3.5 yr old DD is a bit too intense for other parents. HELP!!

[bellbottom]

Hello,
feeling a bit down and lonely.
Without wanting to ' label' my dd as I don't like doing that, she is the kind of child that other kids love but seems to be causing concern to other parents. It's making me feel singled out and alone, which I find very hard to cope with as I am already a single mum, no dad involved, living abroad without family. So i have only myself to turn to, besides mumsnet and a few close friends.
Dd is very high energy, both mentally and physically. She is also very mature and perceptive for her age, persistent and very assertive, strong minded and tough. She is also a huge amount of fun to be with, has a huge sense of humour. All in all, larger than life.
I don't have any worries that she'll be fine in life. Only that she does seem to be a bit too overwhelming for some parents. She is a leader type of person and sometimes becomes quite mischeivious with her friends, also in their company she tends to egg them on a bit and those kids start to become less obedient to their parents. She is also going through a phase of light teasing, which in my mind is harmless and only a reflection of her looking for more of a challenge. I'm confident it will pass. It's only things like, 'I have this and you do not'. Or ' i can go faster than you' etc. Recently things have become a little tense between myself and the parents of her best friend. Up till now it was great, and now we have had to have discussions. It seems they have taken little things really personally, like dd was trying to blow out the candles of his birthday cake, she told him her grandma was prettier than his, that kind of thing, at his party. I see it as harmless and i interpret it as her trying to say that she too has a grandma that she loves very much and misses as she's in england. And with the other stuff its just that she wants to be a part of what he has and doesnt yet know what it means to let him have his moment of glory all for himself.
I'm getting scared about how she'll fit in in the future. Especially worried if she is perhaps reacting to the fact that she has no family here like other kids do. Is it a sign that she is going to strike out about this in the future even more? Or am I making too much of this?
Are there any other parents out there with intense and bright kids? I read up on spiritied kids, but I don't think she fits that description, as she never cries for long, gets over problems quickly, sleeps right through every night guranteed. I don't think she is a spirited child. But does anyone with a smiliar child have any advice they can offer?
Thanks

yes I have lots of positive advice to offer you, but I'd say every child i have met like this - have had a parent like you, therefore advice is pointless. You've been extremely rude to people on here - I have not ripped you apart at all, I have said how she sounds from what YOU have said. You have rose tinted glasses on and no matter what I, or anyone else on here says, unless it is along the lines of "poor you, your daughter sounds wonderful and the friends are idiots", you are not going to listen anyway. You are not the first parent I have met like this nor will you be the last.

Oh and I read your initial post to my DH, who is a teacher by the way, I didn't tell him anything else, just read your post to him. So he said, right so a little brat who if allowed to carry on will end up lonely and horrible and miserable at 15 as all they will know is how to try and be better than others to try and gain friends or to put up a barrier to hide their true feelings as they have no social graces or how to deal with people. He teaches secondary children and has many like this. They just do not know how to act socially and I am talking about children who have had parents around etc, not your stereotypical latch key kid.

I think from your rection it says a lot. if you had said "Oh dear, I really didn't mean for my post to come across like that and am at my wits end" then epople would be more willing to offfer practical advice, but you have been an older version of what your "friends" have not been liking about your daughter.

My DD also has (had, I'm afraid) a friend who sounds like your DD, OP. Her mum just sat there and smiled while her DD encouraged other children to misbehave, was mean and rude to others and tried to hog the limelight at every opportunity. I know that I and the other parents blamed the girls' parents 100%. She doesn't get included in anything anymore, which is a terrible shame for the girl.

OK, this is bitchy , but I did smile at "Lookattheears - 2 words, grow up and expand you mind."

As others have said, pull her up on bad behaviour as soon as you see it happening and reiterate the rules at home.

Are you actually interested in people's opinions and advice, OP??? It doesn't seem like it! I wonder why you posted.

It sounds like she is attention seeking. Maybe you could take her aside next time she does something socially unacceptable and question her as to why she's behaving like that and try to make her see how she would feel if someone did it to her. She needs to learn how to empathise more with others and share.

Grow up bellbottom, maxybrown hasn't ripped you apart. She's offered you constructive advice.

Stop being so defensive and listen to what people are telling you. Mumsnet may be bitchy at times but it is rare that there is a consensus on anything.

You've just had one, now learn from it for your DD's sake and stop making excuses.

Btw I forgot to mention a really good book called 'superpowers for parents'. It has a lot of advice on teaching kids empathy, eg in your example you would say 'how do you think X felt when you blew out his candles? How would you feel? Etc' It suggests talking about things in books/tv as a starting point as in 'oh no timmy lost his ball- how do you think he feels?'. And stuff about recognising their own feelings too and learning that it's ok to feel a certain way but that doesn't make it right to act on it.

Are you new to mumsnet? Because asking a question and then jumping down the throat of anyone who doesn't say what you want to hear won't do you any favours and nor will personal insults!

Btw I forgot to mention a really good book called 'superpowers for parents'. It has a lot of advice on teaching kids empathy, eg in your example you would say 'how do you think X felt when you blew out his candles? How would you feel? Etc' It suggests talking about things in books/tv as a starting point as in 'oh no timmy lost his ball- how do you think he feels?'. And stuff about recognising their own feelings too and learning that it's ok to feel a certain way but that doesn't make it right to act on it.

Are you new to mumsnet? Because asking a question and then jumping down the throat of anyone who doesn't say what you want to hear won't do you any favours and nor will personal insults!

Can't believe how rude you are being OP to posters who have given sound advice.
"i know your type"...tbh you sound paranoid. You are hearing what you don't want to hear.you are sticking your fingers in your ears and going "la la".

But your daughter sounds rude and lacking in social skills, which you as a parent have to work on...or you may be posting on here in years to come about why your dd can't make friends.

I wanted to say, that if you are worried that she misses family in England etc (but be sure you aren't projecting your own feelings onto her), there are some lovely books about these sorts of issues which might serve to start some talk about this.

Letterbox library has lovely issue-based books, or search Amazon.

But don't let what you interpret to be her emotional reactions justify mean behaviour as I said before

Wow. You are taking a bit of a pasting OP, but as someone else recently said, a consensus on mumsnet is a very rare thing, and you have certainly got a consensus on this one. You're right, we don't know your dd but you asked for advice knowing this and we can only go on what you tell us.

I have a 3.2 year old dd who is bright for her age, very imaginative, strong willed and argumentative. She does have empathy though, and I actually can't imagine her trying to blow out someone else's candles - she knows full well that at a birthday party it's the birthday child who gets the attention.

The book about empathy mentioned above sounds good. Can I also recommend 'The Secrets of Happy Children' by Steve Biddulph for good tips on setting boundaries?

bellbottom you have got very defensive which is perfectly normal for a Mum who loves her child. But please see that you came here for help - not wanting to label your child. You have been given advice.

People can only see you DD as you describe her and the situation as you describe it.

Now please take heed that your defending your DD - great you have love for her.

Now try and help her become even more lovable by helping her be less domineering and unkind to other children. Most children I know do the 'bet you can't do this' etc etc. My 7yo still is at times but because I love him I have to tell him to stop it and use nice words.

Bellbottom - Mn is not a place for casually worded OPs - it's a lesson worth learning.... I'm going to try and be helpful as my dd is also a challenge.

i suspect my dd (who's now 5) shares some of your dd's traits. She is a 'queen bee' type - likes to be in control, tends to be a ringleader in cheekiness (her latest was trying to climb out of school), has a (horrible) tendancy towards "I'm not going to be your friend/you're not coming to my party" type stuff. A big shock after my quiet, well mannered, sensible first born.

It is hard work - and I am always nervous that other parents will think I don't discipline her enough/let her get away with stuff. And if I'm honest, occasionally I probably do - otherwise I'd be fighting all the time. BUT I know that there are some things that I have to pull her up on HARD everytime they happen. For us, the key touchpoints are: rudeness, unkindness, ignoring explicit instructions.

On those sort of things I come down hard - so yesterday for example her teacher said she'd not been listening at school/sitting still at carpet time (a big issue for her atm) - she was therefore not allowed her hallowe'en sweets - and got to watch her big brother enjoying hers. We had 30 minutes of tears & tantrums. But today she had a letter from the teacher praising her excellent behaviour in class.

I think you have to watch and learn what works for YOUR dd - so for example, mine isn't really motivated by star charts - they work a bit to reinforce good behaviour, but the threat of loosing a star is nothing much. However catching her doing something good and providing an immeadiate, unexpected reward works brilliantly - she really enjoys explicit, positive praise, and notices when someone else gets it, so praising siblings/friends for good behaviour is often effective.

But, as others have said, you do need to get on top of this asap. It will not get any easier, and her personality is unlikely to suddenly change. The more you clamp down on things now, the less damage limitation you'll need to do later.

And I have to say, I'd have been shocked at a 3yo making rude comments about someone else's grandparents - I actually do think that's pretty unusual (candles thing, less so - have seen that a few times!)

In fact my friend is very similar to you (or was) and her DD the same as yours.

She finally realised she needed to help her DD and started to show her better ways of dealing with things. She said to me recently that she is surprised I put up with her and her DD visiting. I said her DD's behaviour never bothered me but it did bother me that she let her DD behave that way. She was exhausted and had reached the end of her tether though and I knew until she was ready to deal with it and hear the truth there was no point pushing it.

Maybe your not there yet?

Sorry, that was a bit long

On the one hand, OP, I feel bad for you as it must be horrible to read people being critical of your little girl. But on the other hand you are being quite obnoxious to people who may not be saying what you want to hear, but who have taken the time to read your thread and respond to you.

I think perhaps your OP was written very honestly (because you love your daughter very much and want to help her) and you maybe didnt realise how your daughter is actually being perceived until you read people's responses to your description of her. I dont blame you for being upset by that, but you do need to stop and think about the responses you're getting.

One other thought, ds has a friend (aged 7, rising 8) who does the "I've got this & you haven't" thing. Kids do need help to learn the social skills of getting on with people.

A kid at DSs party jumped in and tried to blow the candle - upset DS and ruined the photo!!!

You came on here because you were concerned. people are giving you advice. Unfortunately your real life friends are likely to skirt the issue.

If you can see that her behaviour is bothering people you need to curb that behaviour and encourage her t focus on her 'good' behaviour.

Of course it's just a phase, but other people won't put up with it so you have to teach her some social skills.

DS went through a phase of 'i have a ball and you don't' type of comments. They seem harmless to adults but to the child with no ball it can be really annoying!!! We've had lot of chats on empathy which luckily he has taken on board.

it's fantastic that you're so supportive of her.

i do think that you have to tell her what the appropriate behaviour should be.

i do also think that a 3.5yo should know that they don't get to blow out someone else's candles, and that says to me that perhaps you haven't been so forthcoming of your criticism of her up until now.

thing is you're not doing her any favours by indulging her. if she's losing friends now because of it (only one or two at the moment), she will continue to if she is allowed to carry on.

i'd also say that your friends that know her and tell you the truth, also know how defensive you are and are probably not actually telling you the truth.

Ds1 (12, severely autistic) always tries to blow out the candles on any cake. His brothers know he does and don't mind, anyone else I make sure he is too far away to actually manage it.

In this case I would talk to her before and remind her that she is not to do it. If she does, take her (calmly) outside for a bit, then next time make sure she is too far away at candle blowing time. She'll learn (unlike ds1! [rolls eyes] )

warthog - or, she'll be queen bee at school and everyone will be in thrall to her while she continues to tease other people, for fear of being at the receiving end......

However unhappy an experience it's been for you OP, I must say thank you for starting this thread. I also have a 3yo, albeit more of a dreamer than an 'intense' 'spirited' type, and reading the reams of fantastic advice that you have been given has reminded me of areas that I might need to work on with him. My son is a very sweet boy, largely kind and gentle, and in fact these are the things that sometimes blind me to his more mardy stroppy self centred unsociable (perfectly normal for a 3yo) moments. Just goes to show, eh?

I do believe that was a personal attack bellbottom.........................hmmmm. Thus proving your rudeness. In your other posts you state how everyone in RL thinks she is fine and wonderful, fine then, why are you still here? Yes you mentioned in your OP how you said you were scared how things were going to pan out etc and someone who truly was would be listening.

Look at funnypeculiars post - she openly admits her daughter has your daughters traits too and acknowledges that it is not good and it is hard work. She is not defending her in anyway and this is what people have been trying to say to you, that you are defending and justifying her behaviour and that you are coming across in such a way that you don't want advice unless people agree with you, because yes it is hard to take things on the chin, especially when alone.

Your reply to me made my DH chuckle anyway. I actually very very rarely post on things like his hardly at all, certainly do not go looking for it. Feel free to check me out. An the Uke omre vean welcomee on your next visit to the Uk come over for a visit to me and you can see who I really am, with pleasure