I want to ask this somewhre where I might get a range of responses so not asking in SN, ismore a would you agree with this lady thing than a AIBU. Sn kids in mainstream education.

[Peachy]

Someone today whom I respect immensely and regard as kind, told me that in her opinion children with disabilities like dyslexia etc (so ampresuming the whole gamut of SEN - SN) shoudln't be in MS schools because of the effect on the other kids.

She is someone who though not employed by school has access to DS1 (ASD) and ds2 (SEN not sure what) during school time in a volunteer role. I pretty much trust her.

DS3 attends an SNU placement, but I do wonder how many people really share that attitude. My experience and belief tells me that different kids benefit from different settings so parents should have final say (it took me 2 years to get ds3 his place, and I face a battle now to get ds1 into SN Comp placement).

?

jaq - unfortunately, that's just what our children are up against every single day...

it almost makes me wish the little darlings would go off the rails at 13 and lead her a merry life of misery, but sadly they'll graduate with 2:1s and spread the misery further. v sad, but some people's minds can not be changed unless they get the chance to experience it from the other side - the old walk a mile in my shoes thing.

peachy dodn't be sorry you started this threa, I have found it very educational, I don't know a lot about sn apart from dd's type, so means I now know more.

I am so glad I didn't get to read PPs last post, as her previous posts have been quite malicious and narrow minded. Quite frankly, it kept me awake last night thinking about them, on this thread and TDWPs as well.

Peachy don't apologise for starting this thread, if nothing its opened my eyes a little bit more to the extreme prejudice of some people.

Didn't write much earlier as going through something relating to this today and couldn't bear it but now I'm back!

It makes me sad that children are grouped like this. A child should be in an educational environment that suits them and the way they learn best. If it is mainstream education state school with extra support then great! If it's an SN school then also great. If it is a private school (I believe strongly that the smaller class sizes and one to one attention would benefit my DN) then also great!

Unfortunately it feels as though the LEA's don't consider the individual. All they are concerned with is spending the least amount of money. It makes me sad. It should be about each individual child and what is best for them.

Anyway don't think this really answers the original question and sorry to rant. Felling very

poor old TDWP had a thread about problems her ds was hving(sn) it went a bit nasty

no it is in chat

have sent you a link on fb(check you inbox) don't want to post it on here as she was very upset and it has dropped of active now(best left alone imo)

I just hope you realise that a huge number of parents aren't like pp at all. Our school takes a lot of special needs pupils and prides itself on that fact. My children have learnt so much about life by mixing with other children who might have different abilities and life challenges to them. They are more clued up about autism, cerebal palsy and down's syndrome than I ever was at that age - how can that be a bad thing? I'm sure they know more than most adults.

Primary school is more than just learning to read and write. It's about learning to deal with life, getting along with other adults and children and taking those first steps into the world when your mum and dad aren't with you! What better time than to encounter lots of different children.

As long as the parents of the children with special needs are ok with their place in mainstream school, I have no problem with it all. I do think that not all schools seem able to cope with all manner of special need but perhaps that is the school's problem.

What saddens me is how parents have to fight to get the extra help (like additional adults in the classroom) that some special needs children might need. Why that has to be a fight is beyond me (I know it's funding but I still think it's a disgrace).

Because of the various special needs in their classes, my dcs have always had more than the allocated teacher plus TA (so have often had 3 adults in their class) which has ultimately benefited them too.

lol just read that back - meant differently abled children rather than different children (sounded a bit nasty!)

I do think that David Blunkett's unbridled attack and closing of many special schools was ill thought out and does not take into account the fact that some children may fare better in special schools. In Exeter we have two specialist schools (the west of England schools for the Deaf and for the Blind) which I'm told are very good schools indeed, and educate children with a range of disabilities (deafness and blindness apparently most often comes in tandem with multiple disabilities and learning difficulties nowadays). Devon as an LEA is not brilliant at managing the needs of SN and SEN children on the whole, especially ASD.

we seem to have quite a few sn schools round here, but none of the local ones suit dd(always the way) so she goes to an independant school(sn)
sadly it does all come down to money. I am just starting the battle to keep dd where she is post 16. even though her school meets all her needs. the LEA would rather move her to a local 16 plus colleg that won't, where she will have no independance and loose all her peers.
why cos it is cheaper. they couldn't care less about dd or us. strange country we live in, they can fiond millions to send overseas(not meaning Hati) but not to pay for my dd....

To any newcomers to this thread who haven't read all 16 pages.
I would like to reiterate that I have at no point said that SN children should not be in mainstream schools in fact i think it is often a good idea
What I did say was tha a persistently disruptive child (whether SN or not) should be in a mainstream classroom.

Apparently that is a very unreasonable POV though !!

'What saddens me is how parents have to fight to get the extra help (like additional adults in the classroom) that some special needs children might need. Why that has to be a fight is beyond me (I know it's funding but I still think it's a disgrace).
'

I agree.

DS'stook two things in today: 175 cakes we baked anddecorated to sellfor Shelterbox,and aletter calling an emergency review for ds1's statement. The Head came in and made half the TA'sredundant; the children are now back on minimum provision so ds1 who has been getting combined support all day is now getting 10 hours small group. Nobody bothered to tell me, I only found out through two things- one when DS1 broke down so badly he atatcked Dh and it drew a crowd, and then when I was in schooldoing reading I had to give 1-1 to a child with CP as there was no TA free for his statement. I am as it happens good with SN but I don't think the teacher knows that or anything much about me tbh. He was given a picture and had to sit there colouring hbecuase ther est were doing a maths test and he needed help but nobody could come.

Now, I am an odd old bird who thinks that doing things like the cakes is as important for their growth as humans as getting 9 years olds to study Shakespeare so at times I am finding myself on a tangent to the ethos of the very academic schoolanyway, but I don't understand why the needs of those with SN are the first to be brushed aside. I'm rubbish in RL at asking forthings, but after years of threatening I amhaving to play hardballand it seems silly. DS1 spends class time with no help stimming,making littleprogress andcan be very fighty. How will that help the other kids toleave him unasisted?

My boys are valid and contributing members of the school. DS1 is bright (when he was 6 he was at 16 - 21 age for spoken lanaguage) but becuase theya refrankly not interested he is festering. We'reasking for a specialist AS base in MS as comp provision, have to wait and see if we get it.

And I would like to emphasise that is not what PP said to get eletd but it would lower me to repost her personal attacks here.

Just to clarify.

Peachy
that was in response to numerous bullying abusive and hateful posts about me and my children, for holding the view stated in my post above.

I don't agree that you have had that response PP. And because you eprsonalised it,and used comments you should be ashamed to have typed, I won't be engaging on this with yu any more. However,you do always have the option to start your own thread on MN should you wish tofind people with your own POV.

Ican't stop you posting here but I *can( ignore you.

I posted about employment prospects for people with challenging behaviours in highly competitive fields.And about the suitability of people with ASD diagnosis wanting to do again very competitive jobs which require buckets of empathy and people skills

I have been painted as the wicked witch of the west for holding a view point which is not radicle on a thread which asked for different POVs.

Among other things I have been told I don't deserve to have children, I am thick as mince and my 4 yr old is princessy for not wanting her hair pulled every day ,her work destroyed and her posessions taken on a daily basis

That is possibly because 1) you can't seem to differentiate between special needs and aggressive or challenging or bullying behaviour and 2) you believe NT children have greater entitlement towards meeting their potential.

Fwiw, there is an incredibly radical man, hero of mine, who employs ONLY people on the spectrum. They are his dream employee. Conscientious, intelligent, passionate about their work...

His name is Thorkil Sonne and the name of his company is Specialisterne.

Maggie -- thanks for that! (scribbles down vvv useful name and company)

I have a staggeringly bright son with Asperger's who is going to need a heroic employer some day to make use of his talents. He spent years in primary school being the sort of disruptive nightmare that I, as a small nervous goodygoody type, would frankly have hated to share a classroom with. These days, with good support, he's really blossoming (and in fact it was news to some of his classmates that he had any kind of SEN -- despite the full-time TA support).

I can see this from both sides, actually, as we also have a daughter who smugly relays tales of what 'those naughty boys' have been doing each day at school. Even though she understands her own brother's difficulties, it is very hard to persuade her that the disruptive children (one definitely ASD, one ADHD, one with an impossible home life) are anything other than 'naughty'.

Expert help and support -- that's the difference. It doesn't come cheap.

princessparty you have also been told, repeatedly, by numerous posters that the best way to solve the issues your daughter is experiencing is to speak the school every time such an incident occurs until the school puts support in place for these children. As far as I can see you have not acknowledged any of these posts, so quite clearly you have no desire to actually change the situation and you would rather complain about it online.

Given that you quite clearly have no knowledge or understanding about ASD, or any SN for that matter, I suggest you keep your comments about the employment prospects of people's children to yourself.