TTC Super Ovulation...

[duggs1976]

hey ladies,

There are a few of us who are ttc after mc's, however there will be ladies out there who are also ttc for the first time or second or third without success. If anyone is on, considering or had success on a super ovulation programme then do join us. How long did it take ? Did you try IUI with it.. ? Did you have PCOS?

Kicking this off and hoping some of you will join....

Hi all sorry to hear lots of you are having cycle problems, it's all a pita!

Abney sorry your cycle was not succsessful but fingers ccrossed for this cycle.

Sue can understand what you are saying about hoping they would have found something at your hysteroscopy. At least it is something else crossed off the list.

Ari fab news about the follie, wishing you lots of luck this month.

Welcome to Pinkdragon.

Thanks for asking about the ivf Sue, I am having two embryos put back on Thursday and dreading the 2ww!! Also not jsut having to worry about if I get pregnant or not now but if the damn nk cells will kill it off, large sigh!

Hi ladies -

Welcome to pinkdragon, wish you lots of success with your SO journey! There are several of us now, both here and on the Pred thread, who have experienced exactly what you're seeing - able to get pregnant really easily until starting on steroids, then nada.

sue Fingers crossed for your natural BFP, when are you planning to test, or are you just waiting to see if AF turns up when she shouldn't? I understand quite a few ladies say having a hysteroscopy somehow makes them more immediately fertile, and indeed I know one case where this is exactly what happened. Young girl who had had 3 early miscarriages, NHS testing didn't show anything up, they did a hysteroscopy on her and within 2 cycles she was pregnant and is now I think 18 weeks.

pebbles Lots of luck for your embryo implant! Will you be taking pred from when they put the embryos back? I know what you mean about the darn NK cells - we all have enough to worry about just getting pregnant in the first place, without having the extra worry of our wretched bodies then killing it off!

Well I had major ovulation pains almost bang on 36 hours after doing the trigger shot, so Mr S was spot on there. Not heaping too much hope on my one lonely little follie, but will be interested to see what AF ends up like after this being the second cycle not on the pred. I'll test 12DPO but I understand the Ovitrelle can hang about in the system for that long, is that right?

/waves to everyone

Hi pinkdragon, it is a worry that there seem to be so many of us coming out of the woodwork who were getting pregnant extremely easily before starting on the steroids and then no having any luck at all. I've been TTC for 13 months this time, since being on the steroids when before I had become pregnant within 1-3 cycles 6 times! Unless there is something in the "unfussy uterus" theory where before we were getting pregnant too easily by defective sperm? Who knows.

I'm all confused. I am supposed to have my hysteroscopy tomorrow. I am on CD29 and my period hasn't shown up yet after my freak CD24 possible ovulation. Just waiting for the nurse to call me back to see if I should bother going in or not. I do feel like I might come on anytime now though so if that happens I don't even know if they can do a hysteroscopy whilst I'm bleeding anyway. God, why can't things just be a bit more straightforward. I'm sick of all of this.

Still, on the plus side, I went to see my best friend and her kids yesterday and they asked if I would be their "unofficial godmother" which was very sweet. That basically means that it doesn't matter than I am a jewish atheist, that I'm not expected to set them a "good example" just that I am more like a special auntie. They've always called me Auntie Kittens (well, obviously not actually Kittens!) anyway but this was a little bit more special.

Just a thought kittens, but what is your usual luteal phase? If you go with the assumption that you did indeed ovulate on CD24, then if your LP is usually (for example) 13 days you wouldn't be due on yet for another 8 days? No clue if they still do a hysteroscopy while AF is in town, but I share your frustration - this journey is all a bit much sometimes. Well, most of the time these days! hugs for your frustration, hopefully the nurse will give you some useful answers.

My luteal phase is only around 10 days usually. The thing is that when I spoke to the secretary she said I was lucky to get an appointment so quickly and that the waiting list was really long so if I can't have it tomorrow then who knows when it will be. I may have to just go anyway tomorrow if I don't hear back and then perhaps if I've been for a preliminary appointment I may get back in more quickly. It's bizzare that they make the appointment without knowing where you are on your cycle anyway. I only found out about the appointment last Wednesday and I didn't even know what the appointment was for. I just got a text reminder!

I'm just so over having tests, TTC etc. I am also really cross about all the time last year that I couldn't be in France with my Mum because I was ovulating or having tests and trying to time everything and I have got absolutely nowhere whilst also loosing that valuable time. FFS!

Still none the wiser cycle-wise. Have re-scheduled for 30 May to be safe. Funny, the nurse called me on my mobile and I was out so I went around the corner to a quiet street to discuss finer details. Leaning on a lamp post in a quiet private road only to realise I'd had the entire conversation next to some bloke's open car window who was parked up. How enlightening for him.

kittens it would have been all too technical for him to understand

Hey Ari started pred today as have to take it 2-3 days before transfer. Sadly enough have actually been looking forward to it to improve my skin and get rid of my eczema!
The ovitrelle hangs around for about ten days I was told so be careful if early testing. Fingers crossed for you.

Glad you have got your appointment changed, made me lol thinking of that guy in the car listening to your conversation! He was probably feeling relieved he is a bloke!
It is very frustrating looking back on all the time you have spent having test and ttc and with the situation with your mum you are bound to feel like that. On the other hand if you hadn't been doing all that you would be frustrated you had wasted time not ttc. You can't win!

mmmm I haven't read all the thread as you guys have been chatting for a long time, but what are your thoughts re taking the pred for a long time and not getting pg? Are you just carrying on taking it? I have been taking it for about 18months now and not a sniff at a BFP for a year! Wondering whether to stop taking

Personally pink I have made the decision to stop taking it until/unless I get a BFP. I see little point in carrying on taking it from ovulation every month if it is preventing me from even getting a BFP - what's the good of surpressing my NKCells if there's nothing to surpress them from? Having said that, I am also on hydroxychloroquine, which I have to hope is doing something to keep my NKCs down anyway. YMMV, but that's my own personal decision. Being 44, I don't have time left to me to carry on 'experimenting'.

kittens I cracked up at the thought of that chap having a good listen in - but you know, he probably didn't understand a word! Excellent that you managed to get another appointment so quickly. Fingers crossed you won't be needing it :)

pebbles I know what you mean about the steroids getting rid of eczema, that and getting rid of my psoriasis was the only good thing about taking the pred! However, I've discovered that DHEA has the same effect, I am currently psoriasis-free, which is fab :)

mmm that's what I was considering. Do you know how, in your opinion, the pred would actually stop us conceiving? I am pretty sure I am still ovulating each month.

pinkdragon are your cycles the same?? Do you ovulate at the same time?? I found that my cycle lengths are different and that my ovulation days vary too, before the steroids I was fairly regular.

Well, they are similar but I do sometimes ovulate later in my cycle, and I have had a few short cycles too. GGggrrr annoying, i thought the steroids were supposed to help but now it's a year since my last bfp and I am wondering why When we first started trying I was pregnant 3 times in 8 months, albeit they all ended early, but at least got pregnant. Do you think it matters different cycle lengths and ovulation days....so long as you know when ovulating so can time it right?

I got pregnant quite quickly before but then I started on the steroids and I find that I'm having to monitor my cycle closely in case I ovulate early, i just didn't get on with the steroids, couldn't sleep mood swings. I went to see Dr S and he agreed that as my level was only 1.26 I could take the steroids from bfp, and to double my vit D and omega 3 and to take progesterone from Ovulation to help surpress my nk cells. I'm hoping that will do the trick. I also had very light periods which I personally put down to the steroids too.

As long as you know when you ovulate then you're ok as long as its not too early that the egg hasn't had time to develop and as long as your luteal phase is at least 10 days you should be fine. good luck

Mmmm thanks for that. Interesting. I guess I will try the SO programme for a few months and see what happens. I have lost track of this cycle now. I am day 17 and don't think I have ovulated yet, but not sure as I only have the cheap OPK's which are hard to read. Will stay on this thread and see how things go with everyone

Well I don't have any hard-and-fast answers as to how exactly steroid use might stop us getting pregnant (except for what ladies on here and the Pred thread have found to be the case, and what I feel has happened to my own body), but I just did a very quick search and found two hits straight off, both from body-building websites, where obviously steroid use is much more common. On one there was this post:

A woman's reproductive system is in the line of fire when steroids are in use because of diminished estrogen activity. Her hypothalamis-pituitary-gonadal axis is off balance. With the increase of testosterone circulating, a decline in estrogen and progesterone occurs. Steroid use can result in the inhibition of follicle formation, ovulation, and irregularities of menstrual cycle which can lead to amenorrhea (absence or suppression of the menstrual cycle). A study conducted with 9 female weight-lifters showed all, but 2 women had menstrual abnormalities (Malarkey et al.; 1991).

And another, the website is pregnancy.lovetoknow.com/wiki/Low_Fertility_Caused_by_Steroids , and a quote from that page says:

Women who take regular corticosteroids and are hoping to conceive must be carefully managed by their physician for a weaning off period to avoid the risk of pregnancy problems and potential birth defects. For some women, the damage may be long-lasting as steroid use can have a significant impact on the menstrual cycle and the ability to conceive.

Now this was only the first two hits I looked at - I don't have time right now to do a better search - but it seems to me that there are definite known issues about steroids and female fertility. I know for us the use of steroids may be unavoidable as a way to avoid miscarriage, but if there is a possible disruption to the menstrual cycle/ability to conceive, this should be born in mind.

Just my tuppence worth, I am not a doctor!

And specifically searching on prednisone itself (the US name for prednisolone), one of the prime side-effects for this steroid is listed as:

High dosages of steroids (or even a smallest dose of steroid for those whose body/metabolism does not support steroid at all) may lead to problems related to menstrual cycles in women patients. They may experience irregularity in menstrual cycle occurrence or no menstrual cycle occurrence at all.

Disruption of menstrual cycles could well lead to lack of ability to conceive, I would have said. Seems like a no-brainer to me.

ari thanks for the research :) makes me feel less like a neurotic nutcase about it all

It does make me wonder (anew) why Mr S is so insistent that pred doesn't affect menstrual cycles - which it clearly can. shrug

I don't understand either as there are enough of us saying so, maybe we are in the minority so he doesn't think it matters

Surely though, with that information (which he must be privy to, surely) and all of us with our sudden failure to conceive after so long when we conceived remarkably quickly before, he should consider that this may be a problem. This is really starting to bug me, I have to admit. Obviously we are in his hands because we are all trying desperately to avoid another miscarriage but as someone said earlier today, it's all very well taking something to prevent loosing a baby but it's not much help if there is no baby to loose in the first place.

I feel at the moment as if I am between a rock and a hard place with the pred.

I asked Louise the other week if it was possible to just take the hydroxy and she told me someone had just miscarried taking that and not the pred so she thought it was risky. Hmmmm, what to do?

kittens it is tough, would you start the Pred at a BFP??? Sounds like this other lady was just on Hydroxy. I worry about taking it from a BFP but hopefully taking the other stuff will help. It all seems to be trial and error

I just don't know. My levels went up from high - around 1.45 to v high, 2.6 something, I think (can't even remember now!) when retested after a 2 month break after 6 months on pred. I'm not sure if that means it would be too risky or not not to take it.

I was sort of hoping that when I mentioned how bad the pred were making me feel that Louise may suggest hydroxy until BFP and pred from BFP but she didn't seem keen.

kittens that is high, maybe mention it to him next time you see him, mine was 1.26 so he didn't have problem with it, i asked about Hydroxy but I got the impression that he would only prescribe it after I miscarried again

Is the amount of pred we take considered high? I have emailed Louise today as I am pretty concerned...I almost want to have a couple of months without it to see if I can at least get pregnant again, well I do and I don't. I am seriously considering a consult with Prof Q just to get another ear on the matter. I just don't want to spend another year taking the pred if it means another year of not getting pregnant....I know people ttc for a LOT longer but to me a year is a good length of time