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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Potential fraud?

411 replies

DontKnowWhatToDoNext · 22/12/2009 14:30

I am prepared to be flamed so go ahead but WWYD in my situation?

In brief - DH and I split up last year. 6 months ago, I lost my job due to depression and have since started getting better, have been living on benefits since then with DH paying maintenance for our 3 DCs. I have been desperately trying to get another job but my sickness record at my last job has gone against me. Last month, I was given notice to quit my rented house because the landlord wants to sell - runs out end of Jan.

Over the last few months DH and I have been giving our relationship another go and fell into bed last month (definitely not planned) and I have just found out I'm pregnant which was not supposed to happen . We have discussed it at length and want to get back together (we split up because we have been through a lot of shit over the last few years and blamed each other and basically were hating each other all the time). Time apart has helped sort that out and he has been round almost everyday to see the kids so they have not been that badly affected.

Now I had been to the council (before I found out about the pregnancy) and told them that I am about to be made homeless and they basically said that I would have to find another private rent or they would put me in a B&B.

Now bad as this sounds, I want to try for a council house (even if it means a B&B for a few months as the rents are so high in this area (1000 for a passable 3 bed and now I will need a 4 bed which will be about 1200) so do not intend to get back with DH 'officially' until this happens. DH works but only brings in about 1800 a month and we will never be able to live on his wage in private rented especially as I won't be able to work with a baby and I can't stand the insecurity of having to move all the time (we have moved 3 times in the last 3 years). I am also bankrupt and will not be able to private rent unless I have a guarantor which I don't! Part of the reason for the problems with DH and I were financial as we lost everything (including our own home) when his business went under a few years back. He will also have to go bankrupt soon as his debts have been hanging around and with another child to pay for, he will not be able to pay them.

DH has his own flat and is not actually living with me so AIBU and a total scumbag to try and get a council house as a single parent??

OP posts:
Original poster
DontKnowWhatToDoNext · 22/12/2009 16:05

purplepeony - so all council house dwellers are spongers non? I was a tax payer for 16 years until 6 months ago and have tried hard to be one again. DH pays tax now. Take your twisted views and stick them where the sun don't shine! Most people try their best to support their families, unfortunately circumstances sometimes bite you in the butt.

No I will not have an abortion because some individuals with morals miles higher than mine think I should do that rather than ask for social housing. I do not expect 4 bedrooms but that is what I was told by the council officer I would get with only my 3 current children . Why should I not use my current circumstances to make our lives more secure in the long run. Anyone who would not do that must be bonkers because I have learnt the hard way that working hard and keeping your nose clean does not really benefit you when times are rough .

P.S Expat were you irresponsible as well when you went bankrupt or is it only people trying to set up their own businesses (my debts were mostly for office equipment not shoes and handbags) that fall flat that are irresponsible .

OP posts:
pooexplosionsonthedustyroad · 22/12/2009 16:06

Its implied, otherwise she wouldn't be admitting to fraud.

ObsidianBlackbirdMcNight · 22/12/2009 16:09

1- you don't need an extra bedroom. Children can share. The council will not allocate you a 4 bed you know - there are people sleeping in their living rooms while their 3 children have the bedroom - and that's ok as far as they are concerned.
2- If DH's is your only wage you may be entitled to some LHA to help with the rent. Contact housing benefit to ask.
3- £1800 is not a tiny wage. It's not loads but it's respectable.
4- if you live with a wage earning partner you should not access a resource that single non earning parents have more need of, sorry.
5- B&B is fucking vile. Temp flats are almost worse. Then you have to take the first flat they offer you which might be in a dodgy area, or have a multitude of problems. Private rental is also shit in its own way but at least you can choose where you live.

ReindeerInaSkoda · 22/12/2009 16:10

I wouldn't get too worked up about the OP, those who are worried about the ethics of her getting a house over someone who needs it more.

There is no way she'll be offered a 4 bed house, even on the shittiest of shitty estates, any time in the next 5 years. She'll be offered a 3 bed flat, eventually, by which time she'll have given up having spent months in a B&B. It's all accademic in a way.

ReindeerInaSkoda · 22/12/2009 16:10

accademic academic.

purplepeony · 22/12/2009 16:12

OP said - "We have discussed it at length and want to get back together (we split up because we have been through a lot of shit over the last few years and blamed each other and basically were hating each other all the time). Time apart has helped sort that out and he has been round almost everyday to see the kids so they have not been that badly affected."

well, call me old fashioned or just assuming too much but when the OP said they were getting back together, they are married in fact anyway, and she is having another baby, I thought- but could be wrong- that they intended to live in the same house.

I don't see the point of her post otherwise- if she is a single parent and he is providing maintenance, then why is it wrong to try for a council house?
I must be missing a point somewhere.

marantha · 22/12/2009 16:12

*NancyDrewRocks", oh yes they have.
An earlier poster said that being in a couple can affect people's benefits even if they are NOT living together.
Preposterous! How can you be cohabiting with someone if you are not living with them?!

RealityIsRoastingChestnuts · 22/12/2009 16:13

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purplepeony · 22/12/2009 16:16

don'tknow- you have the nerve to say I have twisted views? And you come on here asking how you can buck the system? Get over yourself darling- it's you who is mad.
And asking why you shouldn't do what you can to make your lives secure- sure- I couldn't agree with you more- just don't ask for my taxes to help you do it. Get a job, sort out your family planning, act like a grown up. And stick your fraudulent claims up your own butt.

ilovemydogandmrobama · 22/12/2009 16:17

What happens, and I don't know, if one applies and gets a council house and then circumstances change?

RealityIsRoastingChestnuts · 22/12/2009 16:20

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purplepeony · 22/12/2009 16:20

ILove as far as I know they reassess and ask you to move out.

marantha · 22/12/2009 16:20

Purplepeony are you deliberately being vague? If they are not actually living together it is not fraud.
If they ARE, I grant you may have a point.
As long as OP informs dwp that her husband is living with her SHOULD he move in, there is no problem.

RealityIsRoastingChestnuts · 22/12/2009 16:20

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mustrunmore · 22/12/2009 16:21

Aside from all the dishonesty and moral issues, my main shock on this thread is the op saying 'only £1800 a month' ., Jeez, thats an awful lot of money for most of us, even a couple with 4 kids could manage on that if really had to. Ok, you're saying your rental would be £1200, so that leaves you £600 a month for everything else. Well, we live on less than that (2 kids, 2 adults, in London).

NancyDrewRocks · 22/12/2009 16:23

But Marantha that is true. Leave aside the semantics for a moment. The DSS do not simply look at whether a couple are not cohabiting (using the usual definition of the word)they consider whether they can be deemed as "Living Together as Husband and Wife" and they can be considered this without living together.

You might disagree with this and you can argue about the terminology until you are blue in the face but this is FACT.

And honestly I'd be interested to know whether you think it would be acceptable for me to claim benefits in the circumstances I set out earlier

marantha · 22/12/2009 16:23

*Reality..." you had nothing to be caught over! He maintained a separate household from you. You have nothing to be guilty of.

purplepeony · 22/12/2009 16:24

marantha- I am not being vague _ I am quoting what the OP wrote.

Tell me please- what is she doing that is fraudulent or potentially fraudulent, if this is not her plan? If she is single and wants a council house as she has no money for anything else, then what is the fraud?
Don't let us start arguing please- we are trying to sort out the OP!

marantha · 22/12/2009 16:25

Not according to their guidelines about living together as husband and wife, it isn't.
The key thing is that they actually live in the same household.

Please provide proof of this, "NancyDrewRocks"

SerenityNowAKABleh · 22/12/2009 16:26

Is there no way that your DH could act as guarantor for a private rental?

ObsidianBlackbirdMcNight · 22/12/2009 16:26

A council housing officer told you you would be offered a 4 bedroom flat with you and three children? In the South East?

This council officer is either delusional or imaginary. With 4 children you would get a 3 bed, max. Babies can share with parents until 5 years old, siblings of the same gender get one bedroom, siblings of different genders only need separate bedrooms at age 10 (the younger one).

purplepeony · 22/12/2009 16:26

Maranthat we both must learn to read more carefully- itis plain for all to see...

OP says she does not plan to have DH back officially until the house is sorted. Now to me and any other judge in the land, officially means in the same house.

Not agree?

ObsidianBlackbirdMcNight · 22/12/2009 16:29

Purplepeony
a council tenancy is yours for life, however your circs change. Of course the decent thing might be to move out if you suddenly win the lottery but you have no obligation to.

purplepeony · 22/12/2009 16:32

Thank you for correcting me ladies- one more thing to ask the next government to change, imo. Grossly unfair.

marantha · 22/12/2009 16:33

purplepeony Not agree and any half-decent lawyer would (and would have an absolute duty) argue that having someone back does not necessarily mean living with them.

Had a glance at living together as husband and wife legislation by the dwp. It's pretty clear: to be classed as ltahaw the couple must share the same household.