In reacting like this to future FIL saying he wont come to our wedding?

[MesaLoca]

I've told DP that I wont be going to visit his parents at xmas because I am so insulted and upset at DP's dad recently telling him that he doesn't think he can bring himself to come to our wedding as he doesn't consider it 'proper' and thinks DP is 'selling himself short' (this is all to do with religion). DP thinks I am being unreasonable in not going.

Me and DP have lived together 5 years. DD is 2, wedding is in May.

I have a short temper and know if I go at xmas I will end up in a row about this. They live 3 hours away so I can't just leave if it all blows up. I know I cannot go along and pretend everything is ok, I just am not that kind of even-tempered person.

I am gutted. How dare he do this, we were so looking forward to getting married

Where someone else gets married is not about your own personal religious beliefs and I don't believe it's anything to do with being modern. There is very little in The Bible about marriage (the actual ceremony) so most of what we know of weddings are traditional. I wouldn't dream of not going to someone's wedding because of where it was held, that's personal to them and their beliefs, not mine. I could understand a Christian not being happy at going to a wedding that was held in a Mosque, but to refuse to go to a civil ceremony, especially one of family, is chucking a dummy!

"Where someone else gets married is not about your own personal religious beliefs and I don't believe it's anything to do with being modern. There is very little in The Bible about marriage"

yes but my point is that all of our religious beliefs are our own personal interpretations and what works for us. if someone else has a different opinion and we refuse to accept it surely that is just as equally "chucking a dummy". so if the FIL in his infinite wisdom has interpreted his faith to mean that attending the ceremony would go against it, then so be it. as you've said you wouldn't dream of not attending a wedding in a mosque, i'd be the same. but if another person felt that they couldn't due to religious beliefs i'd accept their decision and move on,that would be the end of it. i wouldn't accuse them of being petty and spiteful,i'd acknowledge that they are adults with their own belief system and a mind of their own and that they have to decide what they feel is best for them given the circumstances.
even logistically you could say that it goes against the first commandment by putting the state ahead of god and giving them the right to proclaim a marraige. i am of course being faceitious to a certain degree but it is to show that everyone will interpret religion to their own needs.you can't force your will upon them and i think trying to force the FIL to attend something which he states goes against his religious beliefs is very disrespectful

bootsmonkey - re read the post I made - I am simply pointing out that presumeably his parents baptised him a catholic - so unless he has TOLD them he doesn't want to be catholic anymore - how else would they know?

If the OPs partner wants to turn his back on a religion chosen for him by someone else then of course that is ABSOLUTELY his right - but the courteous thing to do would be to maybe let them know he had turned his back on it so they don't make mistakes like this little clanger in assuming that he would have a religious ceremony because they are assuming he is still religious...

Make it a little clearer for you now?

BTW not all religion is mindless dogma - some of it is enlightened as you say. We just all have differing opinions about what is enlightened.......

tinsel - just wondering but it seems like you don't consider atheism/agnsoticism a religious belief........

If someone didn't want to go to a mosque then they shouldn't want to go to a non religious ceremony either......

Personally I would have been distraught if I invited someone of another faith or none to my wedding and they refused on the grounds that I was having a religious ceremony - isn't that just as bad as the FIL that started all this debate in the first place???!!

"i'm confused......how can the child of so obviously devout parents not be catholic?....

Has the OPs partner stood up and admitted to all that actually he wishes to not be a catholic anymore and that he prefers another philosophy in his life?

Without that how can he expect his parents to react any differently? I mean if they think he is still as catholic as they are...
Does that make sense? "

Of course he doesn't have to be catholic-he has a perfect right to be a muslim if he wants to! Next you will be saying he has to vote Conservative because that is what his parents voted!
People will keep assuming that OP is the only one who isn't a catholic! Her DP isn't a catholic-he has stood up and admitted to all that he doesn't want to be a catholic. His parents have no excuse for thinking that he is as catholic as them! He has lived with OP for years and has a DD who is not being brought up as a catholic.

I don't know why people assume that if they bring up their DC as an atheist the DC will be an atheist or if they take them to catholic mass every week they are bound to produce a catholic! Your DC isn't programmed to follow your beliefs.

I can see OP gets a hard time-I am getting incensed on her behalf! Wait another hour and someone else will turn up assuming DP is a catholic!

Well, whonickedmynickname I suppose DP is 'officially' a catholic, in that he was baptised and confirmed. He does not practice though. He listened to what he was taught in church and decided that he did not believe it and I really admire him for having such an independant mind in the face of his upbringing.

His father is not an idiot and will have known for many years that he was not attending church (DP didn't even know where the local RC church was when FIL visited us a number of years ago). However, as FIL is very easily upset DP never thought it necassary to announce his non belief and for whatever reason, FIL also chose not to address the issue (denial I presume). Only when we did not baptise DD did DP have to spell out that he is not practising. I do not think that he has actually said the word atheist to his father and I agree that he might be unwise to do so.

Shiner, your tip about imagining I am talking to a colleague will defo be used! That is a great idea.

Speak with DP and agree to visit the ILs as a family (united front and all that - makes you look reasonable and gracious) but also agree that DP, not you, deals firmly with any FIL wedding flack.

Hopefully it won't come up as a topic and FIL will mellow as the date nears, otherwise by the sound of it, he'll never go to any of his children's weddings.

This is hard for me to get my head round as I am a Massive believer in freedom of religion and I am someone who was brought up in an entirely different faith to the one I practice.....

To me - it was an uncomfortable and messy - but ESSENTIAL business admitting to my parents and family that I thought their religious beliefs were unfounded and that I had actually found a religion that I felt reflected me better than the one they chose for me.

I have baptised my children and when we get to confirmation age they will be encouraged to take their first holy communion. HOWEVER - I will not be upset if they turn around in their adult hood and say respectfully - thanks mum but your religious ideas were misguided....a little gutted maybe but never to the point I'd make life difficult for them as your FIL obviously is.

Uncomfortable as it may be I think your DP needs to say to his dad that seriously - he won't be living his life as a catholic and nor will his children. If your FIL can't respect that its his loss. But you can't expect him to read your DPs mind....he probably thinks (as many parents do when their kids disagree with them!) that its just a phase your DP is going through and that with encouragement FIL can "bring him back to the fold" - your DP needs to make it clear to his dad that this won't happen - that he is happy with the choices he has made as an adult. If FIL continues after all that - then he is the one being unreasonable.

Heated, if I don't bring the topic up then I don't reckon anyone else will. The attitude is always 'don't mention this' or 'don't mention that' in case FIL gets upset.

I do realise now that I need to go and visit them. When I started this thread I was so angry and insulted but I have calmed a bit now and although I still think FIL is being a childish pillock I think that being nice will be in my best interests in the long run.

Ah, sorry you WANT to clear the air at this visit?

Jmo, but could this air-clearing wait until after Christmas as you don't want to sour what is an important family time?

But imo it has to be DP who speaks with his father and not you, otherwise it'll be all too easy to make you the scapegoat in FIL's mind for leading DP 'astray', rather than DP making choices for himself of his own volition.

mesa - you have a DC who would love to have a relationship with her grandparents I am sure - so you are so right about being the bigger person here and visiting them over christmas. DP needs your support probably now more than ever if things are that difficult between him and FIL

Good luck x

Yeah but whonickedmynickname, your attitude is not the same as that of my IL's.

I actually agree with you that DP should be clearer and stand up for himself more. I used to spend a lot of time moaning about it but he is always reluctant.

He feels he will drive a wedge into his relationship with his parents and siblings if he starts exclaining his atheism and I think he is right. Let me be clear though - they are under no illusion that DP is not practising, DD is not baptised and they know he does not attend church, even at easter, even if we are at their house.

Basically this has this is building up to something that DP has been avoiding and its up to him to have it out woth his dad

Oh no Heated I don't! Sorry, misleading post. When I first started this thread I was so furious that I was sure that if I saw FIL at xmas I would start ranting and raving and would spoil xmas for all. I am calmer now and hope I am mature enough to stay off the sherry and keep a smiley face while fantisising about poking his eyes out

mes such a shame that DP feels it would drive a wedge. Please don't think all Catholics are like your ILs - most of us are open minded funny loving and like alot of sherry :-)

Sorry you seem to have ended up with a shallow ignorant set.

Enjoy christmas smug in the ironic knowledge that you are being a better christian than they are on this particular issue!!!!!

I think its very sad that fil can't put aside how he feels about your wedding in order to be there for his son. Quite frankly nothing would make me not attend such an important event for my 2 boys unless they were choosing to elope or do something else where i couldn't be there.

I think it is a very different thing refusing to go to a wedding because of a religious belief and choosing how to get married. If to her fil it is not a marriage anyway I just don't see where the harm is.

I agree with the posters who have said that dp should say to his dad that he is upset that he is taking the view to not come but that if that is his choice so be it. Then don't bring it up again. Send him an invitation as you would anyone else and then take it from there. Probably better to not talk about this at Xmas though unless he brings it up.

The option of a recognition by the catholic church is an interesting one though. I am agnostic rather than atheist and dh and I also had a civil ceremony. Neither of our families are religious so it wasn't an issue. But I think if it had been something that had been very important to mine or dh's parents I would have gone along with something like this as long as it doesn't involve making any vows. It might be enough of a sweetener to get him to come to the wedding? Just a thought. What would your dp say to this?

I still think the best option is to have a word with the parish priest while you are there and get him to have a friendly chat to FIL about Christian forgiveness, tolerance etc. You don't even have to let him know that you instigated it, I'm sure that as Head of a catholic school they see quite a bit of each other and that a priest would be able to bend the conversation without him guessing it was anything to do with you.

Sadly your dp could be right about honesty driving a wedge between him and his father. My father and uncle were both brought up Catholic and both grew up to be atheists. My father was honest about it, big hoo-ha, my Gran never got her head round it. My uncle lied - pretended he was still going to Mass and all that - and was very much the favourite son.

Religious intolerance breeds hypocrisy.