AIBU to question school using paid football club as punishment?

[Confusedschulmum]

I’d genuinely like other parents’ opinions on this because I’m trying to work out whether I’m being unreasonable.
My son is in Year 4 at a state primary school. He was disrespectful towards a teacher after he was trying to explain he didn’t do something and she didn’t want to listen.

I completely agree that there should be consequences for that. I’m not supporting him and he will also be punished at home .The school has told him he will lose his break, which I have absolutely no problem with at all tomorrow

However, he also attends a one-hour football club after school. I pay separately for this, and although it is organised through the school, it is run by an external provider.
Today, without informing us beforehand, the headteacher made him miss the first 15 minutes AND the last 15 minutes of the football session as an additional punishment and made him stand alone somewhere so he didn’t participate . No one was with him
.
My son was apparently told that I would be refunded,(I suspect as a brag to him ) although nothing was mentioned to us when he was collected. He was also told that if he does this again or repeats it , his place at the football club could be taken away and given to another child.

The refund isn’t really the issue for me. I don’t want the refund. I fully support the school disciplining him for poor behaviour and I’m not trying to excuse what he did.
What I’m uncomfortable with is a paid extracurricular activity, outside normal school hours and run by an external provider, being used as part of his punishment particularly when he is already receiving a school time consequence.

We’ve also had children at this school for around nine years and, as far as I’m aware, punishments have always taken place during school hours. I’ve never previously heard of them doing an after-school detention or using a paid club in this way.

I’m going to ask the headteacher for clarification, as obviously I’m hearing this from a 9 year-old and there may be more to it.

But before I do, I’d genuinely like other people’s opinions. Would you consider this a reasonable consequence, or would you also question the school using a separately paid-for after-school activity as punishment?

thank you

My youngest who is 18 so only 2 or 3 years ago was made to stand with her nose against the wall in view of the entire school after assembly for 20 minutes. For the horrific crime of a single extra earring which she couldn't get out in time.
For a child struggling with non diagnosed ND, anxiety, self harm and school refusal this literally made her suicidal. But for ajy child this would seem outdated and OTT. And before anyone says my DD was rude or defiant, she barely opened her mouth, cried if spoken to and her attendance slipped to 70%. But they didn't give a shit because she was still achieving A's. Ye some teachers are just mean and nasty with power they abuse.

So, my understanding is

The HT did not inform you that your child was going to be isolated, without your consent, outside of compulsory school time.

The HT did not share with you the location of your child during this time. The HT left your child to be unsupervised.

The HT prevented your child from attending a private activity that you had paid for in your child's/your own time.

Is this correct?

Thats just cruel.
I hope your DD is in a good place now.

I actually hadn't thought about the humiliation part of it.

What i had thought about was a wee kid who now doesn't know when the punishment is going to end.
2 punishments at football is mean. And verging on bullying.

Absolutely unacceptable. I would have been very, very angry at this.

Luckily I've never yet had to challenge my DC's school on any punishment. There have been a couple of incidents where I've been told DC 'hasn't made good choices' and some minor sanction has been imposed, but it's been told to me with a smile and kind word from the teacher that we all have bad days and hopefully things will go better tomorrow. These are the teachers who are loved and respected by the kids... the ones who get the message across but somehow manage to leave things on a positive note with no one feeling humiliated.

I think being separated and stood apart from your friends would be quite humiliating and frightening for a small child, especially if there's no adult with you. It's different from being taken to a separate room by an adult to calm down or being given something else to get on with because you've been acting out.

Yes

That’s horrible ☹️ gosh

Thanks all

ive decided to let it go just this one time as I mentioned previously he knew he was off the mark and he started acting a bit restless when my DH raised it with him . I do not want a refund . I h e said I want to send an email but DH has said I should let this slide

Apparently my son got picked for best student today in class 🙄maybe to encourage him or because the HT knew he had pushed it

my worry is the HT is new and started this September and in a totally different incident that happened two days ago. my son and another parent said a boy misbehaved in my sons class on Monday and the boy was given detention to miss the whole day next day and sit in another class ??? For the whole day ??I have only been made aware of missing breaks as detention but a whole day ??I hope the boy’s parents followed through

so I’m seeing a pattern with this new HT and just trying to let him know he can’t bully my child or take things personal . I am all for appropriate punishment

I would get the refund and I wouldn't let it go tbh. Your contract is with the provider, not the school. Your son was made to stamd somewhere alone for 2 x15 mins. I would ask them to explain how does that fit in with the school's and the provider's safeguarding.
I would make a fuss.

I have think the school have got this one wrong

To be honest I’m a bit miffed with DH for saying I should just let this slide but it’s ok . I don’t want them picking on him just because I’m trying to drag it through . Thank you 😊

Where I'm from, detentions happen after school so a natural consequence is to miss after school clubs.
But if the detention was at break time then giving him an additional punishment purely because he happened to be there after school hours is unfair.

I also think you should be told if the school makes a unilateral decision to take him out of the club he was meant to be in.

How is that repeatable to make sure expectations are understood & consequences are fair & consistent for all kids?

I'd take this as a sign they are making up their discipline procedure as they go along.

Missing afterschool clubs, or part thereof, is one thing if all/most of the children attend them and they are school run clubs.

That punishment wouldn’t happen if the child went to a football club elsewhere, and a child who doesn’t attend any afterschool club would have received one punishment instead of three. That’s where the issue is.

This head is a absolute arse.
Its a primary school not a flipping army camp.
I bet the teachers will hate him. Hes clearly trying to stamp his authority but he is coming across as an arse.

Actually he should hand the refund that he promised to your son.
Let the kid buy whatever with it.

I just can't decide if standing up to him will stop him bullying your son or encourage him?

I don't agree with Detention afterschool, kids need to get home, or to wherever they are meant to be.
How can a parent, or childminder with other kids to consider manage to deal with going back out to collect kids from school.

Is this a one off incident or is he often in trouble?

For a nine-year-old?

I think I would worry about how it came about. The headteacher became aware of apparent misbehaviour, but then how did the afterschool punishment come about? Either he was asking what the child was doing after school in relation to it, which seems strange, or he saw the child going to / at afterschool club and decided to go for it again with a second, and then third punishment?

Also aside from the fact that you believed the school had handed your child off to afterschool club, but then was not there. Presumably unsupervised or supervised by someone you were unaware of? Yeah… I would definitely be pretty vigilant after that.

This all seems rather extreme for a primary school.
Is the behaviour particularly bad? New headteacher trying to regain control/assert authority maybe?
What is the schools behaviour policy? You should be able to view it and see whether missing clubs is mentioned.

The issue isn’t actions/consequences, OP has that in hand. It’s whether they can deal consequences at a non school club. The answer is categorically no.

Reasonable if you are told in advance. Taking away an enjoyable activity is reasonable as a sanction.

I'd do that for adults and have denial of a passport so no holidays abroad for a period of time, instead of some fines.

This seems quite extreme and ill considered punishment if the story is accurate. It does make me wonder just how bad the child’s behaviour was to aggravate the head or make him believe that the first punishment alone was inadequate. I’d be inclined to have a very searching conversation with my child before speaking to the head teacher.

If the child is incredibly cheeky and unrepentant then the head teacher may be doing him a favour by coming down on him like a ton of bricks.

Whatever I might say to the head teacher face to face, my child would be none the wiser and be left in no doubt that I backed the school and that he better behave better in future.

I think if this club is indeed nothing to do with the school except that they use its premises I would be inclined to remove my child from it myself unless I needed to use it for after school childcare and send him to another football club elsewhere. You entrusted them with your 9 year old and they let someone else dictate what happened to him on their watch.