Maintenance and extra's

[ConflictedDad]

Hi,

Not a mum, but believe in getting a broad perspective on pretty much everything (I do this with politics, health, work, etc lol).

I have a bit of a pickle, and would welcome your insight!

Divorced from ex-wife, now a little over 9 years ago. 3 kids:

Child1 has autism (undiagnosed), and receives Dla, he's going into year 11 next week.
2 other Children on spectrum too, but no benefits/diagnosis (Child2+3 are both 13)

I work full time, pay rent privately and look after my house. I have kids roughly 45% of the time - working out at around 170 nights a year, but also take on much of the admin load (appointments, forms, school stuff, etc)

I pay £350 maintenance a month (Private agreement, not CMS mandated), and also contribute 50/50 towards extra costs - trips, uniforms, hair cuts, glasses if they're over the voucher level, etc)

Ex receives Cb, UC and PIP. She'll also get the disabled child element of UC from my understanding.

I'm at a point where i'm unable to continue funding 50/50 of the 'extras' on top of the maintenance, rents have all gone up (£1,100 where I live now) as well as everything else, as we all know.

Would I be unreasonable to tell my ex that i'm unable to continue with this arrangement? We get along well, and are usually happy to help each other out if things come up (DIY stuff, or if i have to work until later etc) and I don't want to upset things, however I don't feel this is sustainable for me financially and believe that this should be covered comfortably by maintenance and child benefit?

Mods, if you feel this is better in a different category, please feel free to move it!

The mother may well have a larger inome.

Not always.

If you’ve got shoes and winter coats and uniform, that would likely be a lot of recent spending for three children.
Could you have an honest conversation with Ex and say that now school essentials are covered, you need to economise as your rent has gone up and agree a cap on extras for Sept/Oct as not much should be needed? Maybe new glasses need to be within voucher cost, maybe fewer cinema trips?. Be clear that you don’t want the kids to miss out but your income is finite and not limitless. Families still together are having to tighten their belts - and you have the same COL pressures.

He has them around 40% of the time.

If you genuinely can’t afford it, then you need to sit down and work out an amount that you can afford and explain to your ex what’s going on.
Who is choosing the items when purchasing the things you are paying 50%?
You don’t want your children to miss out but equally many families can’t afford for their children to head out on every trip offered, treat days.
They go for glasses that don’t go over the voucher amount, during activities week they go for a mid range activity rather than the expensive one, clothes are brought in the sales etc.
It seems a little odd that you have your children 45% of the time and yet by the sound of it you have allowed your ex to keep the full amount of everything she claims ie the eldest’s DLA (unless it goes to the child directly) child benefit etc
My friend is in a similar situation and when they split they decided they would each claim for one child rather than one person claiming for both and the support given for their SEN child was split according to the time at each parents house etc

The extra's aren't typically much tbh. School shoes, coats from time to time, hair cuts about average, no extracurricular activities as the kids aren't interested in them, I'm just a little confused as to what her extra costs are, above my own costs if that makes sense?

I don't want my kids to lose out, but I also don't believe that I should be funding their household at a direct loss to my own (meaning that I can't do things with the kids, so they lose out here) if it's not going specifically towards the kids. Perhaps asking her to outline what extra costs she has would be helpful?

45% I work it out to be.

I'm not sure you read the opening message tbh.

I do the vast majority of the appointments. I'm not sure why I should be paying for uniforms etc? what is maintenance for?

Thank you for your POV, it's really appreciated.

I don't think she has the legal authority to refuse 50/50, there are no court orders in place etc so we have completely equal rights.

The rest of what you said however is very reasonable I think, but.. Maintenance isn't supposed to be for food etc is it? Isn't the responsibility for feeding them hers? After all, when they're at my house, the responsibility is mine and I have to find a way to make it work.

From what I gather, their household receives around £3.5k per month

Maintenance is for anything your ex decides it’s for, you don’t get a say in this. If she wants to spend it on herself she can. It’s part and parcel of separating. There’s no approved list dictating what the RP spends CM on, and rightly so for obvious reasons. Provided you have no evidence of neglect or abuse and your DC are catered for, it doesn’t really matter what this gets spent on. Probably bills, food and clothes for your kids.

Have a conversation with her and explain how difficult you’re finding things financially. Offer to take the children more if that helps but that CM will be removed if you do go up to 50:50. Maybe they could have clothes and uniform at each house to save the argument of splitting extra costs- both of you become responsible for clothing in your own homes.

I don't think that's entirely fair. I routinely have to tell my kids that I cannot afford to go and do things with them, it's not my responsibility to entirely fund their activities - especially when they're with their mum and she is paid benefits for them.

I'm honest with my kids when I cannot afford something.

You picked up on the labor aspect of my post, not the expense aspect. Maintenance offsets expenses for the extra time. You are supposed to cover the costs while under your care.

Presumably with 45%, the children need uniforms and other things while under your care. That means you need to buy uniforms to keep in your home. if your ex buys them for you, you need to reimburse her.

Why do you do the vast majority of appointments if you both have them in the week? What appointments are you really talking about here?

Hang on a sec, some napkin maths here.

maintenance offsets extra expenses.

(350x12)/37

37 is the nights more than me that she has them.

thats £113 a night. Kids do not cost £113 a night. So what do you mean by “extra expenses” if that’s not things like clothes, shoes, school supplies etc?

I’ve always done the vast majority of appointments since the kids were very little. I arrange 90%+ of them, attend them etc.

medical, opticians, school etc

I think you need to explain to her the financial struggle you’re under and If she’ll discuss the extras/the children’s outgoings when she has them, you can come up with something that means you can afford to live and she also has enough to do the things she needs to do for them whilst she is has them.
If she isn’t working because of the children perhaps offering a set pattern of contact/an extra evening with you would enable her to look at returning to work?

The maintenance pays for all sorts of things including food but also clothes, haircuts, etc.

If you have them 45% of the time do you buy separate clothes for them there or does it work out roughly the same over the year?

I’m not trying to catch you out I’m just wondering what are the extras your paying for?

In our case uniform is split because they’ll use it at both houses. Glasses and contacts the same. I tend to buy clothes just because I’m more available than my ex to take them to the shops / trawl through vinted.

If something is used at both homes we tend to split it up to a certain cost and then we would have a discussion about it. For example DS has tutoring once a week but we discussed that between us before committing to it as we would view it as a joint cost.

Would your ex be open to a conversation about money and what exactly you’ll pay half of?

Thank you.

"The maintenance pays for all sorts of things including food but also clothes, haircuts, etc."

This is kind of my point, the maintenance should be more than enough to cover this over the period of a year? I have my kids for enough time to know what expenses having them incurs so I would have thought the costs Other than clothes, glasses, etc would be similar to my own?

This is why I'm so confused as to what is reasonable or not, there's no list as to what it should be spent on when realistically, it should be enough to cover these needs imo

These figures are based on:
Single person aged 25+: £424.90
3 children: £303.94 each = £911.82
Disabled child lower addition: £164.79 OR
Disabled child higher addition: £514.71
Carer's element: £209.34

not including rent from universal credit alone she would get £1710.85 and £2060.77

she will also get:
£350 child maintenance
£272.35 child benefit every 4 weeks
DLA anything from £121.20 - £778.40 every 4 weeks
Pip is £306.80 - £778.40 every 4 weeks

assuming the lowest possible income she gets a total of: £2761.20 per month to pay for her bills her kids herself her food and on top of that rent and council tax will be paid for.

I think having your children only 55% of the time also them being in school full time and recieving almost £3k a month at a minimum and not having to pay rent.. well she's doing alright TBF.

She's not single, lives with a partner

But otherwise, yeah, I worked it out at around £3.5k a month, which is substantially more than my take home pay (even before maintenance is taken out)

To be clear, my issue isn't how much they receive, it's if my contribution is already reasonable enough that I shouldn't also be paying for the extra's such as school uniform etc. I imagine this question gets asked every summer on here

oh if she lives with someone her money would reduce by their income quite significantly so she may not actually get as much as you think. Who knows but either way I think 50/50 and no maintenance seems to be the best option

For those saying i'm a high earner, my salary is £36,000. This is the CMS calculation that we used with the following selections:

No other children in my household
£36,000 annual salary
My more than 3 nights a week but less than half the time
Don't pay to other parents (I don't have any other children)

It’s certainly a grey area as to what maintenance should cover and I guess it’s between parents to decide.

I do think she’s a little foolish though to rely on it to top up her household income as it will end at some point.

I hope you are able to get resolution and I’m sorry if my previous comment about moving to 50/50 was snappy.

He doesnt work, probably her carer but not sure. I know he used to work up until about a year ago

Of course it works both ways. You are also not giving much money to your 3 children either. What does your ex wife say she needs? What do you need to pay all your way plus your living expenses plus food. You are not expected to have much of a social life as is she.
Sit down with her to work it out - you wont get much from here

PS You ARE paying the minimum. You said that in your first post