Reform want to cut PIP

[Daygloboo]

Reform want to cut benefits for disabled people. They want businesses to pay more towards sickness etc. I find it repulsive that they want to do this. When will people understand that they are a bunch of self interested sharks who want to make a stack of dosh for themselves while in govt and that they font give a damn about anyone in need. Why cant the most vulnerable ppl who vote for them see thus. It's astonishing. It's ac joke. I eish ppl who get what Reform.iscreally about and how it manipulates would make sn extra effort to tslk to.ppl who dont seem to get it.

Many people who have PIP work. PIP is not an out of work benefit. It replaced DLA, which was first brought in my John Major's Conservatives to lower NHS and social care costs by giving money directly to disabled people instead. Billed at the time as allowing them to choose their preferred providers instead of going via the public sector.

You cannot remove PIP without substantial investment in social care and the NHS for people with chronic conditions. You need to have more regular physio available, you need to have council-organsied cleaning services and meal delivery services, you need to have a vast array of regular mental health and counselling therapies available. Not just for short term acute need, but for longer term/ permanent conditions.

If you do not have that in places, you will negatively impact 100,000s even millions of disabled people currently working or studying and actively contributing to society. Often worsening their conditions to a point where they cease to become manageable (without severe financial hardship) meaning they will have shorter, more miserable lives, and be less likely to remain painfully employed.

The reason this has not been done over the last 30+ years is because it is more expensive and will take a substantial amount of time to put in place.

What many people pushing an anti-disabled narrative want is to just stop funding anything - knowing full well the human cost that will have.

On the contrary, the assessment for ADHD is robust. I'm tired of hearing that it's a mild condition. It can be lethal and it's extremely debilitating. When I hear people talk about it as if it's akin to veruccas, I imagine that their thinking must be terribly old fashioned; that they don't realise understanding has greatly moved on since it was thought that ADHD is about children being "naughty". There's no excuse for ignorance, particularly when making value judgements about other people.

I'm not saying all people with MH issues are lying. I'm saying if a person wanted to fakr a claim they would choose a disorder that has no objective test like ADHD or MH issues. Don't you find it strange that the numbers of claims for conditions like ADHD and Anxiety are so much higher than the rest of Europe? I'm sure there are many with genuine claims but I don't believe all claims for these disorders are genuine.

But you lose the ability to work long before you become severely disabled. Moderate disability is enough to stop most people from being able to earn any sort of living and yet they still have significant costs associated with their disability not to mention still needing to eat and pay their bills. I know half a dozen moderately disabled people personally and most are unable to work at all - one does some very low paid work occasionally. I know of a few dozen more who are friends, family or acquaintances of my own friends, family and acquaintances etc. and they are in much the same position. They have been disabled by things like strokes, cancer, car crashes, ME/CFS, long COVID, schizophrenia, bipolar, PTSD etc.

As pp says, not clicking on iffy links, but from the BMW website

Exactly.

No system is ever perfect and if a proper expert review concluded things could be improved then fine.

But not this rubbish based on prejudice and ignorance.

https://www.motaclarity.co.uk/bmw-motability-cars

The assessment of ADHD has no objective test. They ask parents to fill in a questionnaire, if DC is school aged ask school to fill one in too. They ask parents to give examples of incidents and behaviours of their DC. I know because I have 2 adults DC with ADHD both diagnosed as DC by Lead Psychiatrist of Birmingham Children's hospital many years ago. Both were on Ritalin medication for yesrs. my ds's are adults now and still have their issues, one is more affected than the other, but neither claim PIP. One is affected quite badly and is very impulsive and poor with his money still, the other has learned to plan for impulses.

I have used my work computer to open this to save mine, so you are confirming what we already knew that BMW are not available on motabilty.

But the PIP assessment does rely on objective tests and evidence. Someone claiming for something like ADHD which is a lifelong condition will be expected to answer questions on whether they attended main stream schooling, whether they went on to college or university and obtained qualifications, whether they were eligible for any sort of extra help if they did and if they completely these qualifications in the standard time frame. They may be asked if they manage their own finances or if someone else has had to become their power of attorney etc (no legal provision will be taken to mean they are functioning at the level of a typical person). If they have children, pets, can drive etc these facts can be used against them to argue that they are basically functioning at the same level as a typical non-disabled person and do not qualify for support. They can ultimately deny people enough points to qualify through all and any evidence of living a normal life.

Looks confusing to me.

What has your work computer got to do with it?

No BMWs on motability. You just have to check their website to see that. Disabled people must not get ideas above their station and start to believe they are normal.

That link confirms BMW models aren't available.

Also, I'm not sure you're aware how motability actually works. The weekly payment for a vehicle is capped at the amount of the enhanced mobility amount of PIP which is £80 a week.

That is why when you select a car through motability, you may have to pay an advance payment which is essentially the difference between the car's value and the amount that PIP will cover over the three year term.

So anyone getting a higher cost vehicle through motability will have paid the value difference themselves.

DS2 has ADHD (among several other diagnoses including an LLI). His ADHD assessment was in-depth and included the QB test. The QB test is considered to be an objective test by HCPs. For his PIP, I sent over 300 pages of evidence.

It's not confusing at all. Every BMW model says "This model is currently not available to order on the Motability scheme."

What do you find confusing?

How old is your son, what do you need the PIP for that other parents don't have to find the money for?

Frequently Asked Questions

• + How Do I Know If I Qualify For A BMW Motability Car?The Motability Scheme helps people with a disability stay mobile by exchanging their Mobility Allowance for a brand new car or Wheelchair Accessible Vehicle (WAV). To qualify for a new BMW through the Motability Scheme, you need to currently benefit from one of the following government funded Mobility Allowances:
• The Higher Rate Mobility Component of the Disability Living Allowance - £80.00 a week
• The Enhanced Rate of the Mobility Component of the Personal Independence Payment - £80.00 a week

But yet none of the BMW models are available.

Can you think why that is?

Also, when BMWs were available, are you under the impression that PIP was paying for them in full?

Don't you find it strange that the numbers of claims for conditions like ADHD and Anxiety are so much higher than the rest of Europe?

You repeatedly claim this but what are you basing it on?

"Many years ago" might be the most pertinent point here.

I have 3 teen DSs who receive disability benefits, the extra costs we face because they are disabled include things such as:

• Higher electricity costs - medical equipment (feed pumps, seating, bed, rise and fall bath, changing table, nebs, hoist, through floor lift, etc.). DS1&3 have EOTAS/EOTIS, some of which is delivered from home so some days they are both home with up to 4 extra staff when others their age would be in school with no staff at home, DS1 has carers at home so sometimes there are 2 extra people in the house using electricity.
• Higher gas costs - we need the heating on higher and longer for DSs’ medical conditions and DS1’s reduced mobility. Because DS1&3 are at home more during the day, the heating needs to be on more than if they attended schools - both for their needs and because there are other people working in the house.
• Higher water costs - DS1’s clothes/bedding etc. need changing more than the average person. This is more than a bit of extra washing. His specialist bath uses more water than many conventional baths. He also needs washing more. With carers and education staff in the house, there are more people using our water.
• Higher food costs - for medical reasons.
• Higher clothing costs - sensory needs and DSs wear through clothes more quickly.
• Motability - the AP and adaptations. DS1’s current vehicle cost over £15k. That is on top of the monthly amount.
• Car parking charges and fuel costs - we have to drive places we would otherwise walk. Not all car parks offer free blue badge parking. More hospital trips.
• Equipment - Not everything is funded. We are lucky we have had a lot of charity grant funding for equipment that isn’t funded. For things such as SN car seat, SN buggies, bike trailer, specialist seating and some other equipment, but not everything is funded or has charity funding available. From the little things such as slider mitts, incontinence swim products, topping up the incontinence products provided because the NHS supplies aren’t enough even though we get a lot more than many to bigger expenses such as topping up the funding to have a H-frame hoist because only a single track hoist would be funded even though the OT recognised a H-frame would be better and was really needed. Not to mention all the things we buy in the hope they will help but don’t.
• Costs associated with hospital admissions.
• Medical assessments and treatment - assessment and medication for DS2. The medication has now been taken over by the NHS, thankfully.
• Pre-action letters to hold the LA and ICB to account. I can write my own, but my LA laughs and says good luck finding someone with a legal aid contract to take it further.
• Independent assessments for EHCP purposes to hold the LA to account - although the LA contributed to these costs with the settlements from previous complaints.

These are just some examples of the additional costs, I could could continue.

How crass. Why would that be any of your business? Is it only online that you don't understand how to behave appropriately or do you carry that through to your everyday life?

Are you saying a person can't lie about if they need help to manage their finances? They can say a family member help them to budget. Both my DS's had what was known at the time as a Statement of Special Needs. Now it's called an EHCP. Much of what was in the Statement of Special Needs was what I had told the Ed Psych. My son's IQ's were normal. They were medicated to help them to focus at school/college. I don't consider a report based on the content of a parental questionnaire objective evidence.

Much of what was in the Statement of Special Needs was what I had told the Ed Psych.

Then they were incredibly poor SSEN.

I have no idea how they were paid for but Motobility was involved, according to the links.