to think mothers who stop contact with their fathers for no good reason other than they need to control are sad jealous manipulative f*ckers who need to get a grip and move and stop giving every other mother who have moved on a bad name

[jojostar]

it makes me so mad AAAAAARRRRGGGGGHHHHH

You're right Twelvelegs, and I think it comes down to jealousy that Daddy gets to have a nice time with the kids every other weekend while the mum gets the day to day grind. Guess what? Tough! And if you left the father, well double tough. I don't believe those poor fathers think that seeing their kids only 1 day out of every 14 is such a good thing somehow.

I know that DH's ex spun this old chestnut to his kids (alongside "forgetting" to mention that they split because she had an affair). One of his daughters is now grown up, and she has been telling him some of the cr*p that her mother has spouted over the years - it just beggars belief.

Well of course mothers like this exist but, on the flip side, my ex and I have been apart 12 years, in that 12 years he's paid approximately 600 quid on maintenance and signed the deeds of our house over to me of which he contributed roughly 50%of the first years mortgage, I paid the other 5 on my own.

He also decided for 2 years that he wasn't going to bother seeing ds because I told him off when he didnt turn up to pick up ds on his 4th birthday, cue me having to deal with a very distraught ds for the day and effectively ruining his bday. During the 2 years he couldn't be bothered he told everyone where I work that I 'wouldn't let him see his son', he fed the same line to his parents and to his new wife.

Because he wouldn't pay maintenance, we went two years without gas, so no heating, my parents had to help me out just so I could feed the two of us and I worked full time plus commute just trying to pay a mortgage that was calculated on a combined salary, whilst the ex bought the latest games console every year for his new family.

And even now he rouses himself only twice a year to see ds even though he only lives a mile up the road and ds has to walk back home because he's too fucking idle to give him a lift in his flashy car.

Do I sound bitter? Oh yes, indeed, you can bet your gold plated arse I do and you know what? I don't care, I am fucking bitter about it and if it had happened to you, I'm betting that unless you're a saint, you'd be beggaring well bitter too.

well said rantin I'm bitter too ..not for me but for my dgs whos dad dont give a stuff about them who tells all and sundry she[dd] wont let me have them ..easy cop out for him ..makes my blood boil

it is wrong*wrong*wrong to deprive the children of seeing their father

That is a very sweeping statement and obviously not true. If the result of seeing their father is physical, psychological or emotional damage, then it is not wrong. It is wrong to allow a child to be subjected to that on a regular basis.

That was surprisingly cathartic, random.

And this is why this particular topic attracts such polarised views. There is such bitterness on both sides, usually justified. But the OP was specifically talking about women like my DH's ex, not about the rest of you. We all know they exist and they love using their children to get at their ex's.

Twinklemegan. I am jealous that my ds has such a nice time with daddy. Yes, I fully admit it. Because for the last 10 years i am the one who has sat up all night sometimes listening to him breathe...just to check he is breathing, because he had terrible asthma. I'm the one who has pinched herself awake in case something awful happened. I am the one who has done the above then had to go to work the next day, not having had any sleep at all. I am the one who has organised and paid for every single birthday party, helped him with his homework, taken him to the doctors, nursed him, talked to him, dried his tears, attended his special needs reviews, school plays, christmas services, parents evening, paid for school trips, field trips, uniform, mopped up his sick, changed his bed at 3am, cooked his tea when im so tired I can hardly move.

Hell yes, im bitter that one night a week when he can be bothered makes my ex wonderdad.

I would never prevent access for no good reason, but in the past my ex has really pushed me to the limit and im pretty sure his new woman has no idea why.

risking a mauling here but this does happen a lot. I was main carer of my son for 18 months whilst my ex had little to do with my son. she said she didn't want him when he was born, she wanted to give him away and wanted him in a nursery at 3 months old so she didn't have to see him. when I was thrown out of my house, joint business and life, my ex also cut me out of my sons life too. as we were not married, I did not have PR and I was warned that I would face kidnap charges if I tried to take my son and look after him like I had done from the beginning. my little boy was confused, upset and still refuses to go to his mother at handover times.
last week my son told me that his mum called him a cash cow to one of her friends. she has ruined our business, left me with the debts (fraud investigation ongoing) moved many many miles away all to stop me seeing my son. she is on benefits now but would loose quite a bit if she did not have him with her. her latest wheeze is to accuse me of sexual impropriety with my son, which the court laughed at thankfully.

my crime in all this? I stood up to her one day and said I would not put up with her moods, undermining and several other things I won't mention but was to do with a member of her family invading our lives. my continuing crime is my fight to keep contact and not fade into the distance like she wants me to. I was and still am the 'criminal' in her mind, my son was and still is the victim. even now, whilst on benefits but going to uni, she does not look after him, she gets her mother or her mothers friends to do that and my son cries every week when he is handed back to her.

there are bad fathers out there but not as many as you think, there are bad mothers out there too and probably more than you think.

Yes, but it's always the "he can't be bothered" justification isn't it? Well what if your ex could be bothered, what then? What's he expected to do? Would you arrange shared care? Or perhaps you'd prefer that he had custody and not you?

Now that we have all had our little hissyfits are we going to help out the OP?

jojo I have emailed you back, thanks for your email.

Your DP's ex has no right to stop 'access'

• as DP and ex both have Parental Responsibility they are both equal legal parents. One parent has no right to interfere with the parenting schedule than the other
• there has been a long established parenting schedule that the children are used to and expect.
• the ex has unilaterally attempted to change this and has done so very recently - the children are upset and confused by this change, as they are obviously expecting to see their dad and extended family as normally.
• the ex should immediately reinstate the parenting schedule or you will have no other alternative but to make an application to court for a defined contact order - and whilst you're at it why not make an application for shared residency? (I have shared residency for my daughter btw)

you see, the longer you accept this new change of circumsatances, the longer it will be seen to be accepted by you, you will have been deemed to have consented to it and there will be a new status quo in place. The courts and the whole family law system love status quo's.

Another thought occurred to me. As your DP has PR and there are no residence orders in place/non-molestation orders etc , he is perfectly free to collect the children from school/nursery. He is an equal legal parent as mum is. He would be advised to maybe have a chat with the nursery manager/school head beforehand, provide proof of PR and explain the situation. He should also pop into his local plod station and have a chat with the family liasion officer so his version of events is on record - should the ex make allegations of "kidnap" or abuse later on (which probably will happen - the accusations that is!)

I don't recommend solicitors, but it will be worthwile your DP making appointments with as many local family law solicitors as possible for a free initial 1/2 hour consultations to see what they say (try and find one who is a member of Resolution).

Better still, as others have said, join Families Need Fathers and get the best source of advice and support from them.

If this is going to go through the court system you need to be fully armed with what is ahead, preferably don't use a solicitor as they will bleed you of thousands, self-represent as a Litigant In Person with an experienced McKenzie friend (as I did).... now I help out other parents as a McKenzie friend myself and offer practical advie and support and litigation support.

good luck with everything, keep us informed

Twinklemegan, I would say that not turning up to take your son out for his birthday, when you've arranged to do so is a pretty clear indicator that you 'can't be bothered'.

Well what if he can't be bothered who picks up the pieces ?

That may be, but still it's the same old thing time and again. So easy to say, yet there are many fathers out there who certainly can be bothered if given a chance. Not that their ex's like to admit it.

Erm, I think the biggest hissy fit on this thread was the OP's OP.

Has anyone disputed that twinklemegan? Of course some dads are great, some are not. Some of us have offered an alternative view from experience, that's all.

I just don't get this "oh you've only got one side of the story" thing. Some of us have lived with partners who have gone through this - we know them, we know they are good men. We have experienced their x's behaviour, heard the conversations, been part of them. It's not hearsay, we're not being led to believe something that isn't true - sometimes it's fact.

And how can any of us really say whether women like this are few and far between or compare figures with the number of dads who aren't reliable or don't pay maintenance. Surely we only have our own experiences, friends and acquaintances to go on?

Was the OP saying that all mothers are cr*p to their ex's? No. It didn't stop you all jumping on her though, did it. And then even when she explained her position you were still all going at it. I've said it before and I'll say it again. Mumsnet is not a place to discuss any issues to do with "second families" (what a horrible term that is) as it is a rare Mumsnetter who will offer any sympathy at all. Sad, but true.

And my point was has ShyBaby given her ex any other option than one day a week? I'm not saying she hasn't, but she didn't say she had. From what I've seen, many mothers like to have their cake and eat it.

And many fathers want the good bits and not the day to day responsibilities ..out of site out of mind?

You're right Twinklemegan.

Many fathers are not given the chance to have the day to day responsibilities. This one will go round and round.

Think about it. Would any of you want your DH to plan your DC's birthday party? Take your DC to the doctors for you? Have your DC to stay when they're ill? If you answer yes, think very carefully if you're being truthful with yourself. Only if your answer really is Yes can you then berate your ex for not taking responsibility.

Sorry, DH there should have read ex of course.

Im sorry, are you addressing me twinklemegan? If so then you may have found my numerous threads over the last five years very interesting. I have already stated I dont think all fathers are complete idiots. Far from. I know a wonderful father who has brought up three children on his own, so dont presume you know how I think.

And yes sweetie, I gave my ex the option of seeing his son whenever he wanted to, he declined because he was too busy shagging.

Does that explain it more clearly?

I admit it goes round and round ..but maybe some mums would like their childrens dads to take the load sometimes? I just wonder when you see children let down time and again when you say enoughs enough ?

Addressing you where, ShyBaby? My last post referred to everyone, as I think was quite clear. No I haven't seen all your threads - I don't presume to know the personal history of every Mumsnetter, sorry. I was merely using your post as an example.

Random - it is a very difficult one. DH would have gladly taken some of the load but was cut out of his ex's new "family life" completely. As I said before, even down to the point of them calling the new husband "Dad".