To be disappointed that my ds has decided not to go to uni.

[Fearandanxiety]

Ds is 19 years old and has been on a GAP year and has worked full time in a pub and had a few holidays. He has a place at uni starting this September to study business management. He has started to get cold feet and said it was due to the amount of debt he would get from being at uni, but I think his girlfriend has been putting pressure on him not to go. My parents have offered to pay his tuition fees which is incredibly generous but he has decided today not to go. He has no alternative long term plan and I’m trying hard to hide how disappointed I am. I really think he has a fantastic opportunity and I feel sad that his girlfriend has persuaded him not to go. She isn’t academic and is content for them to carry on working locally and move into together. Aibu?

Students from all courses do placement years. Anyone can choose it as an option at my institution.

and it’s not a random year off- students that do a placement year have a 20% higher chance of getting a grad job at the end. Many get offered a job after while
on their placement year.

I had a criminology student do a placement year at L’Oréal last year, a maths student did one in the Civil service social research department. Students do all kinds of things and it’s anything but black and white. 80% of grad recruiters will take students from any discipline.

I agree. Most European countries have a similar level of graduates as we have. Any mention of University and there are people saying ' Why not become a plumber instead? We need those!' 60% of young people don't go to University. How is it helping them to tell some kid who doesn't want to be a plumber and has potential to do other things that they should compete with someone who does not have the chance to go to University? Why are we not concentrating on the 60% who don't go to University, haven't done education past L2 and desperately need routes into fulfilling careers? The ' hundreds: of apprenticeships are dependent on where you live. A young person either has to get an apprenticeship near where their parents live or find somewhere to live, unsupported in a new city which they can afford on an apprenticeship wage while working 4 days a week and studying on top. The dismissal of education in this country runs very deep and is a reason why we don't progress. Its cultural.

My son has just hit his mid 20s. He left grammar school after getting 13 GCSEs and decided to do a business course at college instead of a levels. I was disappointed, but he was very lazy at school so I knew that a levels would have been tough on both of us ... He did 70% of the two year course at college, then left and got himself an apprenticeship at an accountancy firm. During covid he left and got another apprenticeship at a public sector organisation who paid for him to do his accountancy exams (and also paid an extremely good salary). He has worked his way up in the organisation and has recently been promoted (after interview - it is public sector after all ...) to be the manager of a 7 person team within the finance division. He bought his own flat aged 20, and aged 23 bought his first house (4 bed in south east of England) with his girlfriend. His friends who went to uni are still living at home and struggling to find a job (any job). So although I was disappointed at the time, he absolutely made the correct choice for him - maybe your son is doing the same. My son's approach to life changed completely once he was out of the education environment, and was immediately hardworking and conscientious!

But this isn't just impacting graduates. My daughter left 6th form with good grades last year, she wasn't going to uni until she realised how competitive and difficult it is for school leavers to get jobs around here. To be honest I'm relieved for her she will leave this town and spend the next three years studying in a place she really loves. There is also a group from her 6th form who left last year and are going to uni this year after being disillusioned about all these opportunities for them. We don't just have an increase in graduates, now children have to stay in education until there 18yrs there is a school leavers problem.

I'm also looking for a new role and have seen a huge spike in requests for degrees at all levels of jobs. The job market is difficult at the moment for everyone.

But that's ok as long as they are in roles. Lots of people do just go straight into the workplace after uni and not specific grad roles.

"The students I work with from around the world- multiple countries- aren’t like this"

I would suggest that this is because they come from very rich families and mummy and daddy (or somebody else anyway) are paying the full fees upfront.

The tuition fee for a UK student is currently £9,790 per year and that does not need to start to be repaid until the student has graduated and is earning more than £25,000 per year.

In contrast, I just had a quick look at the fees charged to overseas students by the university that I went to forty years ago.

These start at £32,000 per year for some arts and humanities subjects eg English and History.

Economics, Geography, Archaeology etc cost £39,200 per year

Fine Art costs £42,700 per year as does Engineering (and their Management courses as well). All their science and maths courses also cost this much

Computer Science costs £46,700

.

These are just the teaching fees - paying for accommodation is on top of that.

So mummy and daddy (or somebody else) are paying upwards of £100,000 in tuition fees upfront.

Overseas students are a very different cohort from UK students. I'm really surprised that you have never noticed that.

He still needs a career with prospects or an apprenticeship. University isn’t for everyone but he needs to make every effort to find a career with prospects.
He may ‘grow out’ of girlfriend eventually.

I agree.
Where I am from, all of my friends have degrees, and barely any of them work in the field they studied. Not once have I heard people say that their degrees are useless or ask what the point of them was. In the UK, people look down on educated people, when it should be the opposite.

Yes, it is very hard out there. I see it every day: young people with master’s degrees getting rejected from minimum-wage jobs, and students who have volunteered for years hoping to get a job still not getting the opportunity.

That being said, it will be even harder today if you don’t have a goal or a plan. Thirty years ago, it might not have been such a problem to take a few years off or figure things out later. Today, the situation is different.
Where I work, the institution would not even consider anyone who has taken years out from education or relevant experience.

This. I am actually encouraging my children NOT to go to university unless they want a career which can only be accessed via a degree. But if they want to be say an accountant, they can now do this as an apprenticeship, same with being a solicitor etc.

I really don’t understand the issue with student loans in the UK. You take one out and pay it back when you receive a salary above a certain amount. Having a few hundred pounds deducted monthly isn’t a bad thing, especially if you would not have got that job without the degree.

Where I am from, my country doesn’t care if you have a job or not: you have to pay it back straight away.

I think UK students have it very good compared with other countries, yet people are obsessed with the “idea of paying back the money” and see it as something negative.

And in terms of the “daddy is paying” argument for living costs — students still can and should work alongside their studies. They can take on a part-time job, such as bartending. I don’t understand why people assume that working and studying at the same time is impossible.

Tuition fees paid are one thing, he was very lucky to have that offer and very generous of your family. How was he going to fund accommodation, food and other living expenses? A part time job helps, but depending on location he could still have ended up with a lot of debt.

What was his plan post uni? Did he know what industry/career he wanted? There are many ways he could still be successful career wise if that's what he wants. Business Management isn't a professional degree that is required in order to enter a specific career, like medicine or law.

He could also look at part time/distance courses like Open University whilst working. If he still has the offer of fees paid, and he can work full time alongside whilst living where he wants to.

He has just made a big life choice, so maybe give him a day or two, then just help him as he needs for his new plan/direction. He is still young, obviously intelligent to get the offer, so has lots of time and opportunities

It will be a difficult conversation, but he needs to make sure she doesn't get pregnant.

Again, not true. Students from
places like India often dont come from wealthy backgrounds at all. Lots are Chevening scholars or are funded by their governments. And I don’t nescessarily agree with the international student cash cow situation either. A lot self fund masters courses after 20 year careers in the UN or business orgs. It’s an enormous mix.

But the majority aren’t anything like you say at all. Most want to improve themselves and see education as a way to do that.

We also get plenty of European students on study abroad programmes, cultural exchanges and now probably Erasmus programmes.

Please don’t patronise me - your post speaks more about your own assumptions of International students.

If it makes you feel any better OP my nephew is working in a pub too. He has recently graduated from Imperial with a first class degree. The other difference is he has a huge debt to pay off.

Not unreasonable to be disappointed, but in his life , it’s his mistake to make . Many people go on to do really well without Uni.. the richest guys I know never went to university, and two left school at 16 with a couple of O levels, one left after A levels. I don’t know about the others. But then, you didn’t need a piece of paper for everything. My eldest son is happy, makes a good living, left school at 16 to my disappointment, but can work anywhere, is in demand in his industry . Gets his bits of paper as he goes along , renewing them as necessary.
So there’s always hope.

I also know a girl who went to work, changing her mind about uni. Now as her pals are leaving uni and struggling to find work, she’s jet setting around the world in a different country every couple of months. University is not the be all and end all.

There is no point in him going to uni if he has reservations about it. He would incur massive debt when his heart was not in it.

It might be worth paying to get some good careers advice to get a proper picture of what his options might be.

All 3 of my DDs have degrees - none of them use the subject in their careers.

Not in my example, thankfully, but yes, I can see why lots of people are put off by the debt, especially when the degree doesn’t necessarily guarantee a job at the end of it.

But let's not forget the flip side - there are also lots of graduates earning well over six figure salaries by their mid twenties who walked into a high paying job straight after finishing their degree.

It is his life and his choice, and he can always go in the future if he wants to.

He does need to have a plan though.

I told DD that the one option she does not have, is to do nothing. So if she doesn't go to Uni (her current choice), she needs to look for full time work or an apprenticeship in something.

I hear this all the time. Imagine being bright and wanting to study further after school, be with people your own age and see what uni is like and then your parents telling you there is nothing wrong with living at home and doing an apprenticeship in your local town never did them any harm. I feel really sorry for some kids that life has become so limiting.

I think its because graduates dont get such a premium now and not all graduates get graduate work, so some people (not all) are doing the exact job they would have done without the degree but are paying 9% tax over 25k or others are earning the same they would have earned but just a different field

They therefore have less money in thier pocket than they would have done. Which is fine if you valued your experience and felt it was worth paying £100 a month for the rest of your working life for it, but in other ways a couple of hundred a month when you have a mortgage and nursery fees might sting when your colleage doesnt have that payment.

Its great if you get a job you couldnt have done in a field you love as you might feel that was worth paying to enter, or if you earn way more than you would have, but that's not everyone's experience.

I'd be gutted too, OP. I was never supported/actively sabotaged when trying to gain my education when I young and it has impacted my life and confidence since.

ETA I'm going back to school in Sept at 40 as my youngest DC starts reception. It's never too late!

There’s been some pretty mean comments on here about people who don’t go to university. Some people will choose to work, get a house, remain in the town they grew up in. I think it’s unfair to suggest it’s boring or not ambitious. They might have strong ties to their community, they might spend time gaining new experiences and travelling. My DH has always pretty much lived in the area we grew up in, whereas I’ve moved around a lot. He likes it here. He didn’t go to university, did professional qualifications and is now CEO of a business in our local city. He’s climbed the ranks and we’ve travelled.

The university route isn’t for everyone. You can still educate yourself, surely that’s what industry qualifications are? It’s not all or nothing. For some people it’s the right road, for others they might want to learn via working. Some might go to university later on.

I went to university 20 years ago and the landscape has changed a lot regarding employment when you finish. Not to mention for a lot of young people, there’s a lot of debt attached to them.

OP, maybe your son is tired of academic learning, maybe he wants to work for a while. Whilst the offer of his grandparents paying the tuition fees is very kind, your ds would still have debt from accommodation and living costs. My ds is 17 and he’s getting bored of college. He works hard but doesn’t particularly want to go to university because he’s not particularly passionate about any subject. He also has grandparents that would pay his tuition. I worry he’ll feel he’s missed out on the experience but ultimately it’s his life. I won’t be the one in lectures or completing assignments. He’s got a part time job locally and once he finishes college, he’ll continue that and look for full time work. Not every young person has a specific plan even those who go to university. They may go because they like a subject.

I value education but can appreciate that education comes in many forms. It isn’t always found just in a lecture hall.

It is very sad to see that this is how people think. If people don’t believe that gaining knowledge and educating yourself count as valuable experience, then we are in serious trouble as a society.

Young people have no problem spending money on the latest iPhones, Starbucks, and vapes, but somehow a £100 deduction a month towards their education and future is seen as unacceptable. The priorities are completely backwards.

Until recently, as part of my role, I recruited for a small business - mainly for junior roles in event management, sales and marketing. I never specified the need for a degree because there wasn't one, but when graduates did apply, it didn't matter at all what their degree was. If I liked their CV and covering letter, a History graduate was as likely to get an interview as someone with a degree in Event Management. There's a lot to be said for doing a degree in a subject you love and being able to speak passionately about your choice (and I speak as someone who was heavily persuaded, many years ago, to do a "useful" degree. I hated it and have never used it).