AIBU to not invite my 20 year old son on a trip with his siblings?

[vhydr]

Long one, sorry.

Back in March I found out my husband was having an affair with a much younger colleague. 26 years together. I was devastated, still am honestly. We have four kids my eldest is a son, 20, then a son, 19, then a daughter, 17, and my youngest, a daughter, 15. I moved out with the younger three. My eldest son chose to stay with his dad.

I never wanted my kids to pick sides. But I won't lie, it stung. I expected a bit of loyalty, not because he owes me anything as his mother, but because his dad cheated on me and lied to my face for who knows how long. My eldest told me I was "breaking up the family" by leaving. That one really got me.

My other son and both daughters are angry at their dad too, but they came with me and we've been doing okay. Therapy, lots of time together, dinners, days out. Financially we're fine, both high earners, so at least that's not a factor.
My eldest tried reaching out a few times and I'll admit I went quiet on him for a bit. I wasn't ignoring him out of hate, I was just raw.

Then my younger daughter graduated last month and she chose not to invite her eldest brother, she invited their dad instead. He was hurt, said something angry to her, it turned into a whole sibling blowup, his brother and sister ganged up on him. It's been tense since.

He's told me he doesn't think he'll ever be okay if I date or remarry one day. Says he wants nothing to do with a "blended family." I'm not seeing anyone, not looking to either, but that's clearly already a fault line with him.

Last week I took my younger son and two daughters away for the summer, posted a few photos. He saw them and texted "you could have invited me mama, but it's okay, I'm not your son anymore because your actions are making sure of that. I feel like I have no family and everyone hates me, I'm the outsider."

That gutted me. He's still my son and I love him. But he's also an adult who chose to stay with the parent who broke this family, and I didn't think to include him this time given where things stand with his sisters.

So, AIBU?

This is your child. He's an adult, but a very young one and he remains your child.

"he's an adult who chose to stay with the parent who broke this family"... That's a cold fucking judgement of your 20 year old son who is part of that broken family. No wonder he feels he's not your son any more, no wonder he feels like he has no family and everyone hates him, no wonder he feels like the outsider.

You say you didn't want him to pick sides but everything else you write suggests you did in fact want that. Because look- he didn't pick your side and you are stung at his lack of loyalty, you ignored him when he reached out to you repeatedly, you didn't encourage your daughter to invite him to graduation even though she was inviting the actual person who cheated on you and broke the family up, you know his siblings ganged up on him but don't seem to have done anything to address that, and you didn't invite him on holiday with the rest of your kids (the ones who did pick the right side).

Your ex is the bastard here (yet he still gets invited to the graduation, hmm). Your son is not. Yes, yabu. And you need to fix it.

You do all realise that OP hasn't bothered coming back to respond to the - as of now - 400 replies?

Was there meant to be more to this post?

It's all very well to say 'you should have...' but the OP was reeling from having her life blown up at the time. That was compounded by her grown son telling her that this was all HER fault and that she should then sacrifice the rest of her life in devotion to her children and never move on. No wonder she cut off the ridiculous man for a bit. I have children the same age and there's no way they'd act like that - he's far too old to be like an 5 year old shouting 'I don't want a new daddy'. As the adult, op, you'll have to be the bigger person and make the first move, but that's all you owe him. He's old enough to know that while he'll always be your son, you are not an emotional punchbag, especially when you're at your limit.

No but he has said he blames his Mum for "breaking up the family", kind of tells you you he's not blaming his Dad doesn't it, the one who actually had the affair. 🙄

My eldest told me I was "breaking up the family" by leaving. That one really got me.

This is what this adult man, regardless of how much you all want to infantalise him, said to his mother who was cheated on.

My eldest tried reaching out a few times and I'll admit I went quiet on him for a bit. I wasn't ignoring him out of hate, I was just raw.

OP committed the unforgivable sin of taking some time when she was feeling raw after her world imploded and her ADULT son blamed her for breaking up the family.

He was hurt, said something angry to her, it turned into a whole sibling blowup, his brother and sister ganged up on him.

These are adults and late teenagers. They had a fight separate to OP's relationship with the eldest son being the common denominator.

He's told me he doesn't think he'll ever be okay if I date or remarry one day. Says he wants nothing to do with a "blended family." I'm not seeing anyone, not looking to either, but that's clearly already a fault line with him.

This is controlling and weird and was an absolutely unnecessary stick to beat his mother with.

I'm not your son anymore because your actions are making sure of that.

This is emotional manipulation 101 and hugely problematic. Absolving himself of all wrongdoing and making everything his mother's fault.

I have a twenty-year-old son and a sixteen-year-old son and I have spent time researching the manosphere and its chokehold on your men. I work in a field that directly correlates to it. And I am telling you right now, this has red flags ALL over it.

More importantly, at least in regard to this thread, the posters are GLARING red flags for the deeply misogynistic women who are raising these men to be like this. They (you) cause untold damage. You need to work on yourselves and your attitudes toward the men you're raising before inflicting them on the world.

No, it doesn’t. It doesn’t tell you that he doesn’t blame his father, or that he hasn’t said far worse to him.

He said a thoughtless comment at a time when he was desperately trying to keep his family together. Was it emotionally mature? No, but then he’s 20 years old and watching the life he always knew fall apart. He may have just been hurting and lashing out, not actually even meaning it.

You didn’t play this well OP. The shit your oldest son said about your future and meeting someone is irrelevant and noise.

I would have invited him on the holiday - there was no benefit to you to not extend the invite.
No idea why he was excluded from the graduation either. That’s picking on the wrong guy.

My eldest tried reaching out a few times and I'll admit I went quiet on him for a bit. I wasn't ignoring him out of hate, I was just raw.

That was probably a mistake TBH.

You risk losing him - his dad cheating is not on him. He's lost his stable family as well.

So while I think it's normal to be hurt with him choosing his Dad by staying and accusing you of breaking up the family - I think you do need to seperate him from his Dads actions.

Surely you'd text back along lines - you are my son I love you. Ex cheating for so long has really damaged/upset me and I've needed time. Some of your comments since TBH have been extremely hurtful. I didn't ask you on hoilday because I don't think you and I or your sisters are in a good place and hoilday wasn't time to sort it - and see where that lands.

His relationship with his dad is seperate to yours to him and yours to ex and I think you haven't been acting like that despite saying you never wanted sides picked and I think your other kids may be following your lead - possible as they fear you reacting badly to them if they show disloyalty - which isn't fair and long term may damage all your relationships with them and each other.

You are not covering yourself in glory here. Be a bigger person.

20 year old boys are a bit stupid, they are emotionally immature. Tell him you love him, tell him you want a relationship with him. Say that you all have work to do to on your relationships with each other ( as in him you and siblings) but that you want to. Arrange to meet him for a coffee (or food -that always works with young men). Apologise for going cold on him - that was wrong and don't do it again. But most of all let him know he is loved and your door is always open.Don't discuss having new relationships - unless you are charging into one straightaway it is irrelevant. You've made your decision about leaving, he's an adult, you dont owe him an explanation - just move on from it. Stop holding a grudge because he stayed with his dad. These things are never easy for children of the marriage, whatever age they are.

You went away and didn’t tell him? Left him out without a warning and he found out on social media? I am appalled. 20 is still young. You are punishing him for what his dad did. I am so sorry for your son.

I think OP's gone. Having given us all very little to go on really - a lot of stuff in her post doesn't make sense and requires more explanation.

As it doesn't look like that will be forthcoming, I suggest we may as well all leave it here?

Well said.

So he's not OK with you hypothetically meeting a new partner WELL after divorcing his dad but he's OK with his dad finding a new partner WHILST STILL MARRIED to his mum?!? Your DS has messed up priorities and honestly he wants his cake and to eat it. He wants to choose his cheating scumbag of a dad AND play happy families with his morally superior siblings and mum. I get you're torn and I'm sure I would be in your situation as you love your children equally. But he is definitely being unreasonable.

Have you had the opportunity to talk 1:1 with him about it since it all happened?

I'm actually finding it fascinating listening to the posters that are so lacking in empathy that they think ostracising a 20 year old and irrevocably destroying a relationship with him is the right course of action.

I cannot fathom how anyone would contemplate cutting off their own child and not maintaining a relationship with them (unless they had no choice for safety reasons etc).

But I'm equally fascinated by the posters who seem to think it is ok for a 20 year old man to make misogynistic and controlling comments towards his own mother with absolute impunity.

Surely there is a middle ground in which you strive to maintain the relationship while making it clear that certain comments and behaviours are neither reasonable nor acceptable?

I completely agree - but ignoring his attempts to reach out, excluding him from holiday and posting about it on social media is not the middle ground.

You need to talk to him adult to adult.
Tell him that when he chose to stay with his dad you didn't handle it well as you wanted him to come with you. That you were wrong to ignore his attempts to reach out and that you acted from emotion and regret it.
That you love him and want him in your life, but the rift with his siblings mean family trips wouldn't work just now, but you'd love to do something with him alone.
That you're not in a relationship but can't tell him you're going to rule that out for the rest of your life because it wasn't your choice that your marriage broke up and you shouldn't need to stop your life. And if that should happen it need not effect him, as he's an adult man living his own life in a seperate home, and obviously won't be expected to play happy families like a child.

The OP has already acknowledged that it wasn't right to ignore his attempts to reach out. She recognises that this was wrong, but has clarified that it was due to her own mental state at the time rather than any desire to punish.

Re the holiday. I don't know if a non-resident adult child who has made some pretty shitty remarks to his mother and then fallen out with all of his siblings should automatically expect to be included on a trip away?

The OP needs to reach out and try to build bridges now. This young man is still her son and he is not responsible for his father's infidelity. He was obviously distressed by the collapse of his parents' marriage and perhaps he wasn't thinking straight. But he is still responsible for his own behaviour and for the things which he said, and I'm astonished at how many people seem so eager to dismiss his remarks as if they are no big deal.

We don’t really know his comments were misogynistic? We don’t know that he hasn’t said to his dad he’d never be able to handle another woman in his dad’s life or a blended family on that side. There’s a lot of information missing here and the OP is written from a very defensive point of view.

A young person whose parents split acrimoniously lashed out. Yes it was inappropriate but the only family unit he’d ever known was ending.
This young person showed the strength to reach out, and was rebuffed.

Yes, you are hurting, but you are the adult. You are the parent. Show all your kids the strength of admitting when you are wrong, apologise and rebuild th3 relationship. They may learn a valuable lesson that it’s ok not to win every argument. It can be very mature to show some weakness.

You are being utterly unreasonable. your 19yr old is also an adult, he got to go?

punishing your child for choosing to live with his dad, he has clearly been telling you how much he is struggling with the break up from what you are saying.

instead of showing him love you exclude him.

He chose to stay with his dad and you are punishing him for it. Maybe he felt sorry for his dad being left alone, or perhaps it was for practical reasons. You seem to switch between your reasons for excluding him. One minute its because he's an adult, then you throw up that he chose to stay with his dad. His sister not inviting him to her graduation was hurtful and makes no sense, especially as she invited her dad. So she punishes him too. Did you challenge her on this or just let it slide? I'm not sure why you're surprised that he feels excluded. Also be careful with your other three children. Right now they live with you, but they should be able to have a relationship with their dad. In their shoes, watching the way you have turned against their brother, they won't be able to do that comfortably. I know you're hurting but your behaviour towards your son is cruel. Does he remind you of his father?

Perhaps he said that to his dad, or perhaps he didn't. We don't know.

What we do know is that he chose to carry on living with his dad despite knowing that his dad already had another woman in his life, while telling his mother that he would never be ok with the idea of her dating again. And we also know that he explicitly laid the blame for breaking up the family on his mother, because she was unwilling to tolerate his father's infidelity, rather than on his father for having been unfaithful in the first place.

Maybe you don't see those signs as red flags for misogyny. Respectfully, I disagree. I think it's there, loud and clear.