to be angry that my son has lied to me about where he is staying tonight

[lividmum]

Hope you can help me get some perspective on this.

DS1 (14) had a 10pm curfew tonight. He didn't make the curfew so I rang him and he said he was staying at his friend's house. I said I wasn't happy (as he had previously agreed the 10pm curfew) but OK as long as he wasn't still out and about at that time. I asked to speak to his friend's mum to check she was OK with that (we do this often to make sure our DSs are where they say they are) and he then blurted out that he was staying with another friend (a girl). I asked to speak to one of her parents as I don't know the girl and was told by my DS1 that I couldn't as they were out for the evening and not coming back until the morning. Apparantly her parents had told her she could have a couple of friends over but I am assuming they didn't mean half a dozen 13-14 year olds (boys) (I could hear other voices in the background).

Anyway the upshot of this is that he has refused to come home and I don't know where the girl lives so I've had no choice but to leave it at that and hope that they behave themselves.

What would you do? I'm just so cross (a) that he lied about it and (b) that he has refused my request to come home.

Thanks for reading.

All I can comment on is my own experience. I have two teenagers and I have had none of your problems. OK - so far.

I'm sorry if I have upset any of you, and I wasn't trying to be smug - far from it, as I do know/understand how this business of parenting teenagers is not easy. But some of the things said here have made me really angry.

And I do get exasperated by weak parenting. My children behave the way they do because of the way we have brought them up. I'm sorry if this is unpalatable.

It is no coincidence that I have two children like this.

CaptainRex said "BecauseImWorthIt - that is extremely niave of you to think that its the parenting that counts".

So what the bloody hell else counts?!!!!!!!

Kiddiz said "If you can't suggest something more useful than that you should not post on here. You're very fortunate to have such wonderful children which are, as you suggest, the result of your superior parenting skills. Surely it would be more useful to pass on some of your skills to us less perfect parents than make patronising comments. Coming on here with smug comments about how wonderful your dcs are serves no purpose other than to make a struggling parent feel even more useless."

There are so many issues here, I'm not sure where to start.

I'm not 'fortunate'. Me, and my DH, have worked very hard to bring our sons up so that they behave the way that we believe that they should behave. It is not something that just happens.

And that means being strict, definite and consistent from day one. If you need to know more, then there are loads of parenting books around. And if that is patronising, then so bloody what. I have worked hard, along with my DH, to make sure that my children behave well since they were born.

I was not trying to be smug or superior in any way. But I was trying to make that point that as a parent you have to be the parent from day one.

Don't waste your anger on me.

FGS get real, people.

I'd just like to offer my support to you lividmum, and to you maryz.

I have several teenagers and know exactly what you are talking about. One of mine was one of the oldest in her year and went through a very rebellious stage but has now come through it, I hope. She is studying and talking to us again and it is wonderful.

In the end it seemed to be a mixture of her maturing on her own and us showing our disappointment in her behaviour. She seemed able to shrug off our anger but appeared to respect some tough rules applied with lots of affirmations of love. So echoing the previous poster who talk of tough love. Hang on in there, you are doing well and it will end, maybe around 17, but it will.

BIWI - there but for the grace of God........

There isn't a secondary school in this country that is free of cannabis. My dcs were brought up strictly too, they are extremely bright, but the most intelligent, nicely brought up child can get into bad company.

I had a hard time with ds1, but thankfully we got through it, but I would never condemn another parent who was struggling.

Most teenagers try cannabis. Unfortunately they are trying it at younger and younger ages - 13 to 14 being the most common now. The stuff they are using is nothing like the stuff that was around 30 years ago. It is evil. The younger they are the more dangerous it is.

Lividmum: Things to look out for in terms of stuff lying around:

used bus or train tickets with small pieces torn off or cut out

toilet roll insides, or kitchen towel tubes, especially if they have holes punched in one or both sides

straws

ball point pen cases (the plastic outside) - anything that can be used like a straw.

lighters and cigarette papers

airfreshner/febreze spray

punctured tin cans

There is probably a lot more but I can't think now.

You should lock up your purses, wallets, handbags, credit cards and watch your cash.

Re the cannabis -
Sadly, with some kids, they can suffer a lot of damage from even a few tries. An experiment can go badly wrong.

I have two teenagers who are, so far, behaving very well. How many do I need to have then?! How silly.

I do have empathy and some understanding, actually. But I'm not prepared to just wring my hands and say 'how awful' when my children behave in a way that I think is unacceptable.

My DCs are very different. But both of them know/understand what is and isn't acceptable. Bringing them up has not been easy, we have worked hard to achieve this. Why on earth would you think we wouldn't cope if things changed? They are like this because of the way they have been brought up.

You all seem to think that I am in some way fortunate - as if the way my children have been parented is nothing to do with me, or it is coincidence, or that we are just 'fortunate'. How ridiculous is that?!

3littlefrogs - yes indeed, there but for the grace of God. And please don't for one minute think that I'm not watching them like a hawk.

I am not a smug, oblivious parent. I am actually very worried about the threats/temptations that might befall them.

My two sons are a way off being teenagers yet, but I like popping onto these kinds of threads to see what I can expect in the future!

It all sounds like such a worry - I can totally understand how impressionable teenagers can get in with the wrong crowd and change overnight......

BecauseI'mWorthIt, you sound unbelievably smug and blinkered. Like one of those mums who has children who are good eaters and has never experienced a fussy eater so think that fussy eaters are the result of bad parenting.

I wonder if your children are so well behaved because you never let them go out anywhere, or because they fear you. See, other people can judge YOU too on your parenting skills without knowing the full story.

In a way, I almost hope you come back on here in a year's time with your tail beween your legs, asking for advice because your teenager has finally gone off the rails through no fault of your own.

Just don't JUDGE so fucking much, woman.

Oh dear BIWI I really hope you don't find yourself eating your words one day!You speak very niavely, you also sound very controlling.

Everyone who is living these difficult family situations has my utmost sympathy. As a mum of three teens i know I have been lucky so far but even the little things we have been through with ours have been so hurtful and worrying. I do believe that the way you are going lividmum is the best way to get through this.

BIWI, my brother and I were both model children, my parents were extremely proud of the way they had taught us right from wrong, to be polite, caring, generous, work hard, understand the value of money, respect etc etc. They had many a chat at the foot of my bed about my responsibilities, about 'remembering who I was' - I was, in the nicest possible way, a successful project. They loved me to bits and bored others with descriptions of my loveliness.

So it's a good job they didn't (and still don't) know I was actually having sex, smoking fags, lying about where I was and, later, taking a range recreational drugs and getting a tattoo on my bottom!

I do, indeed hope that I don't eat my words in the future. Which is also why, as I said, we are watching our children like hawks to make sure that we spot any danger signs.

And I have huge sympathy for anyone who is going through some of the stories that have been alluded to here (although my posts were actually in relation to the OP).

And makipuppy, one of the reasons I am so alert to all of this is because of my own behaviour as a teenager! And to be honest, I would be worried if my teens weren't experimenting in some way.

I am not naive. Not sure how to respond to the accusation that I am controlling - this was clearly said as an insult. Yes, I am controlling, in that as a parent I am in charge and expect my children to respect that.

However, as my views are clearly wrong, and my experiences invalid, I will leave this post.

I hope, lividmum, that you manage to sort things out with your son in a way which will lead to happiness for you all.

'And that means being strict, definite and consistent from day one. If you need to know more, then there are loads of parenting books around. And if that is patronising, then so bloody what. I have worked hard, along with my DH, to make sure that my children behave well since they were born.'

So have I, but I am aware that I am very lucky. It isn't just down to the parenting, it depends a lot on the DC to begin with and they are not blank sheets of paper. I wrote a reply to this yesterday and then didn't post it, thinking that it probably was beyond my experience and not very helpful.

I know so many cases of excellent parenting where the DCs have gone off the rails. The one that springs to mind is a very clever boy with two teachers as parents (the best sort of concerned teacher who relates well to teens), mother didn't work when he was young-loving extended family. The DD is a delight, everything that you would want in a teenage girl but the older brother got expelled from school for dealing in cannabis. They got him back on the rails, it it took a lot of time and effort and I don't know why he went off in the first place.

I know of quite a lot of other similar ones.

I should just count your blessings BIWI-but it isn't purely due to your parenting skills. I find it very amusing when a parent has views like that and then along comes another DC who breaks every rule possible and they find that it isn't so simple.

I'm afraid that I am no help to OP- but good luck-just hang on in there and don't give up.

BIWI - I find the contradiction interesting though, I will admit. If your children are well behaved because of your parenting, why would you need to watch them like hawks to spot any danger signs? They've still had the same upbringing now that they will have had in, say 2 months, if they went off the rails 2 months from now. So how can it be said that it's strictly down to parenting?

Obviously, parenting can play a part sometimes in teenagers going off the rails - but it can just as easily be some other influence as well.

BIWI I shouldn't post this because it is just perpetuating the tangent this thread has gone off on, but, all the below quotes are concerned with control (to my uneducated mind)

"You need to get a grip and regain control over him."

"He has all the power and you are letting him."

"Neither of my DSs would dare to behave like this."

"we are watching our children like hawks to make sure that we spot any danger signs."

I so feel for what you are going through, and hope that you can take comfort from the fact that you are obviously a good parent, coping with this situation in the best way possible.

Our older daughter was a real handful at that age. She's a very intelligent person, bored very easily, and always looking for thrills. She hated school, truanted only twice, but, my goodnes, it was hard getting her there every day. She was suspended several times, bought home by the police on a couple of occasions, arrested etc etc etc.

She's now 18, in the middle of a apprenticeship (tried A-levels, but couldn't be bothered with the work involved!), has a nice boyfriend, and has calmed down so much that I look back and can hardly believe she is the same person. She can still be very selfish and prone to temper tantrums like you wouldn't believe, but mainly now, she is pleasant and good company to be around.
Like any parent experiencing bring up a 'high maintenance' teenager, we beat ourselves with the stick of "what bad parents we are", but truthfully, I don't think we were. Of course, we could have done some things differently, but .....

What I am trying to say is hang in there, I am sure that he will resolve his issues in his own good time. He obviously knows that you love and care for him and that is really important.

A police welfare officer said to us once that we shouldn't worry, the phase will pass because she is clearly loved, from a 'good home'.

This applies to your son too, you are doing a great job.

And keep posting lots of support for you here

Outside influences are huge at this age.

My son befriended a boy at school who seemed a bit lonely. This boy's brother was a high flyer, extremely clever etc.

We thought he was a nice enough lad and we made him welcome in our home, met his parents etc.

Imagine our horror when we subsequently found that this boy had introduced our son to drugs. The dealer was an older boy known to his family through their their place of religious worship.

The younger boy had gone of the rails because his mother was seriously ill.

They were 13 years old.

Hard to see how my parenting was responsible for that. We went through years of hell to get through that, and yes, I did have to watch my son like a hawk. It isn't always enough.

However marvellous a parent you are, you can't isolate your kids from other people.

lividmum - I think you are right to be concerned about your son's mental health. I think you should consider the possibility of cannabis use, and contact your GP urgently for further help and support. I really hope and pray you can get through this.

lividmum is he allowed to smoke in the garden, on the drive or in your street?

"I am unable to keep him in without blocking all exits (including upstairs windows) for the whole day without leaving his side for one moment."

i always told my eldest about grounding when he said " you can't stop me"

" well it's easy to go out. it's getting back in that's the problem!"

maryz - I can see you are absolutely over a barrel. I agree - it is easy to threaten to throw a child out if they don't want that to happen - you have some bargaining power. It is much harder to know what to do when the child wants to be thrown out so they can move in with the local mafia.

It leaves you in a state of paralysis. When I was at rock bottom, I really wished I had a relative who lived in the back of beyond somewhere that I could send ds to stay with.

I sat up night after night researching state boarding schools and wondering how one would qualify for such a place.

A friend of mine sent her ds to live with her ex h in another country. It worked for her, but there are no guarantees.

I wasn't going to come back to this but just wanted to respond to this...

"I'm not 'fortunate'. Me, and my DH, have worked very hard to bring our sons up so that they behave the way that we believe that they should behave. It is not something that just happens".

...Because you are fortunate imo. When my sons were 14 and 17 I could have written your posts. Then my Dh was diagnosed with cancer. Both he and ds2 took this badly. Dh totally opted out of family life and parenting and Ds2, despite loads of support and help, did not deal with the fact that his father might die at all well. His behaviour went down hill from that point. He's 18 now and there is a light at the end of the tunnel but it has been an extremely stressful 3 1/2 years. I had no way of knowing that our family would go down this path or how we would cope. The answer to that was not very well I suppose but until the unexpected happens you can't know what effect this might have on your children's behaviour