To tell dd to just lie and call in sick over Xmas ?

[JustCallinSick]

Dd (26). AuDHD and MH struggles including ongoing eating disorder ,anxiety and OCD has been working for 5 years now.

She has never taken a day off sick. She has struggled in with viruses , on bad days , with severe period pain. She loves routine. Every year she has had to work Xmas. 6 hours xmas eve, all day Xmas day and 6 hours Boxing Day. She has never complained (but her boss is really not very nice).

This year (ages ago too!) she requested Xmas period off. This has been rejected and she’s so so upset. She has been feeling worse lately and has had to take more medication for MH and we paid for private therapy so she could go outside of work. We have family visiting this year from abroad and have a lot of plans she is looking forward to.

Her boss has told her that the priority is those with children not her.

Dd is so upset. I’ve calmed her down and told her to just call in sick. There’s nothing they can do and she’s never had a day off before so they can’t say a word. The alternative is battling it out with them . She has also started to look for a new job but she won’t just quit.

AIBU to have suggested this ? It just seems like the easiest option.

When I saw your thread I wondered if your daughter was like some of the entitled people I have worked with over the years. Seems she is far from it. This company ( or NHS?) don't deserve her loyalty. Can she afford to quit and take a break until after Christmas and then look for something else? She will probably have to work some notice (unless she gets signed off sick). She is being exploited in her current role. At 26 she has plenty of time to move up the career ladder if she wants to. Even if the management has to relent and give her Christmas off, the work environment will be toxic and not good for her mental health.

@JustCallinSick could you afford to help support her financially until she gets another job. I really think that for her MH she needs to get out of there asap.

What I'd do @JustCallinSick is if your daughter just can't face the confrontation... And it would make her unwell

She needs to see GP beginning of December... Perhaps first week... And get signed off fir at least a month with ASD burnout....

She would not be lying and their hands would be tied as a) it's genuine and b) they should be worried re disability discrimination case...

https://www.autism.org.uk/learn/knowledge-hub/professional-practice/autistic-burnout

Its not really relevent re audhd.?
They are taking advantage.
But i put yabu because its 3 days and if otherwise good job its not worth just not turning up because they will know.
But i think she needs to get in writing that they say they arent letting her off any xmas as other people have kids. And then complain.
However i do think its common for young people to take the new year time off and families take xmas however our work did close for Bh so not really the same.
Its a bit like would your dd choose to take 2 weeks holiday in the school summer holidays? Perhaps she could but f thefe was already a lot of presssure on those days?

Let her call in sick...I don't normally agree about doing this but her boss is actually showing predudice against her and perhaps knows she's non confrontational and so is using this to intimidate her. Si either get her signed off or call in sick.

I work in HR. There is some absolutely awful advice in this thread.

OP, I really wouldn’t advise calling in sick unless your daughter is prepared to risk a disciplinary process. HR absolutely can and will initiate disciplinary action if management reasonably believe there is foul play - for example where sick days fall on declined annual leave requests, around holidays or in patterns. It’s not as simple as ‘well they can’t prove you aren’t sick so there’ as some people are commenting.

Please also be aware that it’s standard practice now for new employers to ask how many sick days have been taken in the past 12 - 24 months and the reason why. If your daughter wants to start looking for a new job - which is sounds like she might! - I would bear that in mind before taking extensive sickness as some people are advising.

Also don’t call in sick for her(!) - besides the fact that most staff handbooks prohibit others calling in sick on your behalf except for genuine emergencies (e.g. hospitalisation), it really doesn’t look good if mummy is calling in sick for her like she’s a schoolgirl.

I agree this is absolutely unacceptable, but the most appropriate channel in the first instance would be to raise it with corporate through a grievance - not try to game the system which may backfire and cause her even more stress (which it doesn’t sound like she needs right now). If that doesn’t work then fine, consider calling in sick, but she needs to be informed as to the risks and have planned accordingly (e.g. if she quits / loses her job can she stay with you rent free)?

Good luck - as a childfree person I have the utmost sympathy for your daughter, she sounds like an absolute trooper and deserves to enjoy her holidays x

I'm usually against calling in sick when you are perfectly ok but she has worked more than her fair share of Christmases and giving parents priority is blatant discrimination. However, there's no point raising this as they likely couldn't care less.

They have clearly waited to see what everyone else wants to do before making a decision. They are using her reliability against her.

In this instance, I'd suggest she calls in sick citing diarrhea and vomiting, no restaurant will argue with that. Taking into account that she cannot return to work until she has been symptom free for 48 hours 😉 I'd call in on the 23rd, be very ill up to 27th then offer to return on 30th if she feels like it.

Can't you support her to tackle it properly by raising her concerns about fairness?

Telling her to take time off sick at Christmas when she's had a leave request refused isn't good advice imo. She'd be facing a disciplinary in the new year in lots of places, and I can't imagine that would be great for her mental health either.

She doesn't have to be confrontational about it. Help her to draft an ultra-reasonable email, setting out the fact that she has worked every Christmas for the last 5 years. Her mental health has deteriorated recently and she feels that she would benefit from having this time with her family. Offer to provide medical evidence and ask them to reconsider as a reasonable adjustment.

She'd still have the confrontation though, just on the 27th instead of now, as they'll know she was swinging the lead, having previously asked for it off and been refused. How good that would be for her anxiety I'm not sure. It's shitty, and he sounds like a crap boss, so he'd likely have her card marked afterward. She should look for another job and if she gets one between now and Xmas, then call in sick, because she wouldn't have to put up with the fallout afterward for very long.

As someone else mentioned, get a doctor to sign her off nearer the time, I would imagine this has all caused her alot of stress and anxiety and if she lies about a sickness she may just feel more anxious and worried and not actually enjoy the time off. Getting signed off for a week for mental health wouldn't be lying.

She's working in a restaurant, she'll be lucky if there is even an HR rep, so your post, while good advice for people who work full time in an office/retail/customer service environment, it's not for people who work as a waitress in a shitty restaurant who treat their staff like shit.

I wouldn't think twice about getting her signed off considering the reports around her mental heath.

Look, ignore all the “holier than thou” posters. She has been a reliable employee. They had the chance to give her the time off when she hasn’t had any for 6 years.

Christmas Eve - you ring up and say she’s really poorly with a vomiting and diarrhoea bug. You’ll keep them posted but it looks unlikely for tomorrow plus the guidance is 48 hours. So sorry bla bla.

If that affects her record then she can get ACAS involved.

Could she hand her notice in now, work her notice. Take Xmas and new year and look for a new job in the new year?

Also this!

Good point, I hadn’t seen OP’s post stating she works in a restaurant.

If it’s a small family-run business then fine but be prepared for some serious fallout when she gets back. If it’s a bigger chain e.g. Pizza Express then I’d still advise contacting Corporate. X

I think it would be a bad idea to call in sick. It would increase her stress and anxiety lying. She needs to start looking for a new job asap.

Honestly, get her to hand her notice in and look for a job in the new year.
Put her health first

She should ring in sick and not feel bad. It serves them right for being discriminatory. Probably not a good idea to try and persuade them as it will make it more obvious she isn't actually sick.

Actually would it be better for you to phone?

Cousin's son has AuDHD. Worked in a job he loved for 6 yrs, but was given constant night shift because he had to 'cover for men with families' so that they could get their holidays.

He didn't take his leave for 6 years. Asked again for a fairer shift pattern. It was refused.

He took all his leave at one time. Was told that he couldn't. "I can. I've checked."

He went job-hunting. Phoned his work 4 wks before his leave came to an end: "Take this as my 4 weeks notice."

He's now in a very similar job, but for a different firm.

The OP's daughter might not have any leave due her, but I'd take the advice that others have given and get signed off - then start job hunting.

As the manager is such an asshole, I’d agree to work it, not show up, and never show up again (quit)! Hopefully the managers Xmas will be ruined by the stress of having to find cover

I absolutely agree with this.

Almost everywhere I've ever worked, the custom has been that those who had leave over Christmas last year are last in line for Christmas leave this year.

I'd email him copying HR and say that if he doesn't grant her Christmas leave then he is to take the date of her email as day 1 of her notice period.

If its an independent place then chances are the manager is the owner and therefore is HR.

Ask me how I know......

Take Teo weeks off- week before self certification, week after sick note-work related stress

Please also be aware that it’s standard practice now for new employers to ask how many sick days have been taken in the past 12 - 24 months and the reason why. If your daughter wants to start looking for a new job - which is sounds like she might! - I would bear that in mind before taking extensive sickness as some people are advising.

If the sick days are due to a legally protected disability, which they will be (AuDHD burnout) then the employer cannot legally discriminate…..Right? Or do they discriminate anyway?