How do I stop smacking?

[2ashamed]

I know this is a controversial subject, and I have changed my name because I am so ashamed of myself

I was smacked as a child, though not excessively, but because I have a terrible temper, I swore I would never smack my children. I am really anti-smacking, but I don't want this to dissolve into a debate about the pros and cons. I genuinely want advice.

I just find that I react, not often - usually when I'm tired or flustered. And I hate myself when I do it. It's just that this is what my role-models did and I'm finding it very difficult to break away from that. I know I am the only one responsible for my actions, and 99% of the time I can take a deep breath and pause before reacting. But how can I avoid just reacting the rest of the time??? Any ideas, please?

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Badmum, you sound really down at the moment. Are you Ok otherwise? Make your life as simple and easy as possible - don't give yourself deadlines, slow down to your kid's pace and if all else fails, walk away and have a cup of tea

BTW I hate other children ganging up and being mean, but if your dd doesn't notice then it won't hurt her.

misdee, my son is not "easy" to control as you put it. Very few toddlers are.....
My main reason for staying calm with my children is probably selfish. I find that if I get worked up, it just stresses both me and my kids and makes everything worse. I have had a couple of supermarket trips from hell in my time too. I tend to stick my screaming tot in the trolley and finnish my shopping as quickly as I can. I don't really care what other people think of me and my ability to manage my toddler. All people who have or have ever had small children should know that it is perfectly normal for a toddler to throw a tantrum occasionally. If they hate it so much, they can shop after toddler bedtime. Might seem very selfish of me, but children have a place in this world too and worse things can happen to you than having to witness a tantrum on your shopping-trip. Wouldn't you agree?

When I read through these threads I feel that the biggest difference between me and many of you is that I don't think of tantrums and pushing boundaries as "naughty" or "bad" behaviour. I think of it as normal toddler behaviour. I don't think they delibarately are trying to irritate me.

You asked me what I would do rather than scream at your 11 month old dd. First of all I would put childlocks on the cupboards she is not allowed into. I am happy for my ds to play with non-dangerous kitchen appliances. Nothing is more fun for tots than casseroles, so why not? My house is very child-friendly simply because I think it is the best way to avoid most "battels" You still have to use the "No" word 100 times a day, but maybe not 500 times ;-)
When my ds is deliberately trying to push my boundaries, I take anything he can damage away from him which normally leaves him screaming on the floor. Then I sit down and read the paper. He can scream for ages which gives me plenty of time to catch up with the news. In public places I tend to want to avoid a scene if I can, and calmly carry him out to the car or to a corner until he has calmed down.
I also never talk to my children if they are in the middle of a tantrum. They don't listen to me anyway so I just stay calm. I don't think small children are always in control of their own behaviour and they find it reassuring when mummy stays calm, and it calms them down quicker than if mummy is ranting and raving around them.......

I don't think my children are easier than other people's children, but they are certainly not worse behaved than kids who are smacked or shouted at on a regular basis so I must be doing something right?

i never said i screamed at my dd2. i shout, raise my voice etc.
i want my kids to learn what is acceptable behaviour, i dont believe that by ignoring bad/naughty/dangerous behaviour will teach them anything. i would love to sit down and read the paper whilst one of my kids is having a major tantrum but its not posssible, because they have a habit of putting themselves in more danger.

i dont like the idea of locks on cupbaord doors, never had to do it with dd1, i let dd2 into the pans cupboard and have play in there with a wooden spoon when i'm washing up, but other than that the kitchen is out of bounds except for mealtimes (unless i for get to shut the gate).

maybe your methods work for u, but i find for me ignoring what u would consider normal behaviour but to me is unacceptable isnt going to work for me.

I have to say I have never ever shouted at my month old dd. Like Fairymum I don't see her "bad" behaviour as being willfully naughty - it's just attention seeking toddlerhood. That's not to say I am a paagon of virtue - I have on many occasions shouted because of her bahaviour, but when I feel myself getting so wound up I put her in a safe place (usually her cot), go as far asway as I can get and then scream. I really can't see what an 11 month old would do that would justify being shouted at, or how being shouted at would help an 11 month old to behave any differently.
And isn't ignoring unacceptable behaviour the current method that "experts" recommend?

Funnily enough I do exactly the same as Fairymum. The reason why ignoring works so well for so many people is that often the only interesting thing about 'naughty' behaviour is the fascinating reaction in provokes in us (shouting etc). They find it quite entertaining often (made my ds laugh), so by not reacting, they lose all interest in the 'naughty' behaviour which is often quite dull for them afterwards. As I said, it sometimes takes nerves of steel to do it because you are itching to say 'no' but in a way that would be 'rewarding' the naughty behaviour by giving your child the big, fascinating reaction they are looking for. The ignoring works because it deprives the child of what they want - a punishment, if you like. I don't see a problem with locking cupboard doors. I lock the cupboard containing cleaning materials, but everything else is OK, and ds has his own special cupboard with interesting things in it. It's just one less thing to fight about/worry about.
I was so surprised by how effective the ignoring tactic was. He very, very seldom repeats behaviour that doesn't get a response, so he does 'learn' in that sense.

Funnily enough I do exactly the same as Fairymum. The reason why ignoring works so well for so many people is that often the only interesting thing about 'naughty' behaviour is the fascinating reaction in provokes in us (shouting etc). They find it quite entertaining often (made my ds laugh), so by not reacting, they lose all interest in the 'naughty' behaviour which is often quite dull for them afterwards. As I said, it sometimes takes nerves of steel to do it because you are itching to say 'no' but in a way that would be 'rewarding' the naughty behaviour by giving your child the big, fascinating reaction they are looking for. The ignoring works because it deprives the child of what they want - a punishment, if you like. I don't see a problem with locking cupboard doors. I lock the cupboard containing cleaning materials, but everything else is OK, and ds has his own special cupboard with interesting things in it. It's just one less thing to fight about/worry about.
I was so surprised by how effective the ignoring tactic was. He very, very seldom repeats behaviour that doesn't get a response, so he does 'learn' in that sense.

Yes, but what is so naughty about lying on the floor screaming ? Of course I intervene if my ds is kicking the cat or throwing hard toys at the telly. I don't just sit down and read the paper and let him destroy my house, the cat and himself. If I take a toy away from him, he tends to throw a little fit and so what? Of course I make sure he can't hurt himself doing it. I move him to a room where he can't hurt himself. Generally he just sits there and throws his own toys around (which is fine in his own room) or lie screaming on the floor. It really doesn't bother me. Why does it bother you ? I don't think you shouting at your child makes them do it less often. I think children learn from their parents and obviously if you shout, they will shout. We live next door to a family where both parents shout an awful lot at their kids. All I hear all day long is "silly girl this" and "naughty boy" this. The children are now old enough to shout back at their parents and they do!

Well, if you have a gate into your kitchen, what is the problem?

Toddler tantrums and testing boundaries are normal toddler behaviour. Ask any child dev. expert! If they didn't go through this rebellious stage it would NOT be normal. I find it quite strange that many of you get so worked up over what seems to me to be perfectly normal feisty tots....

I also agree it's impossible to 'control' an 11month old by 'teaching' her right from wrong, in much the same way as it would be impossible to teach a goldfish! Their brains are just too primitive, and they literally cannot control themselves. The very specialist part of the brain that controls impulses is extremely undeveloped and small in babies so is pretty useless. It will not be fully developed until the age of 4 or 5. The are also physically and psychologically incapable of realising that your thoughts and desires are in any way different to yours - again, it's a matter of brain development. So you can't teach her to be thoughtful or to consider your wishes, as it's simply impossible for her. For me, finding all this out made it so much easier for me to enjoy my ds, as I stopped expecting thoughts and behaviour that he was incapable of, and so made more allowances and tried different things. Discipline for the very young is useless IMO and from my understanding of infant development.
I'm not saying anyone is cruel or wrong here, just that you may be expecting too much. An 11month old cannot wind you up deliberately as she literally has no grasp whatsoever of what's in your head!

The way I see it toddlers can get overwhelmed by their own feelings. Someone takes their toy away (their property!) and their whole world is chaos. Mummy is trying to teach him so share, but why should he ? What if the toy never comes back? He might throw a major tantrum in this situation, right? I sometimes think it must be a bit like it feels for me when I am flying. I hate flying and feel absolutely panic ctricken. In case of turbulence, I feel like shouting and screaming because I am so stressed and frigthened. The only thing which helps me is to look at the cabin crew. They look happy and calm and it calms me down. Yes, I know it's a silly comparison because I am not doing anything wrong of course and also I am an adult. However, I do think that calm breeds calm. When my tot's universe is all confused and he has locked himself in a tantrum, surely it must be reaasuring for him that mummy stays calm and collected and is there to cuddle afterwards?

Of course I also get irritated by my children. I am not mother theresa on valium. I can see from what I written that I do come across as smugly calm and collected. Well, I am not always. I have just taught myself to seem like that on the outside and often it helps me stay calm on the inside too.

By the way - good to see that other people use the same ignoring techniques as me:-)

It has been proven time and time again that children learn primarily by observing. If you shout and rage so will they.

It's only around 2.5 to 3 years old that children start (and it is only a start) to understand cause and effect. Raising your voice to an 11 month old and telling her something is 'wrong' will mean absolutely nothing to her.

Fairymum, I do it cos it works! I am also aware of sounding smug and self-satisfied. I'm really quite lazy and want a relaxed, unstressful life as much as possible, so I do things that will give me that result when I can. As i say, my stepdaughter was brought up similarly, and she's so incredibly 'good' that I keep my fingers crossed it will work with ds! I think trying to see things from his perspective also helps me an awful lot.
I think we are all here trying to achieve similar things - nice kids, happy homes - in slightly different ways.

aloha, yes, let's keep our fingers crossed for our children. If all fails, we might one day run into eachother in a young offenders institution somewhere. Fingers and toes crossed xx

sorry, an 11month old may not understand right from wronmg, but why should i let them get into the habit of doing something i dont agree with just because 'they're a baby'. i have to place restrictions on what i allow, for my peace of mind, for my childrens safety, and to stop little fingers getting poked in my eyes.
i'm guessing that coming across on this thread i must seem like a horrible mother, but i dont shout and smack all the time, my kids are happy, dd2 is one of the happiest smiliest babies i know at the moment(and i'm not just bragging here, ok maybe i am a little lol), and i do love my kids, but i have learnt that by being consistant in what i allow in my house works. my dd1 knows she wont get told off for accidents (spilt drinks, potty training accidents, paint on the floor/table), she says sorry and i always reply 'oh well dont matter' which she has started mimicing. but if on the other hand she took her paintbrush to the walls, or poured juice delibratly over her sisters head (she has threatened to), then she will get told off, maybe a smack as well. dd2 will get told off for poking peoples eyes, pulling hair, or trying to feed toast to the video (and dont mention video locks as i have one and it doesnt fit my video!!). i will get down to her level, raise my voice slightly and tell her no. i dont scream in her face, very rarely she will get a tap on the hand and thats only when she is being very spiteful (and belive me she can be). the only time i really shout is to stop her in her tracks. it works as she is shocked to stop what she is doing long enough for me to get over to her.
for me it works. sorry, but it does. this is the way i bought up dd1, she has a very clear sense of what right and wrong (right is drawing on paper, wrong is drawing on walls, tho her grandad has built her a wooden house which has a blackboard wall and she told him off for drawing on walls. lol).
u do what u find works, i'll do it my way.

Well, then we don't seem to be poles apart. I would also tell my children of for the things you describe in more or less the same fashion as you descibe. I don't raise my voice, but they certainly understand by the tone of my voice that I mean "business" which is probably the same thing. I am also consistent in what I allow in my house and of course my children have rules. I would also shout(very loudly) if for example my child was running out in the road just to get his/her attention.

I don't think you are a horrible mother at all and I wouldn't allow deliberate nastiness or violence. But an 11month old can't be spiteful. It's simply not possible. They can hurt you, but they won't know it hurts you. You may well not want them to poke you in the eye (we've all been there ) and that's totally reasonable, but she doesn't mean to hurt you. That's all I meant. This thread started with someone wanting to stop smacking because she felt unhappy with it, so I hope some of the suggestions her are helpful to her. They are things that have been helpful to me in managing behaviour without smacking because it's something that I personally don't want to do. I wouldn't do them if they didn't work. We all have different approaches, and I know I will have to come up with new ones as ds gets older.

i know she doesnt mean it, its hard to explain really. i dont want her to get into the habit of poking peoples eyes. i had great fun the other day sorting blocks with her untill she decided it would be more fun to see if blocks fit in my eyes, i can assure u they dont, and i had very bruised eyes. i explianed to her where the blocks go, and she then seemed to understand and stopped trying to put them in my eyes. maybe spiteful was the wrong word to use, i know she is testing her boundries atm (today we found out that toilet rolls absorb lots of water if thrown down the loo) and i encourage my kids to try things, but i just dont ignore behaviour which i view as naughty or wrong.

Hmm.. I know what you mean about the vigorous 'experimenting'!

And that's a baby scientist you have there, Msdee

the circle blocks didnt hurt too much. the cubes and triangles really made my eyes sore.

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Bm (i don't want to call you Badmum anymore if thats OK) How was yesterday? Hope today is going well.

Bm (i don't want to call you Badmum anymore if thats OK) How was yesterday? Hope today is going well.