Why do we have kids if we can't look after them ourselves?

[tothepoint88]

I offered a view on a couple of threads that is perhaps different from most of the mums on this website. I apologise for hijacking the two threads that I did and if either of the authors of the two threads were hurt or upset by my view then I unreservedly apologise as I should not have made those points on your threads. However, I do not apologise for my view and I do take exception to the responses that I got from people who were not the originators of the threads.
There seems to be some idea on here that one is not allowed to question the idea that having others look after your children while you go out to work is OK and perfect sense. It seems that we all have to abide by the belief that not looking after your kids and going out to work is OK. Well I'm sorry, there are people out here who might wish to challenge that view. OK, if you want to go out to work and leave the kids in childcare OK, but don't blindly believe that there aren't people out there who might think that it is not OK and perhaps the selfishness that seems to have crept into motherhood in the last 20/30 years has no effect. Not everybody believes that it is possible to balance a career and bringing up children. The idea that somebody else can do a better job than the mum or dad is frankly odd.

Because my hormones were raging and my doctor told me it would take at least a year to concieve after stopping the pill.

Wrinkly - that's lovely

Our nanny is treated like a family member

No, I don't think that. As I said, I was mainly thinking of the first five years of a child's life.

OK, this will read like a total cop-out, but it's only because I'm talking about two friends who are MN members, but they are single parents and are getting by with two DCs each. Yes, of course they live frugally (as do I, by the way) and I really mean frugally. It's not all glamorous clothes and posh holidays (far from it!) but there's time to earn properly again when the DCs are at school.

I'm not suggesting for a minute that it's easy if you're alone. I've known it first-hand.

However, not everyone who chooses to work over looking over their child(ren) is living on the breadline.

'RESORT TO' using nurseries etc,. pastaplease?

Sorry but I take exception to that. Do you not think it might be 'CHOOSE TO, after careful thought and consideration'?

I talk about parents, not mothers! One of the people I refer to in my previous post is a dad. Please don't imply that I'm only talking about mothers because I'm simply not!

It's usually not about selfishness, it's about capitalism. We live in an age where to have a good standard of living in vast swathes of the country you need two salaries, or one and a half.

I suspect if we were all billionaires there would be a lot less parents working.

Lol pasta and op are the same poster . Not going to convince me otherwise regardless of what you say.

I'm a teacher. A lot of my students' parents work. And the kids are very young . Should kids not go to school until their parents have finished raising them? What age would that be? 18? 20?

it's a myth that women stayed at home in huge numbers.

my mum worked, so did by gran who had 7 kids. they relied on family, neighbours, older siblings, aunts. all over the world, women work while their kids are looked after by others. it is entirely normal and probably better for them than being stuck with the same person day in, day out.

I'm not suggesting that people should never work. As I've said twice, I'm refering to the first five years of a child's life.

They leaves plenty of working time!

I am amazed at the language unfitmother no need for fowl language.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion.

Please also remember that some mothers have to work for whatever reason. It is wrong to judge other people without knowing their situation.

I have worked when my eldest was young but gave up just before my 2nd was born. I now have four children. Thats the choice I made and I personally love being at home.

I am very fussy about my children and I also ensure that I give a good service to the children I care for.

A friend of mine's a nanny. She's great and really works hard.

Her charges and their parents have gone on holiday for two weeks today and the parents have booked the two children into creche every day while they're on holiday.

OK, not everyone with a nanny is like that, I'm sure. But this really made me think - why have children if you're of this sort of mentalilty?

Because you can't afford to do things like eat or sleep for worrying about debt if half your household income is suddenly removed. In the first five years of a childs life.

Why should having a career or having a family be mutually exclusive for mothers or fathers? If parents want/need to work, and put good childcare in place, then why should they be made to feel guilty? I'm sure not every parent WANTS to work, but even if they do, why is that such a bad thing? In my 12+ years working with families the ONE most significant thing every family has had in common is they want the best for the family as a whole. No one deliberately chooses to do harm (well, not the majority of normal people) so what gives anyone else the right to judge their choices? Life costs money and parents do what it takes to afford that life. Children need love, support, feeding, watering, educating, disciplining, and lots more loving. As long as they get that, does it really make that much of a difference WHO provides it? I don't think it does tbh.

How is one supposed to get back into their job after a 5 year career break? Unfortunately, not all jobs in our society are that easy to do this with... Things progress and move on a LOT in 5 years.
Some people can do this - great for them :)

Also, it wasn't an option for me. We needed to meet our basic needs, can't claim benefits (not that I would, anyway), and dh and I had to work. Dh for other equally important reasons.

Just out of interest, how much does childcare cost? My local nursery is £45 per day. You'd have to earn a fair old wage to be able cover this, wouldn't you?

Childminders £3.50 per hour around here. NMW is £5.93 per hour. Do the maths.

Yes, I appreciate that several years break from a career can be a serious problem. It will affect me too, as I work in a technology-reliant (for want of a better phrase) environment. I know I'm going to struggle to adjust and may have a long-term affect on my earnings.

I knew this when I was pregnant though, so I put it down to another thing in life that I'd have to adjust to when a child comes along.

I want to work
I want to have kids

I can do both

it's great

I don't give a shit if weird people want to obssess about the choice I make. sad bastards need to get a life.

Supid thread by a stupid person.

So nannies/nurseries are Bad but school is Good, is that right? Leaving a school aged child to breakfast clubs, doing their homework in afters clubs, etc is fine by you? What an arbitrary cutoff point.

I'm always amazed when people say it's a simple solution to go back when children get to school. If anything it's harder, either juggling before/after/holiday care.

Anyway OP - you are welcome to your opinion. Just don't expect many of us here to share it, or indeed to respect it if you're going to call other people "selfish" and their choices "frankly odd".

Childcare costs eat approximately 40% of my take home wage per month. I do have shorter hours, though, and only half the year that ds attends due to holidays between dh and I. I still pay for holidays, half for summer's 10 weeks and still 40% of my wage.

We need that 60% leftover + dh's salary (he's the lower earner at the moment, but has recently retrained, so can't just take a career break, either) in order to pay bills, mortgage, eat...etc. We don't have loads of disposable income but enough for the odd treat and don't take holidays at the moment.

No, I don't think that breakfast clubs etc are great. I haven't said that.

selfishness that's crept in in the last 20/30 years??? WTF

NEver mind the parents going out to work - they used ot send the kids out to work in the days not more than 100yrs ago

Anyhow - I don't get this whole WOHM/SAHM thing.

I've been a SAHM for 8 out of the 10yrs I've been a parent. The 2yrs I was working I worked nights, and stayed up in the day afterwards - so my children didn't "miss" any time with me (although I wasn't looking after them at night if they woke up as I was at work).

Anyhow - that aside, there are 168hrs in a week, even if you add 2 hours a day onto a 40hr week to allow for geting to/from work - that's still only 50hrs out of 168 (so 1/3 of the week) that a parent isn't looking after their own child if they're working out of the home ~(and that's presuming they work a full 40hr week!).

And if you tell me that night time doesn't count you can f* off. As you still have to be there for them, listening out for them etc etc even if they're asleep.

Oh - and why are dad's allowed to work as many hours as there are in a day outside of the home but they don't get lambasted for not looking after their children????

DeulingFanjo said it best :)

I don't get why its so black and white, most mums work part time so they balance being with their children/babies and having the benefits (personal/social/financial) of being in work.
I personally don't agree with mums who rush back to full time work when babies are very young (under 6 months) as I think it must be difficult for the baby to form a good emotional attachment, also there is some evidence that nursery situations for very young babies and children is extrememly stressful for them.
I went back to a job I love when dd was 8months, 3 days a week and used a childminder who dd loved, she started going to nursery when she was 2. This feels like it has been the best balance I could find.

This is really getting a lot of interest and also really generating fiery responses!!!!

It would be interesting to know how many of us choose childminding so we could do both.