We will brook no argument for a boring, uneventful, blooming pregnancy; followed by a perfectly-timed pain-free sneeze birth; vol 5

[ScreamIfYouWantToMeetSanta]

Hi No Brookers! I do hope this has worked and is in the right place...

I've added a few extra sofas so we have plenty of space for all the Rat Smackers who will be joining us soon. There's also a nice long table filled with mince pies, yule logs, gingerbread snowmen and xmas puds! Plus some non-alcoholic mulled wine. I've strategically positioned a few clean glittery vom buckets under the table, just in case it's still a bit too early for xmas munchies for some people!

As you were...

Biscuits - My blood clotting disorder means that all the blood thinning medication I'm on would make the cutting open thing a bit risky for blood loss and then for everyone post operation is at risk of clotting and that would be much higher for me. Not nosey at all :) Good luck for the nappy free night - brooking no argument for dry sheets biscuits ds!

scream - I really hope someone tells you how it is properly soon and that you can just have the cs you want! SPD sounds really horrid.

Those of you having to buy nursery furniture, have you see Beyonce's?

Blue Ivy's cot

Finally put a photo of mini h on my profile but will only be public for a short time. Feel free to have a coo.

I will try and catch up tomorrow, although I am busy again! For those who watched OBEM I just thought I would share this little number with you... The birthing dress the description has me sold!

Oh Hawthers he is divine!

You lot move too fast for me!

Scream - have you now got another consultant appointment? I was rather at what the other one said about growth. Its important to have regular scans to monitor growth over time- a single scan doesn't tell you very much because there is such a margin of error. My bump did measure small too, though, so you will have that additional point of reference.

Too I think it is very sensible to get the midwife to let you know exactly what is going on. DD was quiet initially (nothing wrong, just a bit surprised I think!) and a bit of reassurance goes a long way! Will you know your midwife already? Do your hospital offer you the option to have the screen lowered so you can see what's going on? I can't work out if I would like that or not. I saw some photos from someone's C-section who had this, on their blog,- I can see if I can find it again if you are interested? How many weeks are you now? Hope you are doing ok.

I too am terrified by potty training. DD decided no more nappies this morning. Then after two pees (the second of which she didn't appear to notice) she decided she wanted to wear a nappy again. I am trying to be led by her but is changing her mind like this normal? I thought the important thing was to be consistent! Oh dear. She is not quite 2.5 so I don't think there's any rush.

Hello to everyone else. Hope Dream's DD is sleeping soundly and that her MMR went ok.

Hawthers he is beautiful! Congratulations again

V brief as I'm tired!!

Gorgeous boys hawthers

scream my colleague with severe spd had a vb with gas and air only, she laboured on birth ball mostly and delivered on her side, mw x 2 supported top leg while one drlivered her dd, she said it was a good birth. Didn't worsen her symptoms. She's the one on crutches from 21 weeks. Hers was v bad, she said took til 9 months after birth to be able to swim breaststroke pain free but she was running n playing basketball way earlier than that no problem.

Cinema good, babies went berserk to the noise and vibrations of the cinema. Poor dd has only been asleep for 10 min, Dh says she's been awful, poor little tike. He reckons we're in for a long night...

Hope dd nsppy free goes well biscuits

Correction. Dd went to sleep 10 min ago, up screaming again now so got her on my chest...

DS1 also up dream so expecting another long night with two screaming boys. Swear i've aged about 10 years in the last week

Hawthers he's just adorable. Congratulations again.

Seeing newborn pics reminds me why we're all here after yesterday's labour discussions

Dream and Hawthers - I do hope that your respective littlies got some sleep and that you did too xx

Right, morning (again) ladies. I was just having a little think while getting ready this morning about what to pack in my hospital bag.

It's a while since I packed for DS and I wondered if we should sort of compile a master list between us - sort of combining all of our considerable knowledge? There are so many of us who'll be getting to that packing stage imminently......

What do you reckon?

If we come up with a master list then I think it's easier to decide you don't want to bother with something on a list rather than forgetting something? And people who've had different births previously might have different suggestions?

I'll try and write something later about what I can remember I needed last time but I thought if everyone sort of chips in then I could go through all the posts eventually and compile it into a proper list?

How did your ds get on last night Biscuits?

Hawthers that is a lovely pic

Well I think ok thanks Jen - DS came in as normal this morning about 7:15 and seems to have dry trousers so so far so good! He says it was a bit weird sleeping with only on bottoms on!

Hawthers - Both mini H's are adorable!

Biscuits - Yay for a dry night!

I started my labour bag a few days ago - I have 3 pairs of old and big knickers, 3 pairs of fluffy bed socks, 2 x mat/bf bras, 1 x old horrible nightie with buttons at front for labour and first bf, 1 pair pjs. I was thinking I needed 1 more pjs and some leggings and a top for going home. Then I need all the other bits and bobs and baby stuff!

dream - Hope dd got to sleep eventually (and stayed that way!).

Biscuits, hurrah - that sounds great! Well done DS :)

Hawthers, he's gorgeous, congratulations :)

Jen - I'm feeling the same about birth at the moment. I think it's easier to be feeling positive about it when you've not experienced it

Scream, you should definitely be allowed to opt for a CS considering how bad your SPD is. Hope you get to talk to someone about it soon.

Sorry - forgotten most of what everyone's said (will have to read back later!). First full week of work back, and I'm completely knackered. Realised I've forgotten some important things (like didn't check my email program properly, and have realised some important emails are stuck in the outbox, etc etc). Four hours of lessons today before I can collapse on the sofa and fall asleep.. Roll on 3pm...

Yes to hospital bag list, too tired to do my bit now but i will. Good thread here on cs list so will add that advice too biscuits. Poor dd had a bad night, but slept solidly from somewhere round 4 am to just now so she'll hopefully feel better today! Felt like a long haul to 4 am, maybe I do need more practice for this newborn malarky...

No time for more, we've got Baby Signing at 10am, half hour drive away s8 that's an hour to get us both up n ready to leave@!!

hawthers, hope your night improved too. Is the aging 10 years due to having the 2 or the worry about poor farley being so ill??

Oh, and a question for the better informed than me- calpol versus beige carpet at 2am, briefly rubbed with baby wipe, how do I get it out now?!?!

Hmmm, Dream - a quick google says calpol + carpet = a bit of a nightmare

Some people suggest baby wipes, someone suggested vanish carpet and upholstery cleaner, but they were suggestions rather than anyone saying it had actually worked for them . I'm assuming it's the pink calpol? There were lots of people saying they still had stains left in the carpet from it....

I'm just going to look for one more thing though. I remember having to look up a solution for getting dark nail polish out of a beige carpet so that might have the same trick for getting the pink / red colour out?

Hmm I think what I remember on the nail polish thing was that apparently window cleaner works on it. But obviously nail polish is quite a different chemical make up to calpol (thank goodness!)

morning all!
hawthers beautiful boys you have there. You must be very proud
biscuits yay for a nappy free dry night! Thats brilliant news and very confidence building for your ds. I'm sure we'll try ds again sometime soon but still don't think he's ready. If we can get him dry at night before he starts school I'll be happy. I think his 2 best little boy friends are the same as him so I'm not worried.
scream I wouldn't know what type of births work well with spd but you must be insistent about what you want as you and your dp are your only advocates when it happens.
Hello to everyone else, I can't remember all the news but hope you are all well and not too tired? We're off to play at ds's friends house later after i've tidied up our tip of a flat. My 16 week appt was yesterday. Nice mw but a bit of a meh appt. She has retested my bloods for platelets, checked bp and wee, told she doesn't listen for a heartbeat as her equipment is not sophisticated enough to pick it up at this stage so she checked my tummy to make sure it felt about the right size ( i think) and basically because i've already had a ds thats was about it. I told her i'd like to avoid pethidine this time if I can and she suggested a tens machine as she thought they were very good for 2nd births and also the birthing pool at the ML unit i'll be at. I don't see her again till 28 weeks. Which is AGES away. Apart from the 20 week scan which will be good reassurance. They are so much more hands off this time around.
I don't whether any of you would know or saw it but about 2 months ago on either the childbirth or pg boards there was a thread which recommended a book about dealing with the pain of childbirth, basically methods and coping strategies. Do any of you know what it is called as I can't find the thread? Any suggestions greatly received.
And as for hospital bags, I remember packing flip flops to wear in their shower/ bathroom/ just round generally. And ds needed more babygrows than I took. Can't remember much else though. I wonder if I still have the list anywhere? Will have a look.
Right time to end this essay!

I think it might be Juju Sundins birth skills book, anyone read it?

Right, here's my go at what I packed for my hospital bag from what I can remember. One tip I might implement this time is to pack what I need for the labour / birth and have another bag packed at home in case I have to stay in for longer that DH can just bring in. But I haven't sorted my list in to what would go in each bag.

For me:

• Pregnancy notes
• An old / cheap nightie for labouring in
• Other nighties for after the birth - at least one - pref with easy access for bf
• Other clothes - at least one set to go home in in case the clothes you went in in aren't clean etc (eg if your waters went like mine!) I had some BIG cheap jogging bottoms - not maternity ones, just BIG ones that were soft and comfy, and I wore a maternity top. DH had to bring me more clothes because I stayed in so did try to get dressed most days rather than schlepping about in a nightie.
• Dark coloured towel for the shower - I binned it after but if it gets blood or 'owt on it I'd rather not see it before it went in the bin!
• I would also take make up if I were staying in longer - just to make myself feel better and to fill the very boring time in hospital! But wouldn't bother for the labour and immediately after or anything like that.
• Small bottles of toiletries / wash bag etc
• Vaseline for dry lips from gas and air
• Straws for drinking - useful if you're in odd positions so DH can hold a drink for you if you're on all 4's or similar
• Snacks / drinks - enough for both of us so DH didn't have to go and stock up.
• Phone charger
• Phone
• iPod or something possibly - some delivery rooms have an iPod dock, or CD player. I've got an iPhone so if I want any music I can just use that.
• A camera
• Money for anything from the shop etc if I needed to send DH off for chocolate
• Watch with a second hand for timing contractions
• I also had some slippers for shuffling round the ward after - but only because a friend had given them to me, but they turned out to be quite useful when I ended up staying for a while.
• Contact lens stuff / glasses
• Lanisnoh - starting as I mean to go on there!
• Breast pads
• Maternity pads, and lots of 'em
• BIG knickers
• Pen and paper - might sound odd but if there's anything you want to remember it's helpful to be able to write it down so we would write lists of things DH had to bring back the next day, and we also wrote down how often DS was feeding and for how long etc when we were really struggling.
• More for staying in longer but a hand towel and hand cream. I totally wrecked my hands drying them on scratchy paper towels for a week and the minute it's cold weather I still get huge dry patches in the same places on my once lovely hands.
• Flash wipes in case anything doesn't look clean
• A present for DS 'from the baby'?
• A present for DS to give to the baby? - although I'd only need those two in the hospital if we're in there long enough for DS to come and see us while we're in. And I'd probably get DH to keep hold of a soft toy or something for DS to give to the baby so DS could bring it himself.

For the baby

• a couple of vests and / or bodysuits and / or sleepsuits. I'll probably take a few of each sort as we won't know how hot the hospital / ward will be. Last time it was so hot the mws told me off for keeping him in a bodysuit (that they'd told me to put on him ) and he ended up in just a nappy and a swaddled blanket most of the time.
• Hat
• Scratch mittens
• Blanket
• Nappies - I'm guessing I'm going to take size 1?
• A sneaky packet of wipes, although you're only supposed to use water and cotton wool, and I will try to do that but baby wipes might come in useful for other things.
• A carton of formula 'just in case'. Last time we did this and I'm undecided as to whether to this time or not. I'm kind of thinking that not having it removes the temptation but last time we were told that our hospital didn't provide formula and they won't let you home until baby has fed. I probably won't bother this time and just send DH out if needs be. In the end when DS really wouldn't feed in hospital and I couldn't express enough to make a sip for him they did rummage up some formula from somewhere. Not bothered about bottles or anything - they gave us a medicine cup for him to sip from and for such small quantities that's fine.
• Something for the baby to come home in. Lots of people have 'coming home outfits' but we never bothered - but did have 'boy' sleepsuit rather than a plain white one by this point. Mind you, we'd be in for a week so DH had had time to buy, wash and dry said boy sleepsuits! We just bought him home in a sleepsuit and then a coat that we'd been given. But if we're quicker out this time I think I'd just go for a sleepsuit, hat and a blanket

Hmmm, that's all I can think of for now. I know that looks like a massive list but I'm just trying to get everything anyone might want iyswim? I'm not sure I'd take everything on the list, or at least not all at first, but I'd want some of the things easily accessible for DH to get from home if needed. Also I made DH pack the bag last time so he knew where everything was in the bag. And I tested him on the things he might be unsure of. So if I've got dry lips would I need: (a) hand cream), (b) vaseline (c) my phone? That sort of thing. And identifying what was what out of my toiletries for the same reason.

OK, now this is why I don't watch OBEM.

I've just cried watching the virtual tour of my hospital's maternity / labour ward . There wasn't even a pregnant lady or baby in it - just empty rooms. And I'm still crying. I think it's a mixture of thinking of our wee baby actually being born and flashbacks to thinking of last time (even though it was a different hospital; they all look much the same!) - I think I'm quite frightened!

Glad I watched that without DH here - I might leave him to watch it on his own so he doesn't think I'm a total frightened loon.

Oh and on the list front it mentioned that they have a little shop on the maternity ward that sells nappies and stuff but also cotton wool. I wonder if that means they don't provide it? (They did at the hospital where I had DS). I'd rather not have to take my own as it's kind of bulky!

That is a gorgeous picture of Farley Hawthers, thank you for sharing.

Thanks for the positive birth story Dream. My worry is that on my side is literally the only way I could give birth without aggravating my condition, and the little I know about birth suggests that you have to be open to multiple scenarios because it's so unpredictable! I don't feel comfortable going in for a birth with such a rigid set of requirements, it's unrealistic. If the baby is in distress and they tell me to flip onto my back and widen my legs I'm not going to be able to refuse - not at a risk to the baby.

I love the hospital list idea, and Biscuits thank you for that comprehensive list. Obviously I haven't got any experience to add to the list, but I will pass on one thing which a girl at work told me and I hadn't previously thought of. We have private medical insurance at work, and obviously it only covers family members if you register them, but you can't register a baby "in advance". There was another woman in the office who had a baby, went home, then two days later her baby developed a problem and had to go back into hospital. Naturally she hadn't got around to calling the insurance company to register the baby yet, so she wasn't able to get private care for him and had to wait ages for NHS assistance (it wasn't a life-threatening problem). Even though she rang the insurers when the baby became ill, at that point it's too late and they won't cover it. I'm just saying it was recommended to me to give DH a piece of paper with the insurers' number and my membership number on it, and it will take him just 2 minutes on the day of the birth to verbally register the baby, then she's covered.

As for me, I'm a bit fed up and depressed today I'm afraid. This leg thing is only getting worse and I've been resting at home for a week now. Last night was horrendous, it took me an hour to get down our stairs (our bathroom is downstairs). I was in so much pain crawling around trying to get to the bathroom that DH put me on the sofa afterwards and then dismantled our entire kingsize bed and brought it down into the dining room so I wouldn't have to go back up the stairs. I'm now on strict orders not to get off the bed unless DESPERATE for the loo. He's so lovely and has been waiting on me hand and foot. I just can't get past the fact that I'm only 24 weeks and in so much pain. I feel really hopeless, like there's no way it'll improve before the birth.

This is just a funk, a bad day. Both my mw and my physio have said these things ebb and flow, and although this is a bad week it doesn't mean next week will be the same, or worse. It might let up for a while at some point. Plus my baby is healthy and kicking and that's obviously the most important thing. I just need some perspective. I think not leaving the house is starting to wear me down emotionally - I actually wish I could go to work!! Crazy!! Onwards and upwards, this too shall pass.