To tell dd to just lie and call in sick over Xmas ?

[JustCallinSick]

Dd (26). AuDHD and MH struggles including ongoing eating disorder ,anxiety and OCD has been working for 5 years now.

She has never taken a day off sick. She has struggled in with viruses , on bad days , with severe period pain. She loves routine. Every year she has had to work Xmas. 6 hours xmas eve, all day Xmas day and 6 hours Boxing Day. She has never complained (but her boss is really not very nice).

This year (ages ago too!) she requested Xmas period off. This has been rejected and she’s so so upset. She has been feeling worse lately and has had to take more medication for MH and we paid for private therapy so she could go outside of work. We have family visiting this year from abroad and have a lot of plans she is looking forward to.

Her boss has told her that the priority is those with children not her.

Dd is so upset. I’ve calmed her down and told her to just call in sick. There’s nothing they can do and she’s never had a day off before so they can’t say a word. The alternative is battling it out with them . She has also started to look for a new job but she won’t just quit.

AIBU to have suggested this ? It just seems like the easiest option.

Can you get some legal advice on this.
I'm not an expert but it sounds as if they are not taking her mental health into consideration.. and it sounds as if she's been very hard working and committed as an employee and now it sounds like the way they treat her is causing severe anxiety. Six years of Christmas working on the trot... its not like Christmas is a surprise, they have a year to plan, but it sounds like they think she is an easy option.
They are pushing her towards quitting... could that be constructive dismissal. Either way, ACAS or some employment expert may have some suggestions on how to deal with this. It depends on the company set up I suppose and whether she would find a nicer employer.

Christmas is still a way off OP.

She doesn't need to take a decision on calling in sick (if that's really what she does) until closer to the time. I suspect if she has anxiety, knowing she is going to tell a lie will hang over her and make that anxiety worse.

Quite honestly, I'd go bigger picture and start looking for a new job. The whole environment sounds wrong for her.

@FancyBiscuitsLevel I think this is good advice. Take some sick leave now and think about how she wants to handle this situation - and I think that applying for new jobs would be a good idea. With five years' experience and her good track record, she'll be snapped up by a new employer. She could arrange to start after Christmas and leave her old job beforehand.

I’d tell her to go off sick at the beginning of December and get signed off for a month. So the mental health as the reason.

I think she is in a no-win situation. Having already requested and been refused Christmas leave, it is going to look very obvious if she is then off sick and I think she could end up with the confrontation she is desperate to avoid and probably losing her job anyway. Plus they would have to call someone else in at short notice which is unfair to the other employee.

If it were my daughter (and assuming she is living at home and you are happy to support her financially for a couple of months), I would be telling her to hand in her notice in mid-November (assuming she has a 4 week notice period) so she leaves in mid-December and has a short while to decompress before your family celebrations get underway.

She should start looking for another job now, and make it clear that she can't start until the New Year.

The current employer sounds dreadful and it's never going to get any better.

What's the sick pay situation? I'd consider getting her signed off for a few months. She sounds very close to complete burnout.

Totally irrelevant if they don't believe her. They can prove nothing.

She'll be leaving anyway, no need to stress her out further. She can just take sick time and find another job. Sorted.

Actually, yes, she does sound like she needs a bit more support than just some time off on holiday.

Some great advice on this thread @JustCallinSick

She needs your support, and yes she needs sick time from work, maybe a mental health break.

Do make it clear to her that these people don't give a damn about her and there is no point in her half killing herself to please them. Honestly, I wish I had gone at half speed my whole life, I always gave more than was required, there was never any real thanks, it did not benefit me at all, I wish I'd been much more "do what I have to do and no more".

Don't waste any more headspace on these ungrateful people. She's a commodity to them and they are not even being reciprocal about her efforts.

Please help her find another job and take whatever time off she needs.

Yes, she should call off sick. It is not a lie.

Her mental health is failing. She needs the time off. It is a true call off for illness.
She should not feel at all guilty.

This is discrimination. Holiday policy has to be fair and equal which usually means first requested first approved.

it does sound like she needs a break but she won’t get sick pay for very long and SSP is rubbish.

but either way this is discrimination.

I'd pull a sickie over this, I wouldn't even think about it.

My only concern in your case would be whether DD could pull it off, is she mentally robust enough?

This is a terrible idea. Never had any time off sick, then calls in sick at a time she has previously had a request for holiday turned down?

It's basically asking to be disciplined/sacked.

My 18 yo dd has AuDHD and ED op. They really are taking advantage of your dd’s goodwill. And of her inability to fight her corner due to ongoing mental health issues. And as mentioned, she’s covered under the EA for disability.

I understand that she’s an adult. However, I think I would be asking her if you can advocate on her behalf. My dd lets me compose difficult emails for her. I would happily continue to do this in future or a letter to help her out if needed. I get some people will think this is infantilising your dd. However, until she gets stronger, she’s going to struggle to do this alone.

Is she still with the private therapist. Maybe a couple of sessions with them would give her a way of tackling this. My dd talked to me and a counsellor when she had a difficult situation with a boy, who was being really unkind last year and harassing her to go out with him. It was really affecting her MH and she wanted to leave her studies over it. She then felt confident enough to talk to him and smooth things over.

Not read all 8 pages so apologies if this has been said already, but get her signed off a week before. It sounds like this situation has caused a lot of upset and stress. If she’s signed off with Work related stress for a few weeks she should hopefully still be paid an get to enjoy Christmas without worrying about lying to the company.

New job def but don't encourage her to lie. Sometimes we have to be resilient if she is an adult you must accept that too

YABU. Who would cover for her if she phoned in sick? Its a shitty thing to do to make someone else come in last minute who made plans with kids and family expecting to be off for the day. Great way to alienate herself from colleagues.

She needs to raise her concerns about fairness and suggest a rota for xmas day leave, eg, take it in turns each year or one person gets xmas, another gets new year, while someone else takes the week in between for example.

I would not suggest she gives up her job, as with five years of service she at least has some protections. Are they aware of her disability? Do they have an HR department? She needs to be looking at immediate self-care, documenting everything, and disability discrimination or reasonable adjustments.

she should just get signed off over Xmas, mental health struggles due to stress of work 😁

Never lie that you are sick. It's wrong and counterproductive if found out. The employee needs to check the contract or written company rules about booking holiday. It doesn't have to be an argument or confrontational to say to the boss I need that time off and I have booked it off on line with the procedure.

You have obviously never been actually involved in a disciplinary situation at work,it is not a judicial process there is no burden of proof in the same way- even if it goes to tribunal it is only quasi legal.

Is there a holiday policy? I’d start by referring to that.

Id absolutely be off sick in these circumstances- it won’t affect her applying for new jobs at all. One period of sick in 5 years - it would be classed as a brilliant sickness record!

Its a shitty thing to do to make someone else come in last minute who made plans with kids and family expecting to be off for the day. Great way to alienate herself from colleagues.

Yeah, the same colleagues who’ve probably seen her work Christmas the past six years while they partied with their families.

If she can financially afford to have a gap in employment, I would advise her to get signed off now if she genuinely is struggling and to hand her notice in to coincide with the start of/mid December.

Planning to leave or go off sick will cause her anxiety in the lead up.

If she is going to be looking for a role in the same field, she needs to be prepared to work next Christmas as I found new staff are usually rota’d on for their first Christmas. Also worth asking about Christmas and holiday allocation during the interview process.

You're like a petrified little mouse, squeaking.

There is nothing they can do to her. Nothing. Literally nothing. Not a thing. Zilch. Zero. Nothing whatsoever. Nobody can do a single thing to her for taking a couple of weeks of sick for the first time in years.

There will be no discplinary anything. There can't be. There is nothing wrong with taking sick time, no matter what time of the year it is, no matter whether they believe her or not.

And. She. Will. Be. Leaving. Any. Way.

Terrified of your own shadow.