AIBU to feel uncomfortable with a male cleaner in women’s toilets while they are operational?

[Brood]

There’s a restaurant slash service station that I regularly stop at on the way home from work. For the last several months, there has been a male cleaner servicing the women’s bathroom. I raised it with management that during late hours women are often alone in the bathroom with this man who has likely not been police cleared and has access to women only spaces. They then put a sign up to say that the bathroom is serviced by male and female cleaners.

The other day I was in there when the bathroom was very busy. This male “cleaner” was marching in and out of the bathroom entering cubicles opening toilet roll holders that were half full. I waited for as long as possible for him to be finished but after 40 minutes he was still walking in and out. I went into the cubicle as far away as possible from the cubicles he was servicing. Within seconds, he started to stick the sweeping brush under the door and into my cubicle. This was terrifying.

When I came out there was a queue to use the sink and he was standing watching women wash their hand, then he started approaching women and showing them how to use the tap. I gave him daggers to in the mirror and he met my eyes and watched me the whole time. He did not appear to need to be there and instead seemed to be lingering

Am I being unreasonable for feeling uncomfortable in this situation? Usually when bathrooms are being serviced, they are closed to the public for a short time. This is the third time I have gone in there and found a male cleaner in the bathroom constantly.

There doesn’t appear to be a need for him to be there so excessively as I checked the cubicles and every toilet roll holder had at least one full roll and I’m not sure women need his help to use the sink or that the floor needs to be swept so much, especially when someone is in the cubicle

I left a bad review for the business but I feel like my complaints are falling on deaf ears. This is the only place en route home for miles but I’m more annoyed that women should have to put up with this in the first place and have no peace and are being stared at and intimidated by a man even while using the women’s bathroom - which I feel should be a women only space

What would you do?

Are you having fun this evening? 😂

I can't understand the mentality of someone who hangs around for 40 minutes waiting to use the toilet. Either you want to go or you don't.

Now you’re gaslighting.

Honestly just stop. This is beyond irrational and if you actually believe this, and it isn't just rage bait or attention seeking, please talk to someone about this because you are obsessed to the point of lying to people on mumsnet about it. I'm not going to engage with you anymore because I honestly believe you want this reaction and will challenge anyone who doesn't immediately say "oh terrible pervert men in the toilets". You need to stop. You know nothing about this man (he could have a husband at home), his life or intentions and for all you know he has been thoroughly vetted for his job. Both male and female cleaners at my work, our local beach and the charity shop I volunteer at are CRB checked so there is every chance he has been. Let it go.
Edit: missing words again

You sound very precious
When should toilets be cleaned
Can't always be cleaned first thing
Other areas need cleaned too
You would probably be whinging if you were busting for the loo and it was closed for cleaning

There is nothing illegal about a male cleaner in female toilets and I can’t believe you have suggested there is. My work place uses male and female cleaners, and the maintenance workers tend to be male. They put a sign up to say when men are working in there.

Maybe he has spotted you hanging around so much. The fact you hung around for 40 mins to use the loos is unusual.

I cannot believe you genuinely think one of those loo rolls would last a week. It shows how absolutely clueless you are about what is needed in these loos. I imagine they’d consider it lucky if it lasts a day! The cleaners need to check every cubicle and how much is left in each holder every time. Often if a roll is below a certain level it will need changing. The cleaner will check them all to count how many rolls they need to collect. You’d actually have something to complain about if he weren’t restocking them. I used to do the cleaning in our pub. The loos had those humongous rolls of paper. I would have often changed it in the morning and then during the evening I’d have someone let me know it needed refilling again.

Were the toilets clean? If all the were doing was perving on women, the toilets would be a state. If they were clean it suggests he was doing his job.

It may be that he’s creepy - but honestly, I think you’ve taken exception to the fact a man is cleaning the toilets when women are in there and you’re looking for reasons to complain.

Tbh, I wouldn't like this either.

We had a male cleaner where I used to work, and he would follow women into the toilets. Me and my friend went together, and I put my steel capped boot against the door whilst she used the loo. He was trying to force the door open, but I held it shut with my boot, calling out that the toilets were occupied. He kept pushing, but eventually gave up.

When I had to go alone on other occasions, he would follow me in and push the mop under the cubicle door when I was in there. I found it quite intimidating. I put in a complaint. It turned out that 14 other women had also put in complaints. He was eventually sacked.

I do feel on edge when male cleaners are in the women's spaces. The cleaners were always female in the women's toilets years ago

@ilovesooty I was thinking this as well. Who has a spare 40 minutes to hang around a service station toilet.
i think she should invest in a Shewee!

The cleaners were always female in the women's toilets years ago

That’s why we had chambermaids taking out the chamber pots. Were no chambermen back then unless you were the King.

I don’t really want to go back to the days where certain jobs were too lowly for men to do.

This

it is very weird that he was showing women how to use taps 😳

FFS grow up.

He's mopping the floor outside of your cubical, not sat in with you.

Just when you think you’ve read it all on MN there is something else that makes you think ‘really? Is this person for real???’

Out of curiosity, I looked to see if you have a posting history to see if you were a genuine poster. From your pushing history, you appear to have a traumatic past with men - I can’t help but wonder if you have PTSD from this which may be why you feel uncomfortable. You mentioned having therapy, perhaps it would be worth talking this through with your therapist as well?

When I need a wee, I go in, look for an empty cubicle, wee, wash my hands and leave. I spend very little time watching the cleaning staff or other users and I genuinely don't care what gender the cleaner is, as long as the loos are being cleaned.
I'm hearing that you're getting uncomfortable vibes from this chap, but surely that's all the more reason to get on with the wee and leave, rather than hang around? If you're really feeling bothered, you could try talking to him - "I always seem to see you in here, and it's making me a bit uncomfortable as I don't like to wee with a man outside the cubicle - are you not cleaning the rest of the building?"

It's not really about a job being too lowly for men to do. It's about the male cleaners cleaning the male toilets, and the female cleaners cleaning the female spaces

Use the disabled toilet (if anyone asks say invisible disability)

I’m actually surprised at how many disagree with you. I had an experience of a male cleaner in a loo yesterday, that made me feel uncomfortable too. It was in a nice hotel and the loo was all dark wood, dim lighting. The man was charging about loudly changing bins etc and I was a bit taken aback when I came in, but just went ahead and did my pee, flushed and came out. I wished I’d just found another loo. To give him credit I saw he’d propped open the door to the outside which I was pleased about, but he was still charging about and went straight into the loo I’d just came out of, and flushed it again, even though I’d flushed and didnt leave anything behind!

Anyway, I don’t like men in loos or changing rooms with me. IDGAF if anyone wants to call me dramatic, hysterical or whatever else people are calling you. I don’t like it and neither do you, I’m happy for those that don’t care. I’d try to avoid using that place if you can.

Stop harassing the cleaner OP.

Just imagine, a service station who employs staff who presumably are working alone a lot of time, might struggle to recruit a woman who wants to do that job on a late shift. But you think some women should be forced to take the job so you can feel better? What do you think the cleaner is going to do exactly - given that if they were to break any rules, they're very easily identifiable, you know because the employer knows where they are, their full name address and identifying details?

They're just earning a living, doing a job most people don't want to do. Have some respect.

The most pathetic genre of reply available

Your last line should be pinned at the top of all threads, I despair that "trust your gut" is used here as if it's the be all and end all

If you can wait 40 minutes for him to leave the bathroom why not just go home and use your own once you’ve finished eating or grabbing a drink or whatever it is you’re doing on your way home from work?

Also I'm going to assume that you're privileged enough not to have ever worked a job in a late opening bar/restaurant/shopping centre/fast food outlet or similar OP. If you had, you'd know full well why staff have to spend a lot of time in or around the toilets.
Try going somewhere that the staff aren't visible and see how safe you feel then, or how clean and welcoming the facilities are!

JKR is that you?

Some people’s lives must be so devoid of excitement that they need to invent a threat every time they piss.

Would you actually say that to a cleaner though, in the wild? I’d say usually if someone is uncomfortable with a man being outside their cubicle while they wee, they are almost certainly uncomfortable with telling said man how they feel.

He does sounds like he is hanging around unnecessarily and more like a toilet attendant than a cleaner. I'd ask them why they have a male toilet attendant in a women's loo and say what he is doing.