AIBU to not invite my 20 year old son on a trip with his siblings?

[vhydr]

Long one, sorry.

Back in March I found out my husband was having an affair with a much younger colleague. 26 years together. I was devastated, still am honestly. We have four kids my eldest is a son, 20, then a son, 19, then a daughter, 17, and my youngest, a daughter, 15. I moved out with the younger three. My eldest son chose to stay with his dad.

I never wanted my kids to pick sides. But I won't lie, it stung. I expected a bit of loyalty, not because he owes me anything as his mother, but because his dad cheated on me and lied to my face for who knows how long. My eldest told me I was "breaking up the family" by leaving. That one really got me.

My other son and both daughters are angry at their dad too, but they came with me and we've been doing okay. Therapy, lots of time together, dinners, days out. Financially we're fine, both high earners, so at least that's not a factor.
My eldest tried reaching out a few times and I'll admit I went quiet on him for a bit. I wasn't ignoring him out of hate, I was just raw.

Then my younger daughter graduated last month and she chose not to invite her eldest brother, she invited their dad instead. He was hurt, said something angry to her, it turned into a whole sibling blowup, his brother and sister ganged up on him. It's been tense since.

He's told me he doesn't think he'll ever be okay if I date or remarry one day. Says he wants nothing to do with a "blended family." I'm not seeing anyone, not looking to either, but that's clearly already a fault line with him.

Last week I took my younger son and two daughters away for the summer, posted a few photos. He saw them and texted "you could have invited me mama, but it's okay, I'm not your son anymore because your actions are making sure of that. I feel like I have no family and everyone hates me, I'm the outsider."

That gutted me. He's still my son and I love him. But he's also an adult who chose to stay with the parent who broke this family, and I didn't think to include him this time given where things stand with his sisters.

So, AIBU?

"the situation seems to be pretty black and white" - that kind of immature thinking is exactly why it's such a mess.

Really? Almost narcissistic must be a typo, as is saying very entitled. It may be the lad was and is just overwhelmed, hurting and coming to terms with the devastating break up which isn’t OPs or any of the DCs fault. Doesn’t mean he has a serious MH problem and suggesting it puts the blame on him, imho.

When a parent cheats they don't just betray their spouse. The children in these situations are as much "victims" of the affair as the betrayed spouse is. Even more so if the fallout of the separation plays out like it has for this OPs family. This eldest sons life as he has known it has imploded, siblings moved with OP and still have a relationship with DF. Eldest son has been punished for the decision he made and as a result his mother ignored him when he reached out, his siblings may have followed OPs lead as highly likely OP has made her feelings on DS's "disloyalty" to her known to the younger children. How could he feel anything but a "victim" as you call it when absolutely none of this was his fault?!

It is extraordinary how many people do not realise that a cheater betrays the children just as much as their partner, and the shock and devastation is enormous.

The impact is horrendous and often life long.

Not really helpful at all. Villain. Ffs.

The villain is the father who has thrown everyone into this mess.

The op needs to reach out to her son and rebuild her relationship completely separately to what has happened.

horribly sad situation and if it blew up in March, only 5 months ago, so very raw still.

pointless re examining who was right and wrong in the past interactions. it doesn't matter really either.

if I were you I would reach out to your son and try and meet up. a hug, a kiss and take it from there.

you have 20 years of love, care and trust with each other. don't risk that just because your husband was a twat. the sooner you do it the better.

Lots of you are at fault in this mess.

Your ex chose to have an affair - we don’t know why and what your relationship was like prior to this - but he should have respected you as the mother of his kids enough to end it before embarking on the affair. As I say we don’t know the circumstances to say whether him ending the relationship was understandable.

Kids shouldn’t have to take sides. It is normal for them to love both parents equally. Your eldest stayed for possibly numerous reasons. He feels settled in his family home and didn’t want uprooting. His friends and work are close. He is attached to his room and the environment as a whole and didn’t like the alternative you were moving to. It may not have been him choosing his dad, but the security and comfort of his old life. Who knows, perhaps he decided to stay put in the hopes that you would be encouraged to return home and life would resume as normal. Illogical but it’s a possibility.

He took the massive step of reaching out to you (more than once!) and you ignored him?! You’re supposed to be his mother, and an adult with decades more life experience and wisdom behind you. He was more mature than you were. You could have at least told him you appreciated him getting in touch but you weren’t up to long communication right now. But you blanked him.

Your daughter not inviting him but inviting her dad WHO CHEATED and arguably caused the whole traumatic episode for you all is difficult to excuse or understand. If she was upset he hadn’t moved with you and stayed loyal to their dad, that’s one thing, but then she went and invited her dad, so how the hell did she justify that?!

You not inviting your eldest and labelling him an adult when he has a sibling just a year younger than him who is also an adult smacks of you making excuses to justify your treatment of him, which seems like deliberate punishment over his loyalty. You should have told him about the holiday and seen if he wanted to come as you’d presumably invited all his other siblings who are close in age despite the misleading title of your post. He had tried to reach out to you before so it wasn’t a case of him never communicating with you and cutting you out of his life - in fact it seems the opposite. You not only don’t invite him, you then POSTED PHOTOS of you and your other kids enjoying the holiday without him!!! What a thoughtless/ vindictive thing to do.

Him telling you he won’t accept you remarrying etc is neither here nor there at this point. It’s obv none of his business, and a bit rich considering his father’s behaviour, who is presumably in another relationship and your son has accepted this. Have you pointed this double standard out to him? It indicates he still sees you as his safe person in the family dynamics and doesn’t want your role to change or be affected by a new relationship. It is perhaps a childish view, but he is only 20, and a lot of adults still see their mums in that role for decades.

No one has covered themselves in glory here but it sounds as if your son needs you and him talking about your future relationships shows he is still deeply unsettled and needs you to provide him with some emotional security and warmth. I think he needs to be supported in getting some therapy/ counselling in order to process this situation as he seems to be the one most negatively affected by it from your account, although it would probably be extremely beneficial to you all.

When you left probably said that the siblings could stay with whomever they wanted and that it didn't matter.

This was a lie on your part and you are taking it out on your DS.

You need to come to terms with this.

He's told me he doesn't think he'll ever be okay if I date or remarry one day.

This again is fairly standard for any child that has goen through a divorce or even had a parent die.

He has tried to reconcile with you and you have thrown it back in his face.

You need to do something now beofre he gives up.

Yabu! Someone can be a shitty husband but a good dad. And also it is your and your ex relationship that has ended not the kids with their Dad. This happened to me as a kid but it was my stepdad who left my mum, he had been in my life since I was 2 until I was 19 but suddenly I was expected to cut all ties because he wasnt my real dad. I didnt at first and the emotional blackmail and manipulation I suffered from my mum and siblings affects me, and my relationship with them, still today.

I am sorry this happened to you, but please get therapy, rant to friends, go to a rage room, cry, scream into an empty field...whatever you need to do heal but dont take it out on your kids, force them to take sides or punish them for perceived disloyalty, you could damage them for life.

Some if what he has said is too much but he is barely an adult, troubled by the situation. You are his mum first, love him more than you hate you ex.

People often say it's possible to be a shitty husband but a good Dad, but that's not actually true. One of the big lessons Dad teaches DC, which Mum can't, is how women should be treated. He shows boys how they should behave towards their partners and he shows girls how they should expect to be treated (one of the reasons women often put up with repeated horrible men).

But, it's not OP's son's fault he had the example of a shitty father, and by withdrawing, she's "proving" his father right.

It may not be true in your experience but it is in mine! No parent is perfect, we all have our flaws and this is just one aspect of it. Not all shitty husbands are good fathers, not all shitty wives are good mums but some are.

But all fathers who treat their child's mother badly are teaching the child to either do or accept the same in their own adult lives. How does that equate with being a good Dad?

Agree. My only child, an adult son, treated me so badly that in the end we broke contact, instigated by him. It was very difficult at first but as he was an abuser I now feel more at peace without him.

Brilliant response 👍

Because its just one aspect of them, we are all flawed in some way, even you! Mumsnet is full of people saying they messed up and others saying they are not a bad person or bad mum, and its one aspect of their personality. We are human, by definition we are imperfect but that doesnt make us bad all round. He might be a good dad in other ways, and we dont know any if the background here either.

Just because your view is true for you, doesnt mean its true for everyone. My stepdad cheated but my mum.was very toxic. Her behaviour has had a far bigger impact on my life than his. Thats just the way it is

Your mum may have been toxic but you seem to be saying that your step dad cheating was an appropriate response. It isn’t. Admitting the relationship isn’t working, and leaving is. And no, we don’t know much about the background in OP’s case, except that it was her DH who cheated. Are you implying that she somehow deserved it ?

OP’s son is displaying disturbingly misogynistic behaviour - he’s chosen to live with his dad, is essentially ignoring the fact that his dad cheated, and is now blaming his mum for his dad’s behaviour, and the rest of his family for his own.

He’s stated he won’t tolerate OP dating or finding another partner now she and his dad have split, but he’s fine with a father who essentially did just that, inside his marriage.

I’m also wondering whether there wasn’t a controlling element to OP’s marriage because I find it hard to believe that his dad isn’t manipulating DS’s thinking so that he still has some control over OP through him, in which case it’s DS himself who is jeopardising his relationship with the rest of his family because in the end they will have no choice but to restrict or cut contact.

Wow thats a lot of assumptions in one post. Nowhere, I repeat nowhere, have I suggested that cheating was an appropriate response. In context I am simply saying that while he cheated, as an entirely separate thing my mum was toxic. Her behaviour throughout my whole childhood has been far more damaging to me than his cheating was. They are 2 separate things, I havent even said he cheated because she was toxic, he cheated because he was weak!

The OPs son is barely an adult and its very raw, we dont have enough information to say her ex was controlling or is controlling the son. When I split up with my kids dad they said they never wanted me to have a new relationship at the time, but it was a short lived reaction to the immediate situation.

Have a different opinion to me by all means but please dont invent things in your head and claim I have said them.

You have obviously not been treated like sh1t by any of your parents!

When DS went to live with his dad I don’t think OP expected him to subsequently tell her that she was the one who split up the family, and that he will never accept her dating or finding another partner. Forgive me, but isn’t that what his dad did ? l mean he was still married to OP at the time but he essentially found himself another woman and dated her. So fine for his dad, but not for his mum. OP hasn’t said whether he’s still seeing the affair partner, but if so, that’s off the scale hypocrisy.

I think dad is manipulating DS’s thinking. Possibly there was some element of control in the marriage and ex is trying to further that control via his son. And if that’s what’s happening and DS allows himself to be manipulated because he’s in thrall to his dad, then he only has himself to blame for the deterioration in his relationships with the rest of his family.

I haven’t invented anything in my head. I got that impression from what you said and the way you said it “My stepdad cheated but my mum was very toxic” reads as though cheating was somehow an acceptable response to her toxicity. I didn’t claim you had said anything, l simply asked the questions, which you have now clarified.

@vhydr

Unfortunately, as much as you’re hurting, it’s not your son’s fault & even though he’s been a bit of a dick, he’s still barely more than a kid & probably feels torn between his parents. You’re the adult here - as hard as it is, you definitely should have included him in a family holiday & made every effort to keep your kids clear of the fallout from your marriage breakup. You say you don’t blame him for staying with his dad but your actions show that you clearly do. From his point of view, he feels like you’ve shunned him & closed ranks with his siblings.

I meant to say by your children not parents but the system would not let me alter it!

I think you should have invited him, and I also think it was quite mean of your daughter to leave him out of her graduation.

I wouldn't put up with him saying he won't accept you dating, that needs shutting down asap, you need to tell him that he absolutely cannot dictate that to you and unfortunately his dad's infidelity does not mean that you have to be alone forever.

However, he is your son. He appears to be coping badly with everything that's happened and I don't think you ignoring him or not inviting him on holiday is going to help matters. You need to try and make amends here for your wrongdoing, that doesn't mean that he gets to dictate anything to you but you can't leave one child out in this way.

He stayed behind so his dad wasn’t alone. It isn’t about it taking sides. You are the grown up, disgraceful that the children have had their sibling relationship destroyed.
I would have understood and not allowed the others fall out with him. He stayed in his home.

Thank you for acknowledging that you misinterpreted my post and concluded something I definitely did not say.