To get slightly fed up with post's about 'gifted and talented' children

[MrsMertle]

because I think some of them are just an excuse for parents to show off, when what they really want to say is "look at my DC, they are so much cleverer than yours!!"

Stewie: It's good to hear that a school helped her and she's 'normal'. I think it really does depend on the school though. I was a bright child (not like ds though) and was left. I'd finish my work in 10 minutes and spent hours waiting for everyone to catch up. I passed my time by counting the spots on the tiles on the ceiling. Fun! Not every school helps a child IMO. She was very lucky.

I think the arguments and problems on these threads, whilst very entertaining, is brought about through ignorance about what G&T is. It's not about genius, it's just a little bit of enrichment for the more able pupils. Perhaps they should have called it the 'good at sports, arts, and more able group for the top 10%'. Then there would be less misunderstanding. Still would be a hoo-har no matter what they called it. They could then have a genius group which may have 1 child in it at a school of 700!!!!

Don't all children deserve their lives to be enriched though. Give one good reason why a child who does well on a CAT test, but is completely lazy deserves a treat more than a child who gets better results by working harder. There needs to be ablity for a school to kick an under achiever off the list.

Prehaps for the child who is 1 in a 1000 there needs to be service like teachers of deaf who can go in support exceptionally talented children in a low key maner.

"I passed my time by counting the spots on the tiles on the ceiling."

I think you will find schools have moved on since you were last at school. Teachers are better trained and more professional than the past.

It is enrichment for the more able, you are right there but I think the op started this thread because she was so annoyed with other people starting threads like "my child can count to 10 and is 2 years old, is she gifted?".

I don't like the terms 'genius' or 'gifted', they segregate a group of children and make them stand out, making them feel (and their parents) as if they are above everyone else. I also dislike the term 'special need' and 'special educational need' as it's a label for children that do not fit the 'norm'. There is no 'normal' though, every child has potential and an ability in something that has a right to be nurtured. Writing a short story can be a massive achievement for one child or writing their name may be a massive achievement for another. We shouldn't be placing any child into a pidgeon (sp?) hole. This is just my opinion though. They are all special and they can all achieve something great.

Reallytired - you are right to question the authority with which I speak. I know something about G & T because I am (a) a teacher and (b) until 2 months ago was SEN governor at a primary school,(c) the parent of a G & T child and (d) sister of some one who works in the relevant govt department.

I agree with you that the system is not brilliant though. But it's a start. I feel it helps my dd to have contact with other children of similar ability, more than she would normally meet in class at school.

Teachers often use brighter children to help those who are less able. This is good for all concerned but it is nice if just sometimes they can do something just for them. I don't think there is a lot of money spent on it. It's mostly looking at a website and opting for extra-curricular things in your area. Except there haven't been any in our area since about 2 years ago.

We could not possibly afford private education and I do not believe it is necessarily better anyway. There are no free places even to people who get scholarships round here.

Bringing us back to the OP, I don't see why we shouldn't discuss it on MN.

stewie, I think the term is misleading, I agree....
like I said, my es is a great artist...but academicallly he does need more help....so, he is on g&t regitre for the arts, but in other subjects he lags behind...but then, I supose that is why they have all the different g&t registres, rather then lumbering them all together....

btw...we never thought es was exceptionally talented, we knew he was great at arts and has a great ability to draw and is very creative in a arty way and can do creative thinking, which is, I suppose, connected...but his secondary teacher felt he is way above (very good GCSE level at age 11....so, basically would have passed the art one with ease...)
ds himself doesn't feel that talented...he looks at the things he can't do great in arts....usually things he has not had the exppereinces in...bless....

I wish they would call it something else tbh but that's Americans for you!. As the term was used there first, I think.

I must admit that I was shocked to get a letter telling me DD had met the criteria to go on the schools 'Gifted and Talented' register. I'd never heard of it before. Read the leaflets and worked out that it was for bright kids. Googled it found out the government initiative then stumbled across mumsnet. Hey it was because of G&T that I'm here. I though the word gifted and even talented a bit strong.

However I hadn't realised until then that she was amongst the brightest so I was glad of it. Its obvious now but she was a late developer.

I do roll my eyes at people saying 'oh it's so exhausting to have a child ask interesting questions! No it isn't -it's fun. Of course all reasonably bright children ask questions about what electrons are made of/how do people know how fast planets travel/evolution/how do people know what colour dinosaur's skin is/why exactly did we cut our King's head off/are ants omnivores or carnivores etc etc etc - but the internet makes them easy and fun to answer and it's interesting. My seven year old has asked all these questions and many many more. I have learned about particle physics, natural history, history, geography and so many other things alongside him. It's fab.
What is exhausting is all the stuff due to his Aspergers - the constant mood swings, the huge social difficulties, his movement difficulties, other health issues.And his disability is so mild compared to other people's. I think having an NT clever child is fantastic, and I cannot imagine why people moan about it.

Doesn't it depend on how many questions they ask mabanana? I love questions, not all day ones though. It's the indepth ones that leave me with a headache that are exhausting. I do send him on the internet for these but had to tackle them myself before we were online. Now life is so much better but what about those parents who are not online? Just beause we find it fun it shouldn't be assumed that other parents think the same.

I think the OP is moaning about other people having an NT clever child and then mentioning it on MN.

What's NT?

do you ever wonder if the way schools are now doesn't help?
when I was at school(yonks ago) secondry school was streamed. you had A,B,C,D of course D was changed to R and even that would be wrong now. but it did mean the bright kids were in the A stream(stragely when you look them up on freinds reunited they all seem to not be doing much) but at least it meant they had their needs met.

But asking lots of questions is what children do! It's like poeple who post threads about having a new born baby and not gettng any sleep. Well, No Shit, Sherlock!

NT is neurologically typical.

I think they should bring back the Grammar schools. I was in the top classes but so were the ones that didn't want to be at school and everyone knew about it. I did notice that the classes corresponded to the parents social classes aswell. I don't know if anyone else noticed this at their school though. I thought they still streamed in secondary schools today?

Yes I don't know what NT stands for, answers anyone?

Secondary schools use sets rather than streams. Most of the bright kids, (I don't like bright either) will be in top sets for each subject so not that different but better as one child may be good at Maths but not literacy.

Cross post, thanks seeker.

It depends on the questions seeker and the age of the child. I wouldn't expect a 2 year old to ask how the engine of a bus works for example, nor would I expect a 7 year old to ask about social structure (who decided on the first rulers? Where do rules come from?) or to watch a car driving down the road and apply Newton's Laws. Am I wrong here?

saints, that is what, when I went to school in germany, it was like....s, in some subjects you might be in the a-group and in others it might be b or c (we only had a/b/c)....and that kinda worked...
saying that, I was, once upon a time in a group for english and sank to c-group as I just didn't get it....and realy finished with very very bad english language skills....then met dh moved over and voila, my english skills have picked up somewhat...
with me it's all about the wy I leanr I suppose....I can not translate to save my life, because, I learned english almost as a child would, if born here...iykwim....experiencial leanring, and all that....never that good at being taught....

We were streamed. I was in top. Mainly linked to social classes of parents but not exclusively it was 80/20 I'd say. I wonder why? I had a friend who was in the bottom set with very well to do parents, but that was exceptional.

I have read a lot of 'poor me' posts on here about nothing more than their bright kids asking perfectly normal questions! So you hate it, well, some parents might hate having a child who was good at running, or ballet, or anything. I think you should be proud of your child's gifts and take pleasure in them. How on EARTH can parents dare complain about schools not giving clever children enough attention/encouragement when they themselves moan about being asked interesting questions and go on about exhausting it is! They are at home more than they are at school. Plenty of time to offer children enrichment etc YOURSELF. Give them STACKS of books to read, and access to google (safesearch of course), and allow yourself to be interested and challenged. My ds who is seven was reading David Attenborough's Life In The Undergrowth about insects in bed tonight. I find it mind-boggling that people can complain that their kids are too clever, I honestly do.

(NT means 'neurotypical' aka 'normal')

we moved a long way to find good grammar for ds1
From hants to lincs as we needed also to be able to afford to buy a decent house too!
It was the best solution we could afford.
Even grammar schools have glass ceilings and overly bright kids cause trouble there too