparently. I am intrigued about what you choose. I think sporty would be near the top for me!

Free - you are frightened because you have spent the best part of 5 years trying to get here. It's a horrible pressure but 15 weeks is amazing and I just hope it all goes quickly from now on.

Ray - AF is so unreliable when you need it to be reliable. I hope it plays ball.

Bit cross/ envious, a part time colleague who does a completely different job to me and is going on maternity leave in a few weeks and muggins here is having to take on her job whilst she is off. It will be an extra 15 hours a week - no extra pay of course. She has barely made it in this year as well and has been working at home, telling the manager how hard it is to carry a big lump around in her stomach.
Just wish I could get special treatment too or preferably go on maternity leave. Period is about to arrive, hence the grump.

cos it's so unfair you're going through this again. Do you have an idea when you will get the results back from the epu? Are you now being treated for recurrent miscarriage? I'm thinking about you.

critter I hope you enjoyed your evening. It sounds like you have lovely people around you.

fox I hope the cocktails and sunshine are going down well. Jealous!

nelly two trips to Athens could be worse. Stocking up on Vit D is never a bad idea. Penny sounds great. Will you ask for a hobbling donor? I must admit I read somewhere about her only choosing good looking donors and I felt a bit about that because I hate that physical appearance has a value or that one person gets to decide what counts as good looking. Will you ask for someone with similar colouring to you? What information do you find out about the donor?

devon that sounds very annoying about the maternity leave cover. They really should give you an honorarium. I bet a man would be given extra pay. I know it's not the done thing to say but women and maternity leave is a pita at work. Here you're not allowed to work 6 weeks before the birth and it's very common for people to get signed off a long time before that with things that would never warrant stopping work in the UK. Then women tend to take at least 12 months after the birth because maternity pay is quite generous. It's rare for them to bring in maternity cover so the rest of us end up doing the work of two people while they're away. When people have a long time off for maternity it's also very common for them to come back already pregnant.

euro I hadn't really cottoned on to the fact that you're 12 weeks already. I can't believe how fast it's gone, although I realise probably not for you. When's your due date?

to all of you that have suffered losses. One of the good things with never having sperm or egg meet or do the implantation bit is that I've never had to go through the cruelty of a miscarriage. Something that upset me was reading that after ivf the chance of miscarriage isn't reduced so there is still a 1 in 4 chance of not reaching 12 weeks. It's all so bloody unfair.

euro What a wonderful outcome for your tests. I am pleased that you can now start to enjoy the next phase a little more now.

critter I wanted to say (without it seeming patronising or all cheerleadery - hopefully!) how much I admire you at the moment. I wanted to say it because it must be a tremendous effort for you to keep putting one foot in front of the other right now and I want you to know how brave & strong I think you are.
Your Dad's premonition is strange. I believe in "witchy" feelings or maybe gut feeling is a better word for it but your Dad's premonition seems more than that. It must be a comfort that he sees good things ahead. I have often thought that I would like someone to be able to tell me that. We have a neighbour who looks like a old fashioned Romany gypsy and I often think that I would like her to give me a 'sign' asking me to tell her how much the Kitkats were in the Poundshop doesn't count I'm guessing! I should also point out that I don't know that she actually is a Romany gyspy either!

Cos hand squeeze for you. I am so sorry for you and have been thinking of you over the last few days. It is no wonder that you will be feeling strange. You have gone through a massive, massive disappointment again and also your body is resetting itself too. Aw Cos I so feel for you, I really do.

Princess You sounded about as attractive as I am was. You made me laugh at MrP's reaction to your childhood photos.
I am sorry to hear that you are having MIL ishoos. Do you think that Mini Princess's arrival is part of it? I can sympathise with you & it's horrible. In fact I have found it more hurtful than the ishoos with my own mother.

nelly Everything sounds like it is progressing nicely on the Athens front. You must feel pretty excited/keyed up after so long with nowt much happening? It must a comfort to know that so much care goes in to selecting the donor. I think that it would be my fear that it would be too random but it sounds like you get to lay down quite a narrow criteria. I think a Nobel prize winning, supermodel, multi lingual, prima ballerina with a Michelin star sounds a perfectly reasonable requirement to me

Lemons How are you and little lembie? Do have a look at MiniBee's photos, she is a stunner. I have to say too that all the Ten Plusser babies that I have seen have been absolutely adorable and by far the nicest looking babies I have seen. Critter I saw the photos of James on the other place and was blown away by how perfect he is, even MrP who thinks that babies are fugly stopped to look and said how lovely he is.

devon I can understand your frustration at having to take on extra work and hours to cover this maternity leave. That really must take the biscuit. No extra money either to take the sting away a bit.

I agree with ray that I am grateful to have never undergone the pain of an MC or even a CP. I can imagine how it would feel but know that I can never know how devastating it must be. free it was touching to read how you feel and euro what a lovely idea about buying a daffodil charm.

Crappy CD1 here and I am a bit pissed off that my cycle seems to have reverted to it's old ways of super late ovulation. 33 day cycles can bog off frankly!

critter I hope you had a few drinks last night, and that all goes well with your appointment today

nelly when do you plan to go out ?? I found it interesting that they ask you so many things about your donor, Reprofit were rather basic is what they asked, hair, eye colour, height etc, its interesting about learned vs inborn traits, my ex husband found out he had an older brother that no one knew about and I was amazed how he and my former FIL had the same hand gestures even though they had never met until he was 44. I did wonder what the donor might look like, really Serum with its Greek connection might have been better suited for us but babybee looks like her dad anyway.
You can ask for a proven donor, I know some women have asked for their donors to be around a certain age

devon screw covering for someone else and not getting paid for it

cos Big hugs, its natural to feel this way, life has been shitty towards you.

ray I hope AF stays away long enough for you

lemon I bought an outfit when I was first pregnant, I remember after my second loss holding it and wondering if I would ever have a baby to wear it, I made sure it was the first thing babybee wore.

foxy Enjoy the sunshine :)

Pout sorry about the crap long cycle, its shitty enough without having to wait longer to ovulate

Critter you're simply amazing. I can't begin to express how brilliantly you've coped with all of this. I hope you had a nice time with your friends; I also hope the meeting with your doctor goes well. Thinking of you and MrC.

Pout yes, mini princess's arrival has caused some tensions, but really the damage was done when we lived there. I just hadn't appreciated how badly I'd offended them (not intentionally). And how petty they could be. And in my opinion, spiteful to boot. Meh.

cos I hope you're doing ok. The hormonal comedown will be horrible alongside all of the emotional and physical stuff. Thinking of you lots and lots. Xx

Nelly that all sounds very very exciting.

Ray hoping af plays ball for you. I've lots of confidence for your next round.

I recently read "waiting for daisy" which made me cry a lot, and filled me with even more hope for all of you still waiting, and took me back to TTC days. A good but emotional read. Funnily enough I came across it as a reference in a new philosophy book about Hobbes (a thinker from the 17th Century) about keeping going in the face of adversity.

Hugs and lots of cheerleading for everyone xxx

Hi everyone

buzzy I did have a few sneaky glasses of cava the other night and it was nice to have a bit of booze and sort of symbolically get back to post-pregnancy normality - and really nice to be out with my friends too. None of them have children and they are all great value. Baby bee does look a lot like Barry - I have noticed newborns often resemble their dads, I wonder why.

princess I'm so sorry to hear about the in law woe. They aren't smart to pick a fight with you - ultimately, not treating you kindly will hurt them as much as you, as you're the mother of their granddaughter, and the woman their son has chosen. It sucks. I do hope settle down. Could MrP say something if there's a misunderstanding that might be cleared up? My in laws have stressed me out in the past with thoughtless comments and mild intrusiveness, but they have been amazingly kind and unselfish during the past month, and it's brought us together.

pout thank you for what you wrote, it made me feel better. I am sorry about CD1. Long cycles are totally crap, I agree. How are you doing? You must feel in limbo at the moment. It's a horrible place to be. I was really touched and proud that even the picky baby connoisseur MrP thought James was cute! I told MrC and he was also very amused.

ray I haven't had a mc either, but having had a loss, I can say that it's no picnic but longterm TTC is also bloody awful. I guess I'd compare the two types of pains as an amputation vs something chronic and debilitating - like really excruciating, miserable, constant migraines. Cheery thoughts for a Thursday morning!

devon that's annoying about the colleague. My lovely colleague who's doing my job for me at the moment got a pay bump to compensate her for the extra responsibilities and workload (she's considerably younger and more junior than me, but also amazing and mega bright and well organised). If they are asking you to do more work without a compensatory salary increase, it's effectively like asking you to take a pay cut. Grumping is totally justified IMO! I would be disgruntled too.

lemon I sent a little cardigan and hat that I'd knitted for James to be cremated along with him, as well as a small teddy and a note to him. But I've kept other things for the twibling. It would be nice to do something to memorialise your April baby - you could plant some beautiful perennial flowers or bulbs maybe that would come up every year? April is such a hopeful and beautiful month, with nature waking up from winter. You will always think of him or her and wonder what might have been, but perhaps there is comfort in the world's sweetness at that time symbolising your child's beautiful spirit, and how you had the strength to keep going and not lose hope. I am sure your April baby is really proud of you.

euro sending you tight hugs. I'm sure the anniversary of your mc will be really hard - I'm so glad you are in a better place this year.

cos I am still thinking of you every day and sending you love and strength.

I had my follow up appointment yesterday with the doctor. Loved him just as much as before. He said my incision was healing really well and gave me the ok for exercise and baths and sexy time. I was most excited about the baths! He also said that it wasn't exactly vasa previa, as in that, the membranes grow over the cervix and they hadn't with my pregnancy - the placenta was high up. But he did say that the placenta was malformed - the cord wasn't growing out of the middle, but was in one corner, and the membranes with the veins and arteries attached to the placenta and flowing into the cord were tented (rather than flat on the surface of the placenta) and therefore more fragile. He said he's pretty sure that at least one of the membranes ruptured, meaning that the baby was bleeding as well as me. And there was also a clot in one of the veins, so he's ordered blood tests to check whether I have any clotting disorders. We asked him whether I might have a natural birth or a c section if/when there's a next time and he said that we'd play it by ear but he'd be monitoring me extremely closely and if he had any concerns at all, he'd do a planned c section. So that was reassuring. He's going to check in with us in a couple of months too.

devon that's a right cheek about the extra work for no money!

ray I have to say the past 11 weeks (since EC) have moved interminably slowly for me. It is almost like time has been standing still. I am hoping that the stress will ease now and time will move at a normal pace again!

nelly I reckon pout is spot on with the donor criteria.

pout how annoying about the long cycle - that just means more waiting!

cos I'm thinking of you. How are you doing?

critter I've heard newborns resembling their dad is nature's way of indicating paternity, so the dad would stick around and provide for his offspring. Certainly so many seem to look like their dads at that stage, even if that changes later.

I'm glad that the night out went well and that the meeting with your dr went well too, and that he had some answers. It must be reassuring that you will be monitored closely next time. And there will be a next time, in the not too distant future. I'm sure of that. The twiblings are waiting.

Critter, you and MrC just blow me away. You really are awesome. Your doc sounds it too, and it's fascinating what they can learn out of this, which will hopefully result in a simple successful joyous twibling arrival. Hurrah for healing scars and cheeky fizz. I agree with how beautiful James looks in those pics. I lived that fussy MrP agreed.

Buzzy the fact you put minibee in the outfit you bought first time around made me well up for some reason. Reading the last few posts about all the loss we've all suffered has been very emotional. I don't tend to think of my CP as a loss but in its own way I guess it was. A looooong time ago I used to naively subscribe to the view that a MC was "better" than never having got pregnant because at least you were getting closer and had hope. Now I still feel that, but it only applies if that MC was as a result of a very short time TTC. Once you've been on our road I think a MC is insanely cruel and I can't imagine how you must all have dealt with it. But yet I see so much hope for you all now.

And on that note I think I'm 14DPO with no spotting. But usually when I write that AF arrives. And I could have got my cycle wrong but I had proper EWCM exactly 2 weeks ago; I don't know how that fits timing wise. I doubt I'm pregnant. That'd be too easy.

Pout I like your approach on the DE qualities! Dev I didn't know that about the "good looking" donors. Well I mean it's only right given how gorgeous I am . But seriously I'm not sure how I feel about that, it is all a tiny bit exploitative. They use proven donors who have sometimes donated 5 times. That's a lot of hormones. And also I've no idea what truly comes from DNA. So I'd be thinking along the lines of slim build, athletic, and not allergic to animals! My mum is quite artistic and sings well, I can do neither of those things. So who knows what matters and gets passed on.

Better go for now, I suspect I'll be back wailing about AF's arrival soon.

Oh Critter, you are ever so sweet. I’ve just got AF so a bit teary anyway but what you said to Lemon made me well up. I’m so pleased you have a great doctor. It must be distressing to go over events though and finding out exactly what happened. I hope you were both ok afterwards. That’s good they are going to test for any clotting problems but does he generally think it was tragic bad luck? It must be of great comfort to know he will look after you in your next pregnancy.

Pout – you did make me giggle at the romany gypsy neighbour! Sorry about the long cycles returning. That’s a real pain. My cycles have returned back to 28 days after being freakishly short for so many years. I do think ivf messes around with cycles.

Ray – I still think it’s just as hard if you haven’t been pregnant though. Ivf failure, infertility is a loss in itself and brings its own worries as does miscarriage. Miscarriage after fertility treatment does seem particularly cruel. It’s a double blow. After my first miscarriage, I remember saying, at least we hadn’t been trying long and at least it was free – in the sense that it happened naturally. It felt like i had so much more to lose after ivf and technically I did. It’s also much easier to talk about miscarriage than it is infertility which most people will never have to deal with. I was reading on the BBC today that miscarriage rate is about 1 in 7 so not the 1 in 3 that doctors often say. My clinic’s miscarriage rates in my age range was 9% .
And wow at the maternity where you are. I guess if you can do it, it’s a great incentive to keep having kids! It feels unjust when you desperately what to have a baby and yet you find yourself year after year covering for other people on maternity. Talk about rubbing salt in wounds!

Nelly – I think that is a very common view that it is better to have a m/c than not. That probably comes from doctors. I was told on numerous occasions by doctors, “well at least you know everything works”, “it’s a good thing, you know you can get pregnant”. And actually I think for most, it is a good sign that all is actually well although of course no one feels like that until they conceive again. But I certainly don’t take any comfort or hope from my pregnancies, the whole prospect of a successful pregnancy still feels like the impossible dream just as it does for those of us who haven’t been pregnant.
I found the explanation for choosing beautiful donors satisfactory actually. When I first read it, it didn’t seem exploitative. “The resulting babies from treatment are very important to Penny and she believes that beautiful and intelligent people tend to have better lives and that beautiful children will tend to fit better into families, so she does only accept donors who she judges to be beautiful.”
I actually wonder whether being exceptionally beautiful is more of a hindrance though but I bet a lot of this ‘beauty’ she mentions is more on the inside rather than the outside. Like I think of everyone on here as beautiful even though many I haven’t met or know what you like.

Thank you for your lovely post to me on the April baby, critter. It made me teary and grateful. The odd thing is that I did think I mourned that loss well and truly, but it has come back now we're looking at April as my last month at work for a while and welcoming Lembie not that long after. Perennials are a wonderful idea. We are currently house hunting, so if we manage to find one I'll definitely sow some either this year or next the north facing balcony won't stand a chance of having happy flower growth although I did sow some lavender in pots that made it through the winter last year.

I am happy that most of James' stuff will be used by his twiblings, it's as it should be with an older brother. It's heart-breaking over and over again, that you had to cremate him, with all your love stitched in the cardigan and written in the note. I am glad the consultant continues to be amazing and that you'll be very closely monitored next time. No ifs, but whens!

I used to be of the "a mc is better than no pg" school. Although, it certainly didn't feel like that at the time. But I agree with critter, it's a loss that is shorter and sharper, but easier for people to sympathise. Long-term TTC is so soul-destroying, and people just don't understand. It is one of the most difficult things I've dealt with and I wonder whether I really dealt with it, or just got lucky and have compensatory kicks to make it feel further away. Mc after fertility treatment I agree is just a kick in the teeth, devon.

I like the idea of Penny's beauty criterium applying to more than appearance, we'd all be excellent egg donors if we were ten years younger and happened to be fertile.

How's the AF situation, ray? I am keeping stuff crossed for no, or really late so you can cycle invasion. Interesting nelly. I won't get too excited on your behalf, but it would make the world a slightly fairer place if it just happened for you.

Wave and loves to you all.

I'm back but how I wish I wasn't!

Critter you looked so so beautiful in the photo you shared and James looks perfect. I am so glad that you have been out and that you have time in the sun planned, it will feel so nice on your face I promise. I continue to think of you so much - you are doing amazingly. I identify with your description of the pains of ttc and acute loss. I wish none of us had to experience either or any of this. It is strange that your Dad had those feelings. I do believe that there are strange gut feelings that we have sometimes. But he sees lovely things ahead and so do I. From my first negative test I felt that this wouldn't happen to me and that we would adopt in the end. However, I know that others have felt this and have got there so I am hoping it is me being an eeyore rather than a premonition.

Euro did I say congratulations? I say it again

Nellington - a missing period? I really hope that Penny has cast some of her genius down the phone free of charge!

I am fallen behind. Will go and have a read. Good to see Princess here and lemon, I like our past and present thread title.

We are phoning the PCT every two hours. It makes my blood boil that this is the level of effort needed to get any help or movement with this whole wretched situation. I have raging PMT can anyone tell?!! I often get none but then some months its like all saved up and unleashed. I am walking around in a bubble of horrible!

I'm very very pished....can't do a catch up but I luffs you all.....and gin

Cos . I'm so glad you are pished! Gin is indeed good. I hope you still feel that way tomorrow. .

Fox I'm sorry you had to leave the sunshine. And especially horrified about the PCT cock up. This is a ridiculous state of affairs. I'm so angry on your behalf.

Still no AF but getting that feeling like its on its way. No doubt. Why would it not, huh?

Nelly I'm in exactly the same situation but have had on off spotting. I'm six weeks into dhea now and convinced its messed things up as I feel thunderous but not like my proper period is imminent. I also have greasy greasy hair. Given that I'm committed in my head to donor I don't really know why I'm taking it. I guess my genes are quietly and subconsciously fighting on. We do ovulate and our tubes are open and floaty. There are sperms and wombs. It could happen.

Cos hurray for gin and it's warm fuggy retreat. You've had a tough time and deserve to be hiccupy. Big loves.

Cos - hurrah for being pished!!!
Nelly - when does AF normally come? Tempted to pish on a stick?
Fox - boo for holiday being over . Have to had any side effects of dhea? Sorry about the mood too. But you are right, very hard to give up when your body actually is working.
So so sad tonight, my parents darling spaniel was run over and killed by a car today. She wasn't even two. I know she is just a dog but She really was like my mum's grandchild and the thought of what happened is unbearable. Trying to get the thought out my head but I can't.

Oh Devon I'm so sorry to hear that. Pets are like family. Big love to you x

Oh Dev :(. I know our pets are the most precious thing in the world to us and the thought of losing them terrifies us. But to add in a nasty surprise accident is just awful. Thinking of your parents, and you too.

No POAS action here. Had a tiny hint of sludge gate last night in my knickers (sorry, it's too early for sensitivity!) so I'm sure it will be here soon. My cycle hasn't been very regular lately, think this is longer than recent ones but if I'm honest I'm not sure I can remember when my last one started! I think the Saturday so today would be my "long" average

Fox I'm sorry about your headfuckery too. Now wouldn't this be a weird thing to happen to us both .

Oh by the way where do I get the supplies needed to post my period to Greece? And Dev thanks for what you said about Penny, can you remember where you read that info about choosing donors etc?

Right awake early so better go shovel shit.

devon I am so sorry. I know I would be devastated too. Our pets were always very much part of the family.

cos that made me smile. I hope you are not paying the price this morning.

fox I can't believe the PCT is being so shit. Did you ever get through? I hope you at least had a wonderful time in the sun. My work trip to Israel last month really managed to lift me out of the winter gloom, even though I only managed to take in about 3 hrs of Med sunshine between meetings.

nelly I bought a sample pot in Boots for 50p. The first one leaked so I had to wait a month to try again as I had stopped bleeding freely. At least it leaked before I posted it... I wrapped it in tissue, a freezer bag and then one of those padded envelopes. I had to try several post boxes though - it was too chunky for some slots!

On the subject of mcs, awful as it was, it did give me some small comfort in a couple of ways. I had felt certain I wouldn't be able to have children for years, so those brief weeks of pregnancy symptoms were something I thought I would never experience and showed me that (with help) pregnancy seemed to be something my body could do. Also, I was hugely sceptical about IVF working for us, as no one could tell me why it might as we were unexplained, so it gave me what I needed to keep going through subsequent rounds. Long term ttc dragged me down more by its sheer relentlessness.

...ouch.....what's that banging?

Cos hope you can have a lie in and that you had a lovely night.

Euro the man we need to speak to was in a meeting ALL DAY. My arse. Hourly ringing always works in the end though. Best case scenario can't imagine a cycle til summer now.

How are you Devon? As for dhea well I read the internet back to front and decided to do it but on a low dose so I got a pill cutter and am having 12.5mg a day so far. Some would consider this still very high dosage and I was wary, I hate drugs. So far I'm great on it apart from greasier hair which I never get and itchy skin a bit. No spots etc. in fact, since taking it I've felt bloody marvellous! More energy, no ibs, it's the wellest I've felt since my glandular fever in 2011. Makes me wonder if I was a bit off somewhere in the hormone chain. However, this period is rather a disaster. Who knows.

Nelly I'm having a non period of spotting and small cramps. Lowish temp today, not that I've charted but it tells me what I need to know. I'm mentalling about peri menopause far more than pregnancy these days.

dev honey I am so so sorry about your parents' little spaniel. It's awful to think of an animal being frightened and in pain. Poor little thing.

euro I love the practicalities behind the period sending! Do they not give you advice on how to send it? And you don't have to use a cool bag or icepack in there too?

nelly are you taking the DHEA as well?

fox sorry that you're home but hooray for a well deserved sunny holiday. It's amazing what a difference it makes when the sun is shining. It's actually one of the things I love about living here (although it is grey today) - the skies are often blue, even when it's cold.

Sister critter is coming back to visit for a week, arriving tomorrow, and we're going to go shopping for clothes. I haven't bought anything new in ages, so I figure this is as good a time as any to spruce myself up a bit. I am also still knitting up a storm for the twibling and loving it. When I feel flat and sad, it's one of the only things that makes me feel better - it's making me feel productive and like I'm doing something useful to prepare for the future.

Critter I'm glad your sister is coming and that you have girly things planned. You can shop for things that make you feel lovely and holiday stuff. I LOVE a good shop Great that you're knitting up a twibling storm. I want to sew baby clothes but the not sure what size/colour gets in the way, I've found neutral sewing things harder to find than sewing. How's the scar healing doing?

I mean knitting. I've been tripping up on words all day. My period is here I think but is unrecognisable, it's just not 'usual'. Trying not to worry and failing. Post menopausal women can do donor treatment. Repeats mantra to self.