Telling DC Father Christmas is not real (a safe space)

[nc1985]

Anyone else gone down this route, or are planning to go down this route, with their DC?

DH and I have decided not to play along with telling our 4yo and 2.5yo that Santa exists/brings the presents at Christmas.

Our 4yo understands mermaids and unicorns, for example, are pretend and that doesn't stop her enjoying playing with them, wearing unicorn-themed costumes etc. We think the same principle will apply with Christmas, that is our DC will enjoy the "magic" of Christmas without buying in to the whole story as fact.

I just wanted a safe place to chat with other mums who are thinking similar to us. Are you out there?

Not prepared to get flamed Go easy on me if you don't side with my opinion on Father Christmas/Santa.

Some adults are very weird/obsessive about Santa!
If Christmas is ruined because a child doesn't believe in Santa then really that's a parenting failure...

We never tried to convince ours that Santa is real and have always just said that Santa is magic - we still do all the fun present-related stuff. Write letters and put out stockings.

Hmmm thinking back now I think we did a bit of a hybrid.

We did leave a mince pie, a beer and a carrot out. Although sometimes forgot.

We also always had family presents off family and something they really wanted from us and then general stuff. The best present was from family.

We countered the relentless “have you been good?” with a slightly joyless/not magical/spoiling every other family’s fun response of “we all get presents in our house whether we are good or not”

DC1 worked out the whole thing early on saying that Father Christmas in the shopping centre was different to the one at the school Christmas fair.

DC2 (now a scientist) said early on that it just wasn’t possible.

DC3 wasn’t buying or liking the strange man in the house thing.

When they asked we said, “Some people think he’s real but other people think it’s a story to make Christmas more exciting.” They looked relieved and then chose to go along with it or not.

They are happy young adults who absolutely love Christmas, the food, crafts, music, being together.

There’s no one right way. Do what you want.

@nc1985

I genuinely am sorry that your parents did that to you. Santa should never be used as a threat much less carried out. It is appalling.

I do wonder if all the families insisting santa brings all the presents how they feel about the children in their children's class whos parents dont have much money and isnt able to buys them fancy , new or loads of toys and they believe they r not as special, i find that sad .

@beachtosunset

It doesn't say it in the article. Her surname is Heizer

Christmas is a Christian festival and celebration.

I realised aged 8?? but was asked to keep quiet so as not to spoil it for the other sibling. We never felt lied to or hurt just happy and thoroughly enjoyed all the fireplace stockings, letters to Santa sent up the chimney in the flames, mince pies and carrots laid out at the hearth and listening out for Rudolph's hooves on the rooftops. I am very grateful for all those memories and the effort and pretence my parents put into Santa.

I am sorry your parents hurt you, they should never have taken that away from you or used Santa as a punishment. I do thiink your approach would be somewhat different to your kids Santa experience had this cruel abuse not happened in your childhood.

her surname is heizer that's actually disgusting. Seriously, you should be embarrassed. Because her surname is Jewish-sounding you automatically assume she is a practising Jew? And then judge the article perspective from that? Fuck me. Seriously??? I'm actually embarrassed for you.

Christmas is a Christian celebration yes we know that. But not everyone who celebrates Christmas is Christian. And I've never said we are not celebrating Christmas in my house. I said we're not "doing" Santa. Two totally separate things. Which you know, don't you?

Honestly, I'm cringing so hard for you.

No, you’ll just destroy the magic entirely. They’ll tell other kids and their parents Will say your kids are liars. They’ll be social pariahs and they’ll resent you when they grow up. Play along and don’t be a dick.

That sounds like something straight out of the North Korean Ministry of Propaganda.

@WeBuiltThisBuffetOnSausageRoll

No, you’ll just destroy the magic entirely. They’ll tell other kids and their parents Will say your kids are liars. They’ll be social pariahs and they’ll resent you when they grow up. Play along and don’t be a dick.

That sounds like something straight out of the North Korean Ministry of Propaganda.

thank you for reminding me of your guff. I get to eye-roll over it once more.

blessings.

Thanks for confirming your moral standpoint - I'd hoped I'd misunderstood your apparent very low bar when it comes to honesty and integrity, but it would appear not.

more pomposity

ho ho ho

@Newrunner29

I do wonder if all the families insisting santa brings all the presents how they feel about the children in their children's class whos parents dont have much money and isnt able to buys them fancy , new or loads of toys and they believe they r not as special, i find that sad .

That's why we got small inexpensive presents in the stockings from Santa plus one wrapped present from him.

All the tree presents came from parents and family.

It was never about the latest toys or big brands that was a 'no no' it was never about money.

I do wonder if all the families insisting santa brings all the presents how they feel about the children in their children's class whos parents dont have much money and isnt able to buys them fancy , new or loads of toys and they believe they r not as special, i find that sad .

The story does rather start to crumble when you insist on the existence of an omnipotent being whose omnipotence turns out to be completely thwarted by one mum and dad who are on a low income.

more pomposity

ho ho ho

I'm assuming you're trying to assume the identity of a particular character for some sort of effect? Nobody in real life would genuinely be that proud of scoffing at basic honesty and Parenting 101.

Or Santa is basically the Amazon delivery man …

Are you always this priggish?

Some parents who are practicing Christians also tell their kids that Santa exists. So what. You can wring your hands all you like, declaring it to be an example of terrible parenting, write earnest 2000 word posts on the matter, but I think it makes you seem ridiculous.

her surname is heizer that's actually disgusting. No it is highly likely. Seriously, you should be embarrassed. Because her surname is Jewish-sounding you automatically assume she is a practising Jew? No I did not say practising. And then judge the article perspective from that? Fuck me. Seriously??? I'm actually embarrassed for you}

Christmas is a Christian celebration yes we know that. But not everyone who celebrates Christmas is Christian. Yes i am aware that other faiths enjoy some parts of Christmas. And I've never said we are not celebrating Christmas in my house. I said we're not "doing" Santa. Two totally separate things. Which you know, don't you? Yes I am aware of that too. I am also aware that your take on Santa is somewhat jaded as, when a previous poster asked you, you explained what had happened on Christmas Day. It has affected you.

Santa should never be used as blackmail or a punishment or enforced.

I remember a little boy when I worked in a children's team at a local authority who was punished by his parents for being 'naughty' and Santa didn't come for him. I have never forgotten that.

If they choose not to believe then that is their choice if they ask you flat out if he is real and you tell them the truth then fair enough too.

My point is let it come from your children.

Again I am really very sorry that your parents did not treat you better. It should never have happened to you or any child.

My two cents: do what you like. I personally have fond memories of the magic and wonder of FC when I was little so I chose to do the FC thing in a low-key way (he brings the stocking presents only, present giving is not linked to behaviour.) However, it does seem like you're trying to justify your decision to yourself. You clearly think it's a better way to parent from the tone of your posts which I think is what is getting some poster's backs up, I agree with a PP that it comes off as sanctimonious.

Are you sure your parents being crap and terrible parents isn't colouring your decision? I think do what you want to do, but know the reason you are doing it.

The point is not all family santa brings only small things, some families will explain that santa brings everything, and all them children talking about santa apparently, the children whoes family is on low incomes will surely wonder why santa only managed so little or nothing , and that could not be magical as so many keep saying.

If the focus of a "magical " Christmas by the things that are free or cheaper, family time, winter walks films on tv etc then its magical for all children regardless of santa being there. Santa is essentially consumerism, breakfast with santa, visiting santa grotto, lapland, santa literally bringing toys/presents

We’ve always gone along with it because like most people we remembered the magic and happiness it brought to us as kids. I found out when I was 11 but kept it going for my brother who was younger. I remember thinking my mum was soo cool spending money and letting a fictional make believe character take all the credit. It made us happy, my kids are happy, when they ask I will tell them the truth but they will be made clear to that they are not to spoil it for anyone else.
There’s nothing worse than a little spoilt brat who spoils it for everyone.
DS13 has ASD he started asking questions about 4 years ago, about the inns and outs of Santa’s operation, I think he knows but he just keeps quiet because I think he likes the whole concept of magic. He’s never straight up asked me if it was real though.

I am not a big fan personally of father Christmas (!!) but we do go along with it. Our view was I didn't want them to stand out or be the big mouth who spoils it for everyone else's children. In reception year there was a lovely trip to a local farm to visit FC I think if they didn't believe it would have been awkward. What we do is underplay his role so he isn't the centre of our Christmas, but the birth of Jesus is. We do visit him as a family, and on Christmas day the children get a few presents from him along the lines of 2 smallish gifts and a book, plus a selection box, that kind of thing. They then get the bulk of their gifts from us. Father Christmas is part of our family Christmas but not the focus.

@Newrunner29

I do wonder if all the families insisting santa brings all the presents how they feel about the children in their children's class whos parents dont have much money and isnt able to buys them fancy , new or loads of toys and they believe they r not as special, i find that sad .

See I have presents from Santa and presents from us. I’ve also asked dc never to boast about what they’ve got from Santa as not all kids will get the same, so they usually just say what they got but not who it was from or that it was from Santa.

@Newrunner29

The point is not all family santa brings only small things, some families will explain that santa brings everything, and all them children talking about santa apparently, the children whoes family is on low incomes will surely wonder why santa only managed so little or nothing , and that could not be magical as so many keep saying.

I agree with that.

It's not fair on kids when parents say Santa brings everything or it's whether you behave or not or you will get everything on your list.
We were always told 'Santa has every child in the world to buy for and only so many elves to make their gifts and only one night to deliver whether it be down the chimney or in a letter box through a high rise flat so to avoid disappointment. We were told to make a 'wish list' not a shopping order and see what Santa can bring you - small silly things stuffed into stockings. We got somethings and not everything. Depended how much room he had on his sleigh..

There was something so fun about it and homely. Not expensive. Even the dog got a stocking with his Bonios. And the cat - usually a tin of tuna wrapped up/some homemade toy. It's about all the fun and mystery and surprises.

Christmas has become so commercial.

Some parents who are practicing Christians also tell their kids that Santa exists. So what. You can wring your hands all you like, declaring it to be an example of terrible parenting, write earnest 2000 word posts on the matter, but I think it makes you seem ridiculous.

If you read what I've contributed as this discussion has developed, you will see that I actually said that I don't have any real issue with people 'doing' the Santa thing with youngsters - it's not for me, but I realise that many do, and I get the idea of fairytale/magic/wonder for little ones.

The words of mine that you quoted and dismissed as 'guff' without actually taking the trouble to 'show the working' of your opinions, as adults in discussions often tend to do, stated clearly (especially when added to my comment immediately prior to that) that my issue (and I accept that many disagree - that's completely fine) is when Christian/religious parents demonstrate the same amount of fervour in insisting that Santa is real, even when a child is older, has started to develop more mature rationalisation processing abilities and has started to doubt, is asking for age-appropriate honesty in the matter, but is nevertheless met with a devout determination from their parents that they do very much believe in Santa themselves, often with implied/direct suggestions that the child is wrong to be doubting or questioning it.

Essentially, encourage and develop your young child's imagination by all means, but don't then start making them feel bad or guilty when they grow older and are naturally ready to move on from that simplistic, little-child way of understanding the world.

Santa brings a stocking in our house, and did for me when I was a kid. DH's presents in his family all came from Santa but his Christmases as a child were different to mine, I opened my stocking from Santa and then got presents from parents/ watched adults exchange gifts later. He was with immediate family only and all presents were from Santa. Fuck that! My house is like Piccadilly Circus on Christmas day, the kids open their stockings first thing, then their presents from us and they choose presents for their dad and me (taken out in secret by the other parent and told 'shh! It's a surprise!') so we open them and then grandparents, aunts and uncles with cousins come and we all exchange presents from us to them and vice versa. I want them to get joy from giving as well as receiving and the Santa thing doesn't play in with that, so Santa brings just a stocking and we leave him a beer and a carrot for the reindeer. He isn't a naughty/ nice guy in this house.

@Oldnews

I was raised knowing there was no such thing as father christmas, and it's always been my favourite, most magic time of year. I was raised not to tell other children, and as I grew older felt sorry for kids who were fed some really far fetched stories so their parents could keep the magic alive for themselves.

I intend to raise my little one the same, and won't be telling him father Christmas is real. I do however talk about st Nicholas and have started many christmas traditions around showing kindness, and spending time with loved ones. I don't need to tell him about an imaginary man giving out toys for that to happen. I don't tell him there's a tooth fairy, easter bunny or that unicorns are real either.

It often surprises me how many parents are so invested in maintaining the santa illusion and feel such vitriol towards those who choose not to.

The world is full of magic just as it is, no need to rely on a myth.

What are your Christmas traditions around showing kindness? I would like to do similar.