To be glad triple lock going and hope they means test it too

[Randomamsi]

I have a multi millionaire senior relative who receives £1,400 from the state pension each month, in addition to 6k private pension.

He's not means tested and he's received that for 30 years. Yes, he paid into the system but he does not need it!!! He also had free uni, dirt cheap first house back in the 60s and retired aged 59.

Meanwhile the younger generation:

• thousands in student loan debt
• asset poor as can't get on the housing ladder
• means tested for child benefit, tax free childcare etc
• working until late 60s/ 70s

Why do pensioners have it easy while younger ones pay the price?

For vulnerable pensioners at risk of poverty, there should obviously be provision to help them, I'm not suggesting we let people starve. But multimillionaire pensioners or very asset rich pensioners do NOT need the state pension. It's about time things changed.

I think the triple lock should be scrapped. But means testing the state pension will surely encourage lots of people to not contribute to their workplace pension?

I think you’ll find the private sector was subject to pay freezes too. But that’s what happens when your employer is skint.

I don’t need it either but I’ve factored it into my retirement plans. Will be travelling the world and my 30 years of NI contributions will contribute to the occasional hotel room. As far as I’m aware, this contribution based, non means tested model is fairly standard in most Western European nations. Bear in mind, older people vote in greater numbers than any other demographic so it’s unlikely this will change any time soon and certainly not without about 25 years notice of any change.

It may have been said already, but nobody 'pays in' to anything. Current taxpayers pay current pensions - that's all. You are categorically NOT paying into a pension scheme so if the government of the day decides to change the rules, there's nothing you can do about it as there's no obligation for the government to pay us anything as a pension. This myth that we're all paying into a pension scheme needs to end.

Those of us in our 50s didn’t have affordable housing, it crippled us to save for a deposit. We didn’t spend years frittering money on tech, holidays, nails, endless hauls, clothes we don’t need, renos, seasonal crap…. we went without. Our children don’t have free education, we had no warning and suddenly had to fund uni for our children and as for having a functional NHS for most of my life I’m only over halfway through and having to pay privately not just for me but our children and also care for our parents too!

Sounds very much like that sort of pension is military

@opbecause quite simply people like me and your relative, that you so resent, have paid IN to the system. I've been working over 40 years. I dont diddle the tax man, never have. I'm not in my 20s with imaginary mental health issues (newspaper reports); I'm not in my 30s, never having worked and now claiming benefits (neighbours son), I'm not in my 50s and now regretting that I didn't, or couldnt be bothered, to pay into pension, so can i claim UC on health grounds (my sibling I'm sorting out their estate) etc. I just paid in, month after month, tax and NI. Am I the mug? Enough. People like me who have paid IN are not going to tolerate you and others like you attempting to adjust what we receive as we age.

The only people retireing comfortably will be those on public sector pensions. Yes they’re not as generous as they were but they’re still crazily generous compared to a dc equivalent.

Can't believe it to took so long for someone to point all this out, thankyou @BorgQueen . Your relative a) paid more into his state pension under SERPS which is why he gets a larger amount than average now and b) pays more in tax than he receives in state pension.

The state pension can't become means tested, to replace the state pension you'd need a pot of ~£300K (assume 4% drawdown) which is more than double the average private pension pot in this country. Since the bulk of the pensions bill is for public sector workers who would still need to be paid their DB pensions it would massively disincentivise people in the private sector from saving for a pension, making the situation worse as more old people move into poverty. Productivity will drop as people who have private pensions take early retirement to spend their pension savings before they hit state retirement age so the government doesn't punish them for saving.

You know that he will pay tax on that? No NI, but with an income of around £84k, he'll be taxed at 40% above around £48k a year.

Income tax is the most proportionate way of "means-testing" everyone.

SP is taxable so he will be paying higher rate tax along the way. People paid into the scheme on the understanding that they would be entitled to a pension in the fullness of time. We have one of the least generous pensions in the EU. Why this animosity? We're all shuffling along the same path.

Telegraph gifted article re state pension
it is absolutely possible for pensioners to receive £1400 per month. The above article references a handful of pensioners who receive £40k plus a year!

I don’t mind doing away with the triple lock and keeping it linked to either RPI or CPI. But no I cannot agree with means testing. I have been planning my retirement based on receiving a full state pension. It’s not my only pension but I have been checking my contributions and making sure I am fully paid up. I don’t think the rules can suddenly be changed whereby you don’t get the full amount. It would be totally unfair and effectively a breach of contract.

Whilst I get what you are saying I know plenty of mainly women who have paid very very little into the system over the years but get state pension because they got credits for many years for childcare, and then a bit of part time where they paid a tiny bit of NI but enough to give them the years credit - same with unemployed men - absolutely no way did they pay anything into the system like they are getting out if it if they live an average length of time, in fact not many people have and NI isn’t a pension fund saving scheme, it was always traditionally thought of as money towards pension and health and in more recent years is just another tax -I think that’s the issue , it’s how it was perceived, the reality is it was always paying for the pensioners of today and to allow you at some point to access the scheme, , not squirrelled away for ‘your ‘ pension , which is why I prefer country’s being more upfront and charging an integrated tax rate .

If you’re in your 50s and retired then you’re not poor and please do not plead poverty here.
i am in my 40s. Got uni free. Scrimped and saved but did get on the property ladder.
not getting your nails done isn’t going to get you a house on one income in your twenties any more. Face facts

Completely unreasonable! I started work at 16, not the 22 + that your generation maybe start at! I worked all my life until I retired and paid into the system. I never claimed a penny in other benefits and now your generation begrudge me having a pension!

If pensions aren't benefits, what are they? Are they debts we have to pay each month? I'm pretty sure lumps of money regularly given to us are benefits.

The way I see it. From our 20s we have saved heavily for our private pensions. Others had trappings of wealth, but we saved. For a few years I topped up my NI for credits for my state pension.. why should we have state pension removed when we were careful with our money and saved for retirement, whereas those who spent the money get the full state pension. Now if you had said remove tax relief at 40% on pensions and make it 25% across the board- I would heartily agree.

• thousands in student loan debt...then dont get a degree they are poinless anyway as everyone has one
• asset poor as can't get on the housing ladder...then save for a mortgage we all had to do it when we were young but people now want it all and dont want to save
• means tested for child benefit, tax free childcare etc...absolutely you cant keep pushing out kids and expect the state to pay
• working until late 60s/ 70s ..Yes i agree with you on this one

Scrapping the triple lock effects gen X more than the boomers, so ha ha ha.

Me too
and if it becomes means tested I will blow every single penny of my pension pot before retirement
never claimed tax credits, childcare subsidies, free school meals, unemployment benefits.
I will enjoy the next 10 years making sure I do not have any means to be tested

Do you know why he gets double the pension every one else gets?

Plenty of us in our 30s are feeling all those things too, saving for deposit was crippling, our education was expensive, our children's education will be even more expensive, also have NHS issues, etc etc. I've certainly not been buying clothing "hauls", I haven't had my nails done since I got married and my car is nearly 30 years old. we're not all terminally online or keeping up appearances. It's hard not to be resentful of people 20 odd years older than us who'll actually get a state pension...

As far as free education is concerned, only 10% of 18 year-olds went on to higher education when I did in the mid-60s. I was in the first cohort to know I would get a (mean-tested) maintenance grant if I did well enough to get a university place. Before then there were only a limited number of competitive county scholarships for state school students. I grew up in a working-class family and was the first to go to university, my parents having only had elementary education.

What’s unfair is that the pension contributions we are making today is what is finding current retirees; by the time we retire there will be nothing left. And those who won’t be able to claim (means testing) will be those who paid the most in. So yes, the sustem
sucks, but don’t blame those who are claiming what they are entitled to