To be disappointed that my ds has decided not to go to uni.

[Fearandanxiety]

Ds is 19 years old and has been on a GAP year and has worked full time in a pub and had a few holidays. He has a place at uni starting this September to study business management. He has started to get cold feet and said it was due to the amount of debt he would get from being at uni, but I think his girlfriend has been putting pressure on him not to go. My parents have offered to pay his tuition fees which is incredibly generous but he has decided today not to go. He has no alternative long term plan and I’m trying hard to hide how disappointed I am. I really think he has a fantastic opportunity and I feel sad that his girlfriend has persuaded him not to go. She isn’t academic and is content for them to carry on working locally and move into together. Aibu?

OP sorry to de rail- as you were, everyone!

Absolutely agree. I wanted to comment on this thread last night when it was posted but annoyingly lost internet connection.

I went to Uni before the tuition fees became a thing, when I returned for a post-grad, the subject was free due to a shortage of that profession. Despite having a degree and a post-grad, I was paid a pittance when I first left Uni. It took years before I managed to get a decent income.

If I'd have had to pay tens of thousands to go, it absolutely would not have been worth it at all.

My mum really pushed all of us (me & siblings) to get degrees, she's of that mind that it's the be all and end all. And whilst I agree that some careers really do need degrees, the majority really don't. Universities are just money making businesses and have been for about 20yrs now.

I really hope my children don't want to go to Uni, I don't think they will.

For OP's son, he'd be much better going to a local college and doing a BTEC in Business Management, it might not be free anymore due to his age, depending when he turns 20, but if his grandparents are paying the tuition fees, then that's absolutely the best route.

So many people were commenting on this thread saying that it's free & he should go, but it wasn't free, his grandparents were only going to pay the tuition fees, what about the accommodation fees and everything else?! It's not cheap!

I think OP is being unreasonable to feel like this over a business management degree - I could understand her upset if he was giving up his place on a medical degree - but business? No, a degree isn't necessary. Business is one of those things that you're better learning it on the job, obviously some people are much better at it than others, a college course would give him a good start with the background knowledge but even that isn't entirely necessary.

I am wondering what people think for degrees for teacher training- usually for secondary you would.need a degree in the subject?

This is just in response to the idea that Uni degrees are useless

And to all of you who said..oh later in life it was okay...who do you think are doing and teaching these programmes ? It's fine to think "it's always there' but not unless we support it!!

A plumber has become an MP so it’s not impossible.

Look it all depends what you study, where it is and what your plan is after. There probably is very little value add going to Liverpool hope, Hull and studying a Mickey mouse degree.

But a stem degree in physics from Imperial probably opens numerous doors into exciting careers.

Sure but PM? We know Count Binface ran for MP

And.with not disrespect there might be skills beyond plumbing for PM?

This is just an example that maybe not every path is for everyone?

Reading this thread I would rather be a plumber! Flexibility in hours

Whereas many of us (myself included) would go absolutely demented sitting 8 hrs a day at a desk talking shop. I'd rather be out on the move doing stuff as a career path. Glad we are all different...

I think I've been way over the top here. She needs not need to go to uni. But she should have made a good attempt at GCSEs. Maths, english and a few sciences would be enough. Just getting out with 1 pass isn't a great sign. However life is long, she needs to have a bit of a reset and think about her next steps. And she needs to work hard at that

I was very academic, but I still wouldn't go due to the amount of debt involvred unless it was a subject with a defined career path. Business mansagement is particularly nebulous- why not just go into a starter job in a company-post room or whatever and work your way from there?

I cant believe people are saying BM degrees are worthless. You're very wrong. It's a facilitating degree and looked on very favourably for those wanting to get into IT Sales, Recruitment, Marketing etc. Not everyone's cup of tea but outside super academic maths/economics/law grads where you need very high grades and impressive internships organised through parental contacts, these are the jobs where 25y olds can earn 3 figures, with commission. I work with these guys and the successful ones can be earning half a million a year by the time they are 30, student loan long paid off. Your son is being very short sighted I'm afraid (if money is a prime motivator which it seems to be from the loans fear).

If he's not enthused by the subject itself, and doesn't really have a plan, he'd likely be better off to work for a while.

You can gain a lot of skills working that are missing from many graduates and will give him a real edge. And he may find there are areas he is interested in he doesn't know about now.

A lot? Not according to the average wage analysis that I have read relating to graduates. Or there are an equal number of grads earning almost nothing. I know a lot of graduates earning 30-40k a year (significantly less than my son) and none earning anything near 6 figures. Or anything like that. I would check your research.

It depends. My son is not going to university. He’s going to get apprenticeship as a business analyst instead of him getting debt in the same field

He could go to uni later on in life. I know someone who didn't go when younger, they were clever and eventually went about 24 years old and now have a good job.

Have you checked the lifetime earnings stats? They often tell a different story.

He's got a good point. If he wants to study business management then get him working in a business. No debt and tonnes of experience to boot.

McDonald's is (at least, used to be) a great place to be fast-tracked to a managerial position.

If I was 18 now there is no way I would even be considering university. I would have a plan though for how to start a career.

Many universities in my opinion are barely worth the name, even before you consider a lifetime of debt.

If I was the OP it would be the lack of a plan that would concern me.

@trueredstart Jobs are difficult to get these days. He’s got work experience but not necessarily the right skills and no qualifications for any job in business. So getting a suitable training job could be very difficult.

Universities are not all equal. If he’s got a place at a top one, going to uni could still give him a degree earnings premium. Going to a lowly one, maybe not. This is what needs weighing up. At the moment a basic job might not lead anywhere.

@LaurmolonlabeWhat debt? Low earnings = no debt. It’s not a bank loan and vast numbers of grads don’t repay it and are not required to do so. Very low repayments are made even in decent jobs and maybe even next to none for years. Very high earners pay off the loan quickly - it’s the middle earners who don’t. Grads need to aim high and then it’s worth it but the competition for those jobs is fierce. Students need to understand that the student loan is not a debt that must be repaid.

No - because that is not relevant to this discussion - things have changed over the past 30 years.

Lifetime earning stats are relevant but we know better degrees from better unis pay grads better. Eg LSE degrees are worth more than Bucks uni degrees or Wolverhampton degrees. We know what subjects are more likely to produce a grad premium - medicine, economics, dentistry, physics, engineering - mostly stem but law is in the mix too as is business. Where you go matters a lot. What you study matters even more. Arts and English showing no grad premium at all. The IFS has studied all of this fairly recently.

Sure. But there are many job roles that are still only open to graduates. Many of these are the higher paying ones. Your son has taken an equivalent apprenticeship route, which is great, but that's not the case for the OPs son at the moment. IMO yp need either to be doing a degree or on a recognised apprenticeship scheme with training by early 20s, or they just drift around labouring and working in bars on minimum wage. Which is fine when you're in your twenties. Not so much when you still only have these options in your forties and fifties.

As a 23 yr old who had 2 years out, went to uni because I felt my parents wanted me to and dropped out after 3 months because I just didn’t want to be there don’t pressure him to go.
A degree these days isn’t what it used to be, other than specific degrees that lead to specific jobs.
All of my school friends went to uni and most graduated last year and so many of them struggled to find a job at all let alone a well paid graduate job.
They all had a fab time at uni socially and see it as some of their best years but I also see the last 5 years as some of my best years too. I’ve worked, made friends, had so many experiences even in situations where I didn’t think I would.
Now, for the first time since I was 18, i actually have found myself WANTING to do a degree. I’ve figured out what i like, learned about different jobs in the world and am looking at beginning study with drive because i actually want to do it. On top of that, I’ll be doing a degree I actually have an interest in and could see contributing to my life because I know what I find interesting and what’s worth spending money on. If he had a serious interest in his choice/ saw a reason to be interested I’d say he’d want to go.
Sure, I’m only 23 and have absolutely not got my life worked out, loads of money or any clue where life will actually take me but I do know I didn’t waste tens of thousands on a degree I didn’t actually really want to do or try for. Instead I have gained skills I can use in my career whatever I choose, earned some money, worked abroad and enjoyed life.
I wasn’t ready to go to uni when I went the first time- perhaps he’s like me and there is more to it than you may see.
I never told my parents that I couldn’t face the thought of the burn out I got at school again and that I just needed a break from school. They just saw it as “she’s having fun doing a job that’s not gonna use her brain and being difficult by not going”.
They see my point now and back me every step of the way. Uni isn’t just for 18 yr olds, it’s an investment and if I ever have children I will encourage them not to do a degree until they feel ready to try and genuinely interested to learn.

@CAG2003 So a degree from LSE, Oxbridge or a business degree from Bath isn’t worth a having? I think they are and are what they were. Where the difficulty lies is that the less good universities sell themselves to students but fail to say what their students are actually doing afterwards in any detail. It makes students think all degrees are equal whereas they patently are not. Just because grads cannot get jobs, don’t think it’s easier for 18 year old school leavers - it is not.

I think an economics degree at bath is better