To still be BF my 4-year-old?

[NaturalMama]

Sounds really bad in the title. My first post on here after lurking for a very long time. I'm also posting this in Breast/Bottle Feeding but figured this would attract some honest opinions as well.

I've started to get quite a few snarky comments and dirty looks when people hear that I'm still breastfeeding my eldest. These are not from mere strangers but from dear close friends and immediate family.

My eldest is 4.2, going into reception and he has had access to 'minty' ( his word) whenever he likes since birth. At the moment he currently has it after breakfast (and after I've fed his sister), in place of and/or just before or after his afternoon kip around 2pm, and just after tea. Sometimes more, sometimes just once. He is very excited about going to school but he's always been a very very shy boy and we've had talks about him not having minty during the day but he seems okay with it. I've never tried to get him to stop as I think if he asks for it, he obviously needs the comfort. He's never had a dummy/comforter and shows no interest in bartering minty time for toys, sweets, etc.

I had a baby when he was 2 who passed away at 4 months old. I do admit that feeding my eldest was just as comforting for me as it was for him during that time, and I felt it wasn't fair on him to go cold turkey when he was having an emotional time as well.

My youngest is just gone 7 months and she feeds about 5 times a day, obviously between when DS has a go.

Family is starting to tease DS about it saying he's not a big boy and his school friends will think he's silly. It's a private thing and we are always alone when we do it (apart from DD and DH) but family/friends ask me if I've stopped yet and I feel a bit huffy about it.

I know he's not getting anything nutritionally out of it, but can I ask the Mumsnet jury what you think? Is it harmless/comforting for him especially at a time of upheaval (i.e. sister being born, loss of second, starting school) or is it time to give it up and if so - how on earth do I go about doing this? It's not about me babying him as I have another baby I can happily feed for at least another two years!

But pisces whilst I respect your choices and have every sympathy for your circumstances, why the assumption that it is a) anything to do with the mother babying and b) something that holds the child back.
My DD isn't the slightest bit babyish - I often wonder why this view persists. It really hasn't been my experience.

As an extended BF and someone who was bullied at school for having deaf parents I think that although we all support the OP for continuing BF her DS the reality is this is something she will need to address (rightly or wrongly - that is a whole new thread) for her DSs sake. I think IMHO some methods for gentle withdrawal would be the sensible way to proceed

Ooh also remembered something I wanted to say.

This is absolutely not the only means of comfort or loving affection my son and I have. We have lots of cuddles, kisses, giggle and tickle fights; we read books, sing songs, dance around the house, make fairy cakes, build bubble houses in the bath, paint with our toes, look up at the clouds, and count sunflower petals.

pag,i am not sure why you are as defensive of this as you are?
nobody is saying that we think EBF's children are babyish-as adults most of us can see the benefits of feeding our children and offering them comfort.
We are offering support and opinions to someone who has asked for them-you really need not be as dismissive of our opinions you know?This lady has already said she's feeling put upon by her family,that she's not sure she wants to continue.
it's great you felt confident enough to sit and breastfeed a 4yo at a coffee morning (i think i'd be wishing you'd put 'em away love at that stage to be honest...)but your choice and obviously something you feel confident doing.not everyone else is that confident.nor are their children-the op and her child are not you and your dd-that is the difference that you seem to be over looking.
and i have no desire to be dragged into a catfight with you-i am merely pointing out you have the tools to deal with this type of stuff as does your dd,does the OP?

Aww, NM, you sound lovely.

Just wanted to correct something in your OP though - you said he's not getting anything nutritionally out of it, but breastmilk is still a fabulous drink to have even at 4. There is still plenty of antibodies and nutrition and if he has a D&V bug (for example) then it is the perfect rehydration fluid for him. For me, this is one of the main bonuses of breastfeeding an older child - when ds had the norovirus last year he was terribly, terribly ill, and lost an enormous amount of weight (just to give you an idea, at 12 months he weighed the same as he did at 17 weeks ) and I have no doubt that had he not been breastfed we would have been in hospital on a drip!

Breastmilk is amazing stuff, and only you and your ds can decide when it's time to stop. Other people's opinions shouldn't have a bearing on that (although I know that they do).

IMO starting school is a big milestone, and a good time to stop. I personally would not BF as long as you have (even if I could, which I couldn't) but that's your choice, and fine. But...as others have said, he's growing up now, reaching a new stage, and my gut feeling is that it's time to knock the BF on the head. I know lots of people say that it's necessary as long as the child wants it, but IMO, it's really not necessary. Of course BM is preferable to cow's milk at any stage, but children are quite capable of digesting cow's milk, so nutritionally, it's not necessary in the way it is for babies. Comfort wise, cuddles etc are just as effective. If he likes to suck something, well there are thumbs, blankies etc, although I'd be encouraging mine to stop sucking by that age anyway. I wouldn't want my DS to still use his dummy, or drink from a bottle, or even suck his thumb by 4 - so I'm not sure that a 4 year old needs boob either. I see the other sucky comfort things as for babies - I want my son to be able to do without them by that age, nothing to do with thinking BF is gross or anything, but by 4....I dunno, I just feel that the sucky stage should be ending.

Anyway, rambly and probably unhelpful, but that's my view.

Ds started school last year at 4.2 and it was 8.50 to 3.20 every day 5 days a week from the start. No opportunity for afternoon naps at all! I only know one school that did part time and that was only until October half term. I would check your school's policy if I were you.

Oh - and that view was prevalent in my family (no dummies, thumb sucking not allowed, anything in the mouth was removed) which could be utterly wrong, but is the place I'm coming from so feel free to disagree with me!

I felt that as a single mother with one DS he had enough disadvantages without me making it a rather cloying relationship-we had/have a really close relationship-I think bfing a school age DC would have made it unhealthily close in our circumstances. My head tells me that people should be free to do whatever they like, which is what I believe, but I can't stop my instinctive reaction that it says much more about the needs of the mother than the needs of the DC.
I don't see why it should cause bullying, if they are confident-my DS managed to regularly wet himself when he started school, no one bullied him about it.

At 4 yrs I wouldn't want a bottle or dummy either. I don't think the answer to hunger, boredom or upset is to shove something in the mouth.

Pm Bf is not shoving something in a child's mouth

My son is still bfeeding at nearly 4. I'd like to stop but don't want to push him too hard to do so, and imo that is the more important factor - what impact you think ending it will have? It's not that easy to just say stop to a four year old wanting comfort (and giving comfort is a good thing, not a bad one), at least it's not in our house. I like the idea of child-led weaning but I can't see my son doing it for at least another year. His latch is rubbish but it doesn't stop him wanting milk!

I think the comments about teasing are fairly irrelevant. My son has rarely asked to bf in public since hitting around 2 and I'm sure he doesn't talk about it at nursery and won't at school. I wouldn't want to give children the message that you shouldn't do things because other kids your age don't; I'd be much happier saying I want to stop.
Good luck whatever you decide. Personally I would wait til school starts and see if he drops it anyway, but in the meantime, if you want to, try a bit of not being in the usual chair/wherever you feed when he usually asks (or don't offer, if you do)

Mollie It is full-time. Thanks for letting me know he won't be having a nap there, I wasn't aware

Breastfeeding an older child has nothing to do with the needs of the mother. NaturalMama has already said that she doesn't use bf-ing to "baby" her ds, she has a baby to baby already!

There was a good thread a while back asking whether mothers would stop nursing their older children right there and then, with no damage to the child or their breasts. The majority of people said they would stop immediately, if they could. I certainly would - getting mauled day and night by my enormous toddler is not my idea of fun!!

At 4 yrs it is! If they are hungry they can have a piece of fruit. If they are bored they can find something to do-use their imagination; and if they are hurt and want comfort they can have a lovely cuddle and a chat or even a story. No wonder many adults comfort eat and have weight problems! The breast isn't the answer to everything once they are old enough to walk and talk.

I'm confused by those posters who say stop so he doesn't get bullied. Children get bullied for all sorts of reasons should we all conform to the bullies standard just in case? Or teach our children that being different is not always bad despite what the bully says?

My son was bullied for having tuna on his sandwich should i have stopped him having tuna sandwiches?

OP - YANBU

'No wonder many adults comfort eat and have weight problems!'

Because they were breastfed passed walking age?

So what do people think about the dummy/boob thing? I was always anti-dummy but as my son ended up not being BF for long I felt he needed to suck sometimes for comfort and will try to take that away when I feel he's ready. In my opinion, that should be well before the age of 4. I don't want DS at 4 to be still sucking a dummy, or to be sucking his fingers, or a comforter. That may be to do with the way I was raised but I find it to be inappropriate to that age (and I think most people would agree re dummies at 4). As I see the dummy as a BF equivalent, ie sucking for comfort that often goes with a cuddle, I see BF at 4 in the same way. He's not being nourished by it as a baby is (but it obviously has more value than a dummy) but he's using it as comfort really. Do people think that having something to suck on at 4 is ok? Anyone agree with me that it's aomething that should be discouraged earlier than 4?

'I don't think the answer to hunger, boredom or upset is to shove something in the mouth'

Where do you put your food when you are hungry?

My daughter sucks her thumb she is 5, why should she not?

a tuna sandwich is slightly different to breastmilk and well you know it tamarto.

i don't think adult obesity is a result of breastfeeding-quite the opposite.

what i do think is that it's threads like this that polarise breastfeeders and wheels out the ebf'ers who promote to the endth degree what they have done without looking at the op's post...

sleepless
I'm not fighting - honest

Its not something i feel defensive about. And my comment to the OP was that the fact that she is questioning herself may well mean that she is really ready to stop now. No one should feed longer than they feel happy about - and that time will vary hugely from person to person. It is all about individuals and their personal choices - and importantly what the child seems to want too.

My subsequent replies were to some of the dimmer comments where the notion is that breast feeding a child will make them clingy and that it will lead to bullying.

Perhaps the most important point that I have failed to make is that DDs friends couldn't give a toss - they paid no more attention to that than to what colour her room is painted or what she reads at bedtime. Kids don't tend to judghe this stuff unless someone else is telling them what they should think.

( and re the coffeee morning comment. T'was a joke. Obviously not a funny one but nevertheless....)

kat - dummies can be very detrimental to a child's oral development, and can result in permanent deformities. As a result, I think the sooner a dummy can be got rid of the better, not because of any stigma attached to a child sucking on a dummy, but because of the damage that can be done to the child's teeth and speech development. Same goes for finger/thumb sucking.

Some children just have higher sucking needs than others. My ds would still have a dummy if I let him (not that he took one as a baby!) and still "fidgets" with one while he nurses. My dd, OTOH, nurses for food and that's it. If she's distressed and I try to nurse her she will arch her back and scream!

Some children will still need to suck at 3, 4 or 5 (I think I sucked my thumb until I was about 9!) some will have grown out of it by 12 months!

And LOL at pisces - you know bf-ing can reduce obesity, don't you??

DS1 has just finished his first year in reception, he is 5. I have to say that ime boys of this age need comfort from their Mothers more than ever. I know a lot of his peers have their blankets/teddies waiting at the school gates for them or in their cars.
They are such a curious mix of bravado and uncertainty at this age. One minute coming home with all these new Powerranger/Ben 10 rough games, the next sitting on your lap and twizzling you hair for hours.
DS1 seemed to want more cuddles and reassurance from me when he first started reception.

I would be more worried about your son being tired ( as mine dropped daytime napping pre-2yrs!)as he was missing his nap tbh, DS1 started full time from the off and was exhausted for the first term.

I am sorry for your loss as well.

'a tuna sandwich is slightly different to breastmilk and well you know it tamarto.'

I didn't say they were the same, it is the same arguement should i not have given him one incase he was bullied for it, children will pick on anything and everything if they so feel the desire.

I hope that last comment was not aimed at me?