Trans People

[Lovenliving]

It is eye opening to see all the concerns that people on here and generally have around toilets and wards and sharing space with men. Even when they identify as women.

I do wonder if they see any parallels with how Black people might feel around white people. Personally, I am not worried about a man being in the toilets, I am worried that some sort of race related incident will occur while me and my loved ones are in a enclosed space without witnesses. I am worried that my stud relatives and friends who are already seen as masculine due to their Blackness will be harassed by white people while they frequent women's spaces.

I worry about how this idea that all men are an equal danger to women impacts on my Black teenage son in terms of how white women treat him in public and at work. I saw him go from Black boy to Black man and how people responded to him differently as a result. Normalising this response to men without understanding your own racial bias will increase microaggressions against Black people. White women will believe it is ok to treat Black men like dangerous predators and definitely more dangerous than men who are white. This isnt something we need more of for Black people. It kills Black men.

Honestly, in the grand scale of living as a Black mother in the UK, this trans issue is so far from my radar as things that mess up our life as a Black family in the UK. The thought that out of 100 people I might meet in a public bathroom, 1 might have been born a boy. It highlights how different at least my life is from the average white woman on Mumsnet.

Well said

have reported those posts - they are blind to their privilege

No..that's like saying... Domestic abuse isn't a problem because people drink and drive..

They can both be issues.

You are entirely missing the point

Well her birth certificate says female as does her passport. So legally…..she’s a woman

But how does the outrageous misogyny of trans ideology and punishing women help the anti-racist cause?

As said earlier, Allison Bailey, a black woman, was thrown under the bus for the trans agenda. As was Jennifer Melle. It affects all women. All actual real women.

I’m sorry for your friend that they found the need to do that to themselves. But they are not a woman.

If they have had surgery and are able to “pass” it’s on them if they choose to take the risk. But they shouldn’t be in there.

A legal fiction is a fiction, and your friend is not a woman for the purposes of the equality act and single sex spaces. The Supreme Court was very clear in this - your sex is your sex recorded at birth.

Again so disrespectful

what the poster is saying is she doesn’t fear what you fear because of the daily oppression she fears coming in any interaction where she doesn’t have other people who are of black around

you posting is insulting - minimising OPs real life reality

No need to be sorry - she’s extremely happy and has a lovely life!

It's funny isn't it. All this talk of wanting to keep safe spaces but have no qualms in shaming black women because their experiences have led them to a different conclusion to them about trans people.

For the record, I don't agree that there are 0 problems with transwomen entering some female spaces. I just think that the trans issue pales into insignificance compared to issues around race because the frequency with which white people are racist is far far greater than even encountering a trans person, let alone encountering a trans person who is behaving badly.

I cannot believe that not one of these people can see that they are doing exactly what OP said.

I’m mixed race and I (and my family) am very concerned about trans ideology and men in women’s spaces. My niece lives in the US and plays sport at a uni that has supported men being in women’s sports which cost women their places on sports teams. I also have autistic children in my family that are vulnerable to this ideology.

He is suffering from mental illness unfortunately.

No, they’re worried about the fa t that males commit 98 percent of sexual assaults against women and that number does not fall when it’s a transwoman. Toilets are also the least of it, it’s things like refuges and rape crisis centres. It’s not about them taking up space.

This attitude doesn’t help though. For decades, black women’s specific worries, issues and concerns have been dismissed in favour of the “big fight”. Not now, let’s sort this out first. They haven’t been heard, while expected to stand up and fight. And then the next “big fight “ came in, and once again they got told not now. Sometimes they were even told “why should we care? These are black issues. We’re here to talk about WOMEN’S issues”. So , in turn they also go “why should I care?” . And now so do you. Round and round it goes.

I can understand your passion on the issue , but just stop and think for a minute.

I'm not quite sure why you are replying to this with "no" and talking about what "they" are worried about. My post was about why the conversations can be grating for black women.
Centering black women's feelings. Not "theirs".

It's disgusting that you encounter racism, let alone in 2025..

I get thinking that trans issues don't effect everyday life. But in practice, they do affect women's lives. Self-ID allowed biological men to use women's spaces simply by identifying as women. There are many documented examples of sexual predators and fetishists using this to harass women in loos, as well as coming into spaces like lesbian bars, changing rooms, breastfeeding groups, prisons & many others which are meant for biological women only, for a reason.

Do you not see any issue with that?

Moreover, what about the teens who were put on puberty blockers? The rise of gender dysphoria in teen girls, and the way surgery was pushed before other options?

I am a black woman and the they I’m referring to are any women who worry about trans identified men in their spaces.

And she is well within her rights to have that fear. No one is disputing that.

But, ergo, I have the right to be pissed off at men coming into my women’s only changing cubicle or joining my DD’s women-only football team.

One does not negate the other.

Two wrongs do not make a right.

I would never say “as a Muslim person I face Islamophobia on a daily basis and I’ve never come across a trans person - ie. man - who has caused me any harm therefore I refuse to believe there is any problem with trans people - ie. men - entering women’s spaces”

because that would be bonkers wouldn’t it?

What are you finding so hard to grasp about this?

Listen to what the poster is saying

you are blind to your privilege

the policy on this forum
is be respectful, and avoid coming on here and minimising black mumsnetters real lived experience

OP is not saying it trumps - she’s saying it’s a white womens agenda that distracts from the real issues and for her daily experience it’s way down the list because she is hurt by racism several times a day if not hour

im sure you can cope with the million in one chance you might have to share the WC with a trans person once in your life - a person probably with their head down and just trying to live peacefully

every time you get publicity for this (non) issue you are taking away from black women - you should be aligning with them

Using one off crimes to say toilets are dangerous - there is crime everywhere in every institution and every layer of life - people abuse systems to get away with stuff - doesn’t mean you should take away everyone else’s rights to live as they wish

Ok, but my post wasn't about that. It was about why conversations can feel grating.

Frankly, I’m concerned that TRA men are claiming to be women “just like black women”, as though black women aren’t compared to, and accused of being, men, enough already.

Men on the right like to accuse black women of being men, men on the left like to say a particular subset of men are actually women and use black women as some sort of comparator or evidence. It’s a shame the racism of the TRA movement spans the whole damned political spectrum.

So in response to PP discussing the racism they experience every day, your immediate response is to discuss the trans issue AGAIN?